Andrew Carleton

Discussion in 'Youth National Teams' started by ielag, Jul 8, 2018.

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  1. Dirt McGirt

    Dirt McGirt Member+

    Jun 20, 2005
    Phoenix, AZ
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Somebody please explain how this is a "mess of Atlanta's doing".

    At this point if AC has a Freddy Adu level career it would be a huge achievement.
     
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  2. bshredder

    bshredder BigSoccer Supporter

    Feb 23, 1999
    Club:
    Millwall FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The word I've heard from a few different people is that Atlanta tried to trade him a couple of different times but couldn't find takers.

    Columbus wanted nothing to do with im when Atlanta propsed him as part of the Meram deal back in May.
     
  3. Patrick167

    Patrick167 Member+

    Dortmund
    United States
    May 4, 2017
    Andrew is the perfect player for FC Helsingor; the team bought by that American to develop American talent. Atlanta should do the kid a solid, as it looks like they've ruined him among others, and let him walk. Andrew should then sign with Helsingor and get that team promoted.

    He is still young. But Atlanta is just not the place to go to develop as a 16 yo. Bello only gets worse the longer he is with Atlanta. Goslin is gone, Kunga is gone. Carleton is on life support.

    Blah, Blah, attitude. Again, how would your attitude be if you were promised one thing then basically left out with the trash.
     
  4. bpet15

    bpet15 Member+

    Oct 4, 2016
    I doubt very seriously that American is going to want Carleton in his venture. He is a business man and a very astute one at that. He has a well defined plan and I don't think Carleton fits their player profile.

    Also, Carleton doesn't exactly strike me as the type that would take a huge pay cut just so he can go and prove himself. I could be wrong though.
     
  5. TimB4Last

    TimB4Last Member+

    May 5, 2006
    Dystopia
    #2105 TimB4Last, Nov 7, 2019
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2019
    Well, let's hope you're wrong. Carleton needs to push the rest button ASAP.

    Edit: Make that reset button ... or not.
     
  6. bshredder

    bshredder BigSoccer Supporter

    Feb 23, 1999
    Club:
    Millwall FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    No.. I think he's pushed the "rest" button enough
     
  7. Patrick167

    Patrick167 Member+

    Dortmund
    United States
    May 4, 2017
    The 2nd tier of Denmark couldn't use a player with potential and some obvious skill? It seems perfect to me. If they can get him right, they can sell him on.

    What pay cut? The scenario in question is AC is out of contract and no MLS team wants him. If he can sign with Cinncy or Miami, fine. I doubt they would give him more than minimum.
     
  8. TimB4Last

    TimB4Last Member+

    May 5, 2006
    Dystopia
    Sweet. Got what I deserve for posting from my phone, which I rarely do. How I wish rest for reset had been intentional.
     
  9. bpet15

    bpet15 Member+

    Oct 4, 2016
    Ask yourself that question again in regards to Carleton. What player profile do you think is most abundant in the 2nd tier in Denmark? These are guys who are on little money, but most with a burning desire to move up the professional ladder.

    Carleton was in a first team environment, in a league that is superior to the Danish 2nd tier and seemingly didn't show the desire or quality to get into the team. What personality trait has he demonstrated to you that makes you think he is the type of player to move to Denmark, play in the 2nd tier and work his ass off to get to the next level?
     
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  10. butters59

    butters59 Member+

    Feb 22, 2013
    Why all this panic all of a sudden? I thought that he finally got a very good streak dominating USL. No?
     
  11. Patrick167

    Patrick167 Member+

    Dortmund
    United States
    May 4, 2017
    He didn't work his ass off to get a HG contract or make the U17 YNT?

    Come on. Everyone here acts like they are this kid's personal friend. Do you really have any idea what has been happening? I can assume lots of things too.

    I didn't think Ian Harkes had any ambition when he played 4 years of college ball. But then he went to the 2nd Divsion of Scotland. Who knows, maybe 20, getting paid to live in Europe for a few years sounds like fun.

    I would hardly call Atlanta 2, cobbled together out of nothing recently, a "first team environment". That was probably what AC was promised when he made the absolute mistake of signing with Atlanta.

    Whatever you think of AC, he was never given 1/10th the shot as Barco. Another player his age with plenty of off field problems too. Yes, blah blah, $15MM. But if MLS teams had to compete for American talent, Atlanta would have had to pay plenty for Carleton.
     
  12. bpet15

    bpet15 Member+

    Oct 4, 2016
    No idea. All that I know is that he was more talented than most other kids at that level.

    We don't have to assume anything. It's all there, right in front of us. He was closer to the first team 2 seasons ago than he is now. Off the field issues and suspensions. Where are the assumptions?

    I'm not calling Atl 2 a first team environment. I'm calling Atlanta United a first team environment. You know, the environement he was in, until he wasn't any longer.

    These players are in the same training environment every day. I don't understand the Carleton apologists on here. If two different coaches opinions aren't enough to make you understand, I don't know what would.
     
  13. bshredder

    bshredder BigSoccer Supporter

    Feb 23, 1999
    Club:
    Millwall FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    And the two coaches who have expressed concern about him have coached clubs such as Barcelona and Ajax. That is sobering.

    He's got a lot of talent. And he will have a lot of opportunities because there will always be a club somewhere that will take a chance on talent.

