You mean Forest haven't been damaged other than they've gone up and back down twice since Clough left and, the last time I checked, are still mired in the middle of the Championship pack? Make no mistake, once the deed is done, Wenger will (eventually) be looked back fondly even by his biggest critics for how he transformed the club, by how he kept the club in the CL despite restrictions due to paying off the Emirates and by the style of play he introduced. I'd have no problem waiting a couple of seasons to make the club a contender again if the club hire a DoF and a head coach. Problem is who's going to have it in them to pull the trigger and send Wenger out.
Hiring a DOF and a new manager in the same summer is fine, provided it's done early, with a proper pre-season in place, and transfer targets are identified at the same time as hiring is done. Arsenal have a pretty decent structure in place. United's issue is that Moyes took a mallet to a lot of it, and then LVG did what LVG does and start fights in an empty room. The infighting with Woodward didn't help either. These are the exact opposite of the issues that Arsenal have right now, where there simply isn't enough conflict to force change.
This is not more of the same, though. It's probably been the worst two month run in the Wenger era. Less than one point per game in that span.
What is Arsenal's structure? I thought Wenger had the say in everything from academy recruitment to first team tactics and hiring. Similar to United which was more of a combination of Fergie and Gill at the end.
Yesterday's debacle gave this thread an expected bump in votes. We're up to 24 votes, with 92% #WengerOut. Not a bad count, but still way shy of the 59 votes from 2015's poll. We'll just have to see if any of the apathetes (a newly coined word!) come back before the end of the season and cast their vote. The others who have shuffled off to Buffalo (or rather Twitter, Reddit, Facebook) I suspect we may never see again. Edit: apparently I didn't coin that word... Apathete has been around for some time. Not just on this board!
According to Knutson, a lot of structure behind the scenes to help Wenger with the day to day (e.g. StatDNA).
Presumably if the intention is to fire Wenger, the board has to be lining up replacements ASAP to ensure continuity. No one's out of a job, but you can certainly get a hand shake deal done with someone like Tuchel.
er ... no, I mean that Clough did considerable damage on his way out at Forest. But he's a legend and would be still, even if was he - and not Kinnear/Megson - who took them down yet another level. I'm not weighing in at all on the Wenger in/out issue. All I'm saying is that once he's gone, however ugly it might be getting him out, he'll be viewed primarily via the prism of his successes. There are countless examples of managers who've had successes (nowhere near Wengers') at a club followed by failures (far worse). But they all tend to be remembered for their glories, not their shortcomings. at worst, he's tarnishing his legacy. no way will he kill it.
Thing is with the money available any replacement manager should be able to hit top 6 immediately and with some smart spending and tactics push top 2. I just can't understand why anyone would want Wenger to stay next year or allow him a chance to rebuild? Fact is he isn't up for the fight and now the players aren't working for him either.
If you can get away with panic-buying an injured player on deadline day, you can get away with anything.
More that Wenger has no idea how to recruit at the top of the market. Ozil and Alexis fell into his lap, but we've been terrible at recruiting other top players. I still think the structure is maddening, because these issues are self-inflicted and easily fixable with coaching: players have to know where to move to. And it's not as if we can't do that: our record since 2011 is actually good (3 wins, 2 losses and a draw). I just find myself wondering what Arsenal actually work on in training, because the team looks like a disorganized mess in defensive transitions. It stops being an issue on the margins when the likes of West Brom and Crystal Palace can hurt you.
I meant our record against Dortmund is quite good. When tasked with preparing for and solving a press, he's done a pretty decent job. And note my last comment, which was a response to your statement that this was failure at the margins. It stops being a failure at the margins and becomes full blown failure when you're being consistently outplayed by the likes of West Brom, Crystal Palace, and Watford. Arsenal haven't been good for months.
Yeah - by failure at the margins I was talking about the last decade. 2017 is garbage - Arsenal are not a top 4 team anymore
Ya'll really fell for that "we're different" sh*t that Arsene and whoever else fed ya'll? LOL Jesus Christ
My loyalty to the L.A. Kings in the NHL (42 years running, since 1975) should tell you how I will also be with my choice of football clubs I support, that of course is Arsenal (2012-date), along with VfL Wolfsburg in the Bundesliga (2010-date), the US Men's and Women's national teams (2007-date), and also the reigning defending MLS Cup champs, the Seattle Sounders (2009-date). I don't care if Arsene Wenger stays or goes, as I know there are plenty of Gooners who are long-term supporters of this great club, my fandom with Arsenal doesn't start and end with merely the O2-sponsored shirts, at first they are what led me to Arsenal (on eBay in 2011 I originally just searched "O2 shirt" and that is what first led me to discover The Gunners) and then viewing vintage clips of them in those shirts from the likes of The Invincibles and Arsene Wenger in 2002-04 as well as throughout their rich history and tradition are what made me a Gooner to this very day and 'til I die!!! So COYF'n'G!!! Hell, I even wrote that AK47 song "Arsenal" in tribute to the club back in 2014, if I wasn't gonna be here long-term I would never have taken the time to write it, let alone pattern it with a karaoke instrumental version of Maroon 5's smash hit "Animals" at that!!! Once I pick a club or team to support I try to stick with them each and every step of the way, no matter if we win or lose, period. How hardcore I am of one depends mostly on the TV or online (officially not through an illegal site) availability of them, that's why Arsenal in my number one club taking over from Wolfsburg after getting that virus in my PC trying to stream their opening 2013-14 match away to Hannover 96, and since Fox Sports won't emulate NBC and offer every team ever match every week (on TV and online legally) for the Bundesliga as NBC does for the Premier League I am a Gooner FIRST!!!
I see your 42 years and raise you one... 43 years as a Gooner starting in 1974. Since you've shifted from Wolfie to Arse, partly based on getting a virus from them, and us being on TV more often, you better not slack off in your support if we become mid-table and only show up on the Live Extra channels!
I'll be fine even if we were to become a mid-table club, in which I doubt we'll become, as for the Kings, hell, I remember the days in the 80s when we were picked to finish last in our division (Smythe Division) and there I'd be, with season tickets right there at The Fabulous Forum watching them every night and not leaving until the final horn sounds, win or lose. As for us being on the Live Extra channels, I can get those as I am a DISH customer so I'm fine there too. And like it says in the chorus to my hit AK47 song "Arsenal" - "we play a full 90 minutes, win lose or tie we don the Red and White because we're Gooners 'til we die!!! We're The Arsenal, Arsenal from Highburytown"
Out. He has the tactical sense of my high school water polo coach, whose only tactic was to pass the ball and swim to open water.
For some reason, when I read your opening word "Out", I read it as if he had just announced it! Then I realized you were just expressing your vote. Who am I kidding? My gut says he's gonna wait until our season is definitively over, and our results are definitively known. If we don't win the cup, and finish outside Top4, I have a hard time imagining them selling his extension to the fans. OTOH if we attain one or both of those things, my concern is that they'll try to use that in their sales pitch.
Thought I'd do a little poll review & comparison: BigSoccer poll (as of now)... 86% Out / 14% In (29 votes) AST poll (widely reported in March)... 78% / 22% (500-ish votes) ESPNFC poll (February)... 78% / 22% (# votes unclear) From the fan point of view, it's just not looking good for Le Boss.