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Discussion in 'Ecuador - National Team' started by Primitive Ways, Jul 17, 2018.
No. Correct me if I'm wrong we won gold at the Panamerica games once before.
We did win it at Panamericanos,but this one carries more weight as a Conmebol tournament.
Ok,now I guess this squad is the best one so far,or do we still think other ones are better. Jeje.where are the rest of posters.come on mang,we finally won something on the national level.
I'm very happy we won. This was a moment in history for us. It's our first cup we've ever been awarded at any level (the panamericanos do not count).
Going back to your question, I think Sixto Vizuete's squad was just as good or possibly even better. But here's the key difference: our mentality. Celico is a coach that has steadily improved throughout the years. He used to be like Juan Ramon Carrasco who would only attack and leave his defense naked. Somewhere along the way he LEARNED what balance is all about. His teams are very attack-oriented, they pressure a lot, but NEVER do they leave their defense dismantled. Never is positioning in question. And most importantly, NEVER is their mind set on being satisfied with the bare minimum. This team is hungry and eager to win anything ALL-THE-TIME. That's the difference. Celico in his beginnings at U. Católica was not that, but he worked his way there. He would get slaughtered up to 7-0 at times. I'm sure some of you guys remember that. That's not the case now.
I hate to say it, but we needed an Argentinian, Uruguayan, or Brazilian to come teach us THAT. It's about will power and not setting limitations on yourself. The main issue with Ecuadorian players that keeps us behind the elite squads is ONE thing: "Tienen que creerselo". I'm not the first to say it.
Campana is just as good as Edson Montano was besides the fact that Edson would create more opportunities, and in turn miss more chances to score...but he still ended up scoring 5 times in the 2011 edition in this tournament (vs. 6 goals Campana scored this time making him the top Ecuadorian scorer in one tournament at this level). Renato Ibarra and Marcos Caicedo were not of lesser quality than Alvarado and Plata. Rezabala is not lightyears beyond Juan Cazares. Porozo is not a hundred times better than John Narvaez was during his time. Moises Corozo is not that much better than John Jaramillo was, in