    Troubled but talented young players like Carleton are like lottery tickets. Someone will always buy one because they're cheap and there is a big upside.

    But the kid needs to 1) decide how much he's willing to sacrifice for a career and 2) get out of Atlanta because there are a lot of bad influences on him there. 3) Stay away from bad influences wherever he goes next.
     
  14. bpet15

    bpet15 Member+

    Oct 4, 2016
    As I sit, today, I am not sure I'd even go that far. He certainly had a lot of talent compared to other kids his age in his U17 WC cycle. Talent is relative to his peers and while others have been improving, he has stagnated.
     
  15. Bob Morocco

    Bob Morocco Member+

    Aug 11, 2003
    Billings, MT
    I don’t agree with this formulation. Talent is roughly the ability to do something, the more difficult the task that can be accomplished consistently the higher the talent. It is generally limited by innate factors. Training and mental/psychological development allow for players to hone their talent to its potential. They can become more consistent and learn how best to apply their talent (e.g. weighing the risk reward of potential choices). In the ages we pay the most attention to there are much bigger gains to be made on the mental/decision making side. What you are viewing as players increasing their talent is that those players have improved on their ability to apply the talent they have such that they are now more effective than a more talented player who didn’t learn to become as effective.
     
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  16. Bob Morocco

    Bob Morocco Member+

    Aug 11, 2003
    Billings, MT
    I need to modify/expand on my definition of talent above. In the past I’ve said that skill is the ability to accomplish a task, the more difficult the task and more consistently it’s accomplished the higher the person’s skill level. I would say that talent encompasses that but it’s basically the natural level and then capacity of someone’s skills. So I think for instance I remember a US fitness coach saying that Dempsey had to work a lot harder to maintain the fitness level that Donovan naturally had. Then you can also think about the interplay and collection of all those skill levels/capacities.
     
  17. Eleven Bravo

    Eleven Bravo Member+

    Atlanta United
    United States
    Jul 3, 2004
    SC
    Club:
    Atlanta Silverbacks
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    One of the main reasons I want to see Charlotte enter MLS. With Nashville already in the league, there should be some competition for these players to sign with if Atlanta doesn’t up their academy game.
     
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  18. kba4life1

    kba4life1 Member+

    Jul 14, 2010
    Irvine, CA
    “Bonafide” offers must be made to players by Nov 14, so we’ll presumably know what the deal is with Carleton on Thursday.
     
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  19. frankburgers

    frankburgers Member+

    May 31, 2016
    It’s almost 2020 and we still have people itt saying it’s Atlanta’s fault Carleton isn’t good.....
     
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  20. Patrick167

    Patrick167 Member+

    Dortmund
    United States
    May 4, 2017
    Not sure what you are basing your post on. I personally have just consistently said that Atlanta has not developed one player yet. That highly thought of prospects sign with them then regress. A lot of venom towards this kid here, but why let Atlanta off the hook?

    Maybe all the prospects just had problems or holes. That seems to be what you are saying. It can't be Atlanta's fault. Bello is worse than a year ago. Carleton is worse than a year ago. Goslin, Kunga, everyone is worse than a year ago. I guess it is 2020, almost, so Atlanta is a great developer of 17 year olds? Hard to follow you.
     
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  21. SUDano

    SUDano Member+

    Jan 18, 2003
    Rochester, NY
    OMG! He's almost 19.5 yrs old and time is running out to determine if he's good or sucks. Hurry, get your votes in quick.
     
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  22. Pegasus

    Pegasus Member+

    Apr 20, 1999
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    When the FCD Academy started Schellas Hyndman was the coach. I thought he would be a good fit since he'd coached college kids for decades. He gave a few players a game or two and seemingly liked Acosta but no one else. Unheralded Victor Ulloa was released as had others. No one cared as he must not be good enough. I had a glimmer of a thought which was what if the kids had figured out no matter what they did it didn't matter? Would they still practice just as hard knowing it didn't matter what they did they wouldn't play? Then Hyndman was fired and Pareja took over, invited Ulloa to camp and he made the team. He's now played for two MLS teams and signed with a third. He's not a world beater but he doesn't suck either.

    Atlanta might have some good young players that their coaches won't play because they mostly play veterans or they might not be good enough. Time will settle this one.
     
  23. frankburgers

    frankburgers Member+

    May 31, 2016
    A team that has been around for three years hasn’t developed any academy players?!?! That’s amazing.

    Lagos Kunga is your go to defense? He was never good lol.

    as others have mentioned, both atl coaches have said Carleton is immature, distracted etc. yet you want to blame the club?
    Interesting.
     
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  24. Patrick167

    Patrick167 Member+

    Dortmund
    United States
    May 4, 2017
    It took Dortmund 6 months with Pulisic and Sancho. Schalke did Mckennie in 9 months. NYRB developed Adams in about a year. Three years is plenty if you know what you are doing.

    Atlanta has admitted they didn't know what they were doing. So, yes, they deserve some blame. Why do you absolve them when they admit to screwing up? It is bizarre how much glee people get in proclaiming a teenager is a failure.
     
  25. bballshawn

    bballshawn Member+

    Feb 5, 2014
    Delaware
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    So maybe salty people over carelton
     

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