** A New Era - Rebuilding the Azzurri

Discussion in 'Italy: National Teams' started by Stamos, Nov 13, 2017.

  1. indestructible

    indestructible Member+

    SSC Napoli
    Jan 14, 2007
    Mercato Professor
    Club:
    SSC Napoli
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    And now Inter are getting Biraghi

    ITALINTER facci sognare
     
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  2. Gilbertsson

    Gilbertsson Member+

    Barcelona
    Spain
    Apr 1, 2012
    Geneva
    Club:
    Toronto Croatia
    Nat'l Team:
    Switzerland
    #1127 Gilbertsson, Aug 27, 2019
    Last edited: Aug 27, 2019
    Salcedo, Vecino, Icardi might pass as Italians, either through birth or origins.
    https://www.transfermarkt.com/inter-mailand/startseite/verein/46

    The price of Ranocchia dropped a lot. Only 3 millions of euro's. I liked him earlier, hoped to see him as someone who became great player.

    I don't think that Godin is a good buy, older and injured.

    I don't understand why is Skriniar so expensive? Or Icardi? 80 millions?

    I still doubt that they can win the title: Juventus or Napoli are the best in this season.

    Brescia has domestic players in majority. Only 8 foreigners. Imagine that they end 6th, 7th at the end.
    https://www.transfermarkt.com/jumplist/startseite/verein/19

    Mario Balotelli plays there now??:eek:
    Gastaldello was once solid player in Sampdoria.
     
  3. totti fan

    totti fan Red Card

    Jun 24, 2010
    Club:
    SSC Napoli
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    Sensi > Verratti
     
  4. totti fan

    totti fan Red Card

    Jun 24, 2010
    Club:
    SSC Napoli
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    Wrong.
     
  5. Gilbertsson

    Gilbertsson Member+

    Barcelona
    Spain
    Apr 1, 2012
    Geneva
    Club:
    Toronto Croatia
    Nat'l Team:
    Switzerland
    Juventus started their Champions League Final match with 9 Italians, plus 4 players on the bench, with the coach.:cool:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1996_UEFA_Champions_League_Final

    45th birthday of Del Piero in September. Michele Padovano celebrates today.:D
     
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  6. Gilbertsson

    Gilbertsson Member+

    Barcelona
    Spain
    Apr 1, 2012
    Geneva
    Club:
    Toronto Croatia
    Nat'l Team:
    Switzerland
    This won't happen I think. Better Italian clubs will always have 4-5 Italians in the first team. But, players who passed the process of naturalisation might play in the future for Italy, based on their residence and club careers. Something that already happens in rugby, volleyball, futsal, basketball with several players in every sport. Serie A will rise up much more in the future, so new players will arrive.
     
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  7. falvo

    falvo Member+

    Mar 27, 2005
    San Jose & Florence
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    Happy Birthday Michele Padovano! Did he get out of jail yet?
     
  8. Deleted User x

    Deleted User x Member+

    Mar 21, 2006
    It's very possible he will be one day.

    Sensi looked GOOD last match. Very creative and confident. Let's see how he does in Champions League.
     
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  9. indestructible

    indestructible Member+

    SSC Napoli
    Jan 14, 2007
    Mercato Professor
    Club:
    SSC Napoli
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    Sensi was very good for Inter. Conte will turn him into a lion
     
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  10. Calcio Pauly

    Calcio Pauly Member+

    Jun 17, 2012
    Club:
    AC Milan
    Thank Jesus, you've moved on from Montolivo.
     
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  11. gumbacicc

    gumbacicc Member+

    Dec 7, 2004
    USA
    Aside from what Gilbertsson posted above regarding Juve's last Champions League winning side that establishes that I am 100% correct, in 2005-2006, the year leading into Italy's last World Cup win, Juve started Buffon, Birindelli/Pessotto, Zambrotta, Cannavaro, Camoranesi and Del Piero...if you think that Italian players are of the same quality presently, you're smoking something. Then again, you thought Montolivo was world class so.....
     
