Alfredo Morales

Discussion in 'USA Men' started by #1 Feilhaber and Adu, Feb 26, 2019.

  1. #1 Feilhaber and Adu

    Aug 1, 2007
    He might be the most interesting prime-age player in the pool right now.

    According to this season:

    Has played in 17 Bundesliga games out of 23 for 12th place Fortuna Dusseldorf. And has started/ went 90 in 14 of the 17 games. DM/CM. A player with some bite.

    A player that slowly has improved over the years. Will be 32 in 2022.

    I don't think there is a stand-alone discussion thread on him...
     
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  2. Eleven Bravo

    Eleven Bravo Member+

    Atlanta United
    United States
    Jul 3, 2004
    SC
    Club:
    Atlanta Silverbacks
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I’d include him in the discussion. We need center midfielders more than we think. At this point, we have Adams and McKennie and then bunch of contenders.
     
  3. nobody

    nobody Member+

    Jun 20, 2000
    I have to say it does indeed seem extremely odd that a guy who can hold down a Bundesliga roll can't seem to make any national team headway. Then again, he plays for a pretty mediocre team for that level, he isn't an everyday starter, and his career up until this season has been strictly B2. It will be interesting to see what Berhalter does with him, if anything.
     
  4. TheHoustonHoyaFan

    Oct 14, 2011
    Houston
    Club:
    FC Schalke 04
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Morales played in the BuLi in 2011 for Herta and was a lock starter in 2015 and 2016 for Ingolstadt also in the BuLi.

    His last USMNT caps were in 2015 and 2016.
     
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  5. nobody

    nobody Member+

    Jun 20, 2000
    My bad, scanned his Wiki a bit too quickly. Thanks for the info.
     
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  6. bsky22

    bsky22 Member+

    Dec 8, 2003
    Why isnt this thread in N&A?
     
  7. adam tash

    adam tash Member+

    Jul 12, 2013
    he can play the bradley/trapp role better than either bradley or trapp...but that said i'm not a fan of the role itself.

    deep-lying centermid who drops back between the cbs to spray passes seems very inefficient and toothless to me.....not a fan of that strategy AT ALL.

    team is much better off and more dangerous with centermids who are threats to charge into the final third and cover ground a la adams and mckennie...


    still - morales could be a useful player for the team - moreso than trapp or bradley - he's much more athletic, more goal-dangerous, better defensively and just as good a passer if not better than the other 2 GB pets.

    I see zero reason - other than GB's love of camraderie and "culture-fit" - to call up either trapp or MB over morales.
     
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  8. HomietheClown

    HomietheClown Member+

    Dusselheim FC 1971
    Sep 4, 2010
    Club:
    --other--
    This thread has me as a Colombian-American soccer fan confused.

    I keep on getting alerts about the Alfredo Morelos thread and then I saw this thread here.

    I have to make sure I do not confuse the two at first glance.;)
     
  9. cyberthoth

    cyberthoth Member

    Aug 7, 2000
    Nashville, TN
    Club:
    DC United
    I feel like this thread needs a bump based on the Gold Cup roster. Does anyone have any idea who's cheerios Morales pi$$ed in? I mean yeah he hasn't shown well when called up. He's also seemed to alway be shoehorned into some form of a winger role that he's not suited for. I just feel like all things considered a guy with as many Bundesliga appearances as he has should warrant at least a mention on our 40 man roster.
     
  10. Clint Eastwood

    Clint Eastwood Member+

    Dec 23, 2003
    Somerville, MA
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Has anybody asked him.........................................?

    This is a guy who's spent very little time in the United States.

    A German born player with a naturalized Peruvian-American father and German mother.
    Alfredo is eligible for the USMNT because his father was born in the United States.

    This could be a player that has chosen to focus on his club career.
     
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  11. truefan420

    truefan420 Member+

    May 30, 2010
    oakland
    Club:
    Chelsea FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    http://www.espn.com/soccer/united-s...nited-states-return-is-will-always-be-my-goal
     
  12. Ger90

    Ger90 Member+

    May 13, 2016
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    does he even deserve a call up? From end of Feb to end of the season, he only started 1 game. And honestly Fortuna looked much better without him than with him.

    I feel like a bit too much desire to see him play for the USA based on the whole he got game time in 1BL but that's not really a good reason.
     
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  13. DHC1

    DHC1 Member+

    Jun 3, 2002
    NYC
    The thought that the USMNT is good enough to ignore B1 players from even practicing with the squad is baffling to me. Particularly when we’re starting midfielders who are mediocre by MLS standards.

    Did we learn nothing from Arena’s biases?
     
  14. freisland

    freisland Member+

    Jan 31, 2001
    I can see getting him in to give another look, but I watched a few Fortuna run outs this season when they played other YA teams, and I have to admit he did not look all that exceptional to me the few times I say him. Would he be more effective than MB or Trapp? Have to see him the role, but to my eye there was an obvious difference watching Wes or CP or even Adams on their teams and Morales on his. But Fortuna was really crap (although Schalke was not a whole lot better), so that colors everything.
     
  15. nowherenova

    nowherenova Member+

    Jul 20, 2003
    Formerly Terminus
    Fortuna finished 10th. Crap?
     
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  16. yurch10

    yurch10 Member+

    Feb 13, 2004
    You ask whether he's better than mb and Trapp, then compare him to our 3 lock starters.

    MB or Trapp will be starting every game.

    Yes, he is better than both of them, by a large margin.
     