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  12. Gilbertsson

    Gilbertsson Member+

    Barcelona
    Spain
    Apr 1, 2012
    Geneva
    Club:
    Toronto Croatia
    Nat'l Team:
    Switzerland
    #1137 Gilbertsson, Aug 28, 2019
    Last edited: Aug 28, 2019
    In 1985 year, Juventus used also domestic players.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1985_European_Cup_Final

    Michel Platini, Massimo Bonini could be regarded as Italians.

    Inter Milano used in 2010 year only 3 domestic players, Balotelli included.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010_UEFA_Champions_League_Final

    We could maybe consider Zanetti, Milito, Cambiasso as Italians. Or maybe not.

    On the other hand, Bayern used more domestic players. Several of them have foreign origins: Diego Contento, Mario Gomez, Michael Rensing.

    In 1990 year, the situation was great with AC Milan and domestic players policy.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1990_European_Cup_Final

    The same happened in 1994.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1994_UEFA_Champions_League_Final

    Zvonimir Boban has Latin origins, so not far from being domestic.

    As you can see, Juventus maintained this policy, AC Milan started to quit and they hired more Brazilians.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2003_UEFA_Champions_League_Final

    Sampdoria also kept the same policy.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1992_European_Cup_Final

    Interesting, Cerezo lost two finals.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toninho_Cerezo

    In 2005 year, A.C. Milan used even more foreigners.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2005_UEFA_Champions_League_Final

    Liverpool had 3 domestic players. The progress of Premierleague motivated other clubs to invest in fast solutions and to hire made men foreign players.

    Juventus always tried to develop domestic players.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2015_UEFA_Champions_League_Final

    New potential Champions League title holders should be: Manchester City, Liverpool, Barcelona, Juventus, Atletico Madrid.

    Shakhtar has 12 Brazilians.:eek: Few of them we could see in Ukraine NT.
    https://www.transfermarkt.com/shakhtar-donetsk/startseite/verein/660

    Lyon uses nice number of domestic players. Many of them have foreign origins, but still, it's a French school.
    https://www.transfermarkt.com/olympique-lyon/startseite/verein/1041

    Thanks to 2000's, we will continue to observe bought stars in majority of clubs. I remembered one Italian Cup final match. It was played in New York (Milan - Juventus). Local atmosphere became global. What's next? Match on the skyscraper roof / stadium in Bangkok?:confused:

    Gumbacicc, of course that current Italian players are not that great as players in 2006, 2000, 1994, 2012 various finals. But, other national teams have the same problems, they all declined in quality compared with 1980's and 1990's.

    France won't have Zidane, Henry, Ribery so fast, same thing is with Portugal and their players like: Figo, Rui Costa, or Spanish Raul, Valeron, Baraja, Mendieta, German Matthaus, Moller, Klinsmann, Hassler, Dutch Bergkamp, Kluivert, Davids, Seedorf, Rijkaard....their newer players are weaker than these ones.

    Teams which had 3,4 great players in 1990's today they don't have anyone specifically great: Leonhardsen, Hyypia, Larsson, Litmanen, Hagi, Stoichkov, Kostadinov, John Carew, Patrik Berger, Vladimir Smicer, Poborsky, Shevchenko, Rebrov, Luzhnyi, Kanchelskis, Roy Keane, Sheridan, Claudio Reyna, Rommedahl, Gronkjaer, Jorgensen, Gravesen....
     
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  13. gumbacicc

    gumbacicc Member+

    Dec 7, 2004
    USA
    We agree. What concerns me, though, is that our low period has lasted for at least a decade now post 2006 World Cup victory which was essentially the pinnacle of the last great generation of players that we had. Conversely, we saw countries like Brazil and Germany recently rebound after uncharacteristically poor stretches for them.

    For the first time in a long time I was actually encouraged by what I saw from the youth in the last Euro U-21 tournament and remain convinced that we have some real talent that could be coming through, most notably with Chiesa. However, we still must show more to get back to the heights that we saw in the 80s, 90s and early 2000s.
     