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  17. freisland

    freisland Member+

    Jan 31, 2001
    I compare him to our three "lock starters" because I've watched him in the same league, where those 3 have all played a bit of midfield, playing the same competition, so it's a pretty observable comp.

    I didn't ask whether he's "better" but rather "more effective" because I think it would be helpful to see him play with the team before having an opinion. I have not been overwhelmed (nor overly underwhelmed) while watching him - and I've seen him play on and off for a couple of years now. But I also think he's decent enough that he should get a look.

    But, being the cautious old dog that I am, I'd like to see him in the 11 in a few practices first. But that's just me.
     
  18. yurch10

    yurch10 Member+

    Feb 13, 2004
    That's reasonable.

    Squad rotation player for tenth team in the BL1 > average/below average MLS player.

    I'd compare him to the players he would be replacing (ie. Those at his position). I would not compare him to our 3 stars who all agree should be on the field at all times (some out of position at rb to accommodate others). He is better than mb/Trapp. Better players are more effective. Mb/Trapp couldn't sniff the Bundesliga. I don't care about Berhalters elaborate system.

    Doesn't matter, bc he won't get a chance with this leadership (ussf/mls/Berhalter).
     
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  19. freisland

    freisland Member+

    Jan 31, 2001
    The attempts to quantify all but the most outstanding players in a vacuum based solely on league/team is usually not very effective. Sure, guys that shine on very good teams in very good leagues are most often going to shine most anywhere (Messi excepted lol...) but Morales is really, if we are being honest, a very good B2 player who has not looked out of place in the fat middle of the B1 - which is obviously a high level, but does not guarantee that he'd be an obvious upgrade on the USMNT, but as I said, I would love to see him have the opportunity.

    And, of course, MB actually played in the Bundesliga - quite a bit in fact - but that was years ago and it's impossible to compare that to current form. But I think the "paper comparisons" of all but the most exceptional players are often imprecise. Again, though, I'd love to have a chance to see Morales in the side - that's why Euro-based friendlies are my pet project!

    For me, I think I'd look at a system that didn't use any of the 3 of them, given the players we currently have available. But I don't run the circus.
     
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  20. yurch10

    yurch10 Member+

    Feb 13, 2004
    While I disagree with not knowing he's better, at least it's debatable.

    What's not debatable is he won't be given a chance because for some reason we're sticking w the same guys who finished 5th in the Hex and nobody seems that surprised or alarmed by it.
     
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  21. BostonRed

    BostonRed Member+

    Oct 9, 2011
    Somerville, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    #21 BostonRed, May 28, 2019
    Last edited: May 28, 2019
    Those two sentences contradict each other. His father was born in Peru and naturalized in the US.

    There has been debate in the NT eligibility thread that he's not eligible to play for the US:

    6 Nationality entitling players to represent more than one association

    1. A player who, under the terms of art. 5, is eligible to represent more than one association on account of his nationality, may play in an international match for one of these associations only if, in addition to having the relevant nationality, he fulfills at least one of the following conditions:

    (a) He was born on the territory of the relevant association;
    (b) His biological mother or biological father was born on the territory of the relevant association;
    (c) His grandmother or grandfather was born on the territory of the relevant association;
    (d) He has lived continuously on the territory of the relevant association for at least two years.


    There may have been a waiver requested somewhere, but I don't see how he can represent the US unless he lived a couple of years in the US when he was a kid. I have no idea if that is why he hasn't been called in, though his play with the US hasn't been noteworthy.

    ETA: I'll add a footnote to mention that he started playing for the US in 2008 at the youth level. That year, there were some changes to the eligibility rules so it's possible that he was grandfathered by FIFA. That would take some real digging to figure out.
     
  22. Courey

    Courey Member

    Sep 24, 2003
    Coffeyville, Kansas
    For some reason I remember reading that as a Peruvian citizen, his father joined one of the American military branches, and became a citizen, and as a result, he could get citizenship and play for the US. I'm not sure how these things relate, but Bshredder might have the answer. I'm pretty sure he has done a fair bit of reporting on Alfredo in the past. (Again my aging 47 year old memory could be failing me).
     
  23. BostonRed

    BostonRed Member+

    Oct 9, 2011
    Somerville, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Yes, that's how Alfredo's father became a citizen and he passed along citizenship to his son by living in the US for the proscribed period of time before Alfredo was born. Alfredo was born a US citizen, but he was born in Germany.

    Alfredo is a US citizen, but the question is whether he is eligible to represent the US under FIFA rules (absent a waiver or grandfathering under the old rules).

    I'm sure I'm missing something and it's not an issue.
     
  24. TheHoustonHoyaFan

    Oct 14, 2011
    Houston
    Club:
    FC Schalke 04
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    #24 TheHoustonHoyaFan, May 29, 2019
    Last edited: May 29, 2019
    You don't believe that any issue was resolved before he was cap-tied at GC 2015?

    He is eligible for the US under 5 and Peru under 5 (if he has Peruvian citizenship at birth) and 6 if not.
     
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  25. BostonRed

    BostonRed Member+

    Oct 9, 2011
    Somerville, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Article 5 doesn't really help in this case because Article 6 immediately changes the scope of Article 5:

    Any person holding a permanent nationality that is not dependent on residence in a certain country is eligible to play for the representative teams of the association of that country.

    Article 7 addresses when you get a new citizenship.

    It's not the best written set of rules, but just having a passport at birth doesn't appear to qualify you to play for a national team.
     

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