  14. Alex101

    Alex101 Member

    Mar 15, 2017
    #1139 Alex101, Aug 28, 2019
    Last edited: Aug 28, 2019
    What about Atalanta and Udinese, they play like what 2 Italians a game the only 2 they have on the whole team?. I can't see why these accessory of players on team like Udinese or Bologna are any better than Italians playing in Serie B. Spain has the best league in the world its a balance of really good foreigners and domestic players, in Italy there is an obsession with having a foreign name at the back of the jersey. Salvini please pull Italy out of the EU and stop this nonsense.

    The odd thing is in the 2010's only 1 Italian club won a European trophy, in the 90's when it was a majority Italian league Italian clubs won 10 trophies. Italy won't ever be back on top until they start developing their own again.
     
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  15. Gilbertsson

    Gilbertsson Member+

    Barcelona
    Spain
    Apr 1, 2012
    Geneva
    Club:
    Toronto Croatia
    Nat'l Team:
    Switzerland
    Problematic periods can last much longer.
    Portugal missed three world cups: 1990, 1994, 1998. In that period, they really had great players.
    Last five years, Spain is in creative break. Just like the Netherlands. They are trying to return back.
    England has traditionally weaker results, only their 4th place in 2018 gave more hope to them. Scotland, Republic of Ireland vanished basically.
    Denmark has cold/warm moments. They show in one competition, the second they miss.
    Sweden is far from their results since 1990's. Norway doesn't participate since 1998.
    Argentina is changing the team a lot now. Some new players: Montiel, Balerdi, Figal, Gaich, Quarta, Palacios, Zaracho, Dominguez, MacAllister, Foyth, Simeone...hard to say is this enough to be on the road of Messi, Aimar, Cambiasso, Batistuta, Veron. Several children of previously known footballers, it sounds like nepotism; nipote.:D
    Croatia missed to invite Gaich in their team. Ireland and Scotland had MacAllister, Italy should take Simeone maybe.

    Brazil started to use players from their national league, which was not the case earlier. Some Brazilians rather play in Chinese league. Many players like to earn more in shorter period, which is understandable.

    U-21 tournaments usually doesn't offer too much, maybe few players become successful.
    Sweden won EURO U-21 tournament in 2015, but we don't see their senior success.
    Spain won the same tournament in 1998, after this year nothing and they became World Cup winners in 2010. They win much more often last tournaments, but they don't have senior results.
    Netherlands has won U-21 titles in 2006 and in 2007. Scorers were Luirink, de Ridder, Hofs who retired and they were in weaker clubs.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2006_UEFA_European_Under-21_Championship

    Only Huntealaar is one the scene, but his career stopped when he went out of Real Madrid.
     
  16. totti fan

    totti fan Red Card

    Jun 24, 2010
    Club:
    SSC Napoli
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    If you want to gauge Italy's ability to develop talent look at the depth at youth level. You can't compare number of starters at club level unless you consider within the broader context of rules regarding number of allowable foreign players.
     
  17. Gilbertsson

    Gilbertsson Member+

    Barcelona
    Spain
    Apr 1, 2012
    Geneva
    Club:
    Toronto Croatia
    Nat'l Team:
    Switzerland
    #1142 Gilbertsson, Aug 28, 2019
    Last edited: Aug 28, 2019
    Atalanta is well balanced team, they use foreigners, but they were not bought as some major stars, mostly less known players, well scouted: Freuler, Castagne, Hateboer...

    Spanish league is great, but their clubs use a lot of Catalan and Basque players, not exactly domestic.
    Athletic Bilbao uses several foreigners and a lot of players who have Spanish surnames, not Basque.
    Financially stronger clubs use much more foreign players: Atletico Madrid, Barcelona, Real Madrid. They bought expensive defender Trippier. Like they couldn't find some talented and cheaper defenders??
    Barcelona also doesn't have domestic Catalan players, like before. But they like to inform people how they use Catalan players. Jordi Alba Ramos, Carles Alena Castillo, Sergi Roberto are Spaniards. Pique and Busquets Burgos might pass as Catalans, Burgos is Spanish surname. Others are bought stars.

    Real Madrid has similar policy like Juventus, domestic players, who play in the NT. Real is giving up from that policy. They can't find domestic goalkeeper.
    Valencia is considered as club with financial issues, but they still buy foreign players. Only clubs with less money use domestic players there.

    Italian politicians are populists in the last 30 years, since I'm aware of politics. Italy holds a record in making new elections. Coalitions are formed because of personal interests, not because of people. If Italy leaves EU, with who could they create acceptable trade? UK (England) has ex-colonies, Commonwealth. They can bring resources from there and sell expensively to other EU members. Other EU countries might just stop importing Italian products or they can provide higher taxes and burdens to Italy. Even if Italy leaves EU, migrants will enter in, because of the geographical position, sea coasts, not easy to control.

    New economic crisis is very near, I predict 2020. EU can't be blamed because of internal problems. Problems were created from inside, just like in all other Mediterranean countries. Malta and Southern Cyprus are solid because UK entered there.

    Politicians who carry NT jersey, rosary, who pray in front of journalists at the press conferences can't resolve economic crisis. Five Star Movement - politicians who left other known political parties. Populism based on leftist ideas. Comedians and singers started to participate in politics much more.

    Northern League switched from far-left to far-right. In any sincere behaviour, how can that be?
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lega_Nord

    From anti-clericalism to right-wing. Usually, right-wing goes with the religion. From liberalism to euroscepticism. From regionalism and Padania independence to tutta la Italia oggi. But the name embrace only Nord.:rolleyes:
    Collection of votes only matters, nothing else. They all create the vibrant topics to attract people. If leftists arrive, we will see topics like: human rights, climate changes, working class on the knees, LGBT...
    When Mediterranean Syndrome stops creating obstacles (laziness, lack of education and working skills with proper organisation level) situation might improve and it maybe becomes just like in Germany, England, Denmark, Norway, Netherlands, Finland, Sweden, France, Switzerland, Austria...where Mediterraneans work hard.:) We don't see the opposite: Dutch person who works hard in Greek shipyard.:cool: In Southern Europe, silly reality shows and singing stages are flourishing.
     
  18. Deleted User x

    Deleted User x Member+

    Mar 21, 2006
    Real have been after De Gea for years. Hopefully he ends up there.
     
  19. Gilbertsson

    Gilbertsson Member+

    Barcelona
    Spain
    Apr 1, 2012
    Geneva
    Club:
    Toronto Croatia
    Nat'l Team:
    Switzerland
    I think that he isn't so great, like Kepa Arrizabalaga. De Gea knows how to accept strange goals. He could react better against Wolverhampton and Crystal Palace.
     
  20. phat

    phat Viking

    Feb 13, 2006
    Montreal
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    What the heck are you talking about.
     
  21. Calcio Pauly

    Calcio Pauly Member+

    Jun 17, 2012
    Club:
    AC Milan
    He's anti Socialism for sport.
     
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  22. phat

    phat Viking

    Feb 13, 2006
    Montreal
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy


    Maybe Synthetic Cathinones?!
     
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  23. Calcio Pauly

    Calcio Pauly Member+

    Jun 17, 2012
    Club:
    AC Milan
    That could explain things.
     
  24. GIGI RIVA

    GIGI RIVA Member

    Fiorentina
    Canada
    Aug 24, 2009
    Guelph Ontario
    Club:
    ACF Fiorentina
    Nat'l Team:
    Canada
    Watched a bit of the Bologna v spal game Orsolini looked very good today
     
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  25. GIGI RIVA

    GIGI RIVA Member

    Fiorentina
    Canada
    Aug 24, 2009
    Guelph Ontario
    Club:
    ACF Fiorentina
    Nat'l Team:
    Canada
    that juve v Napoli game was fantastic today
     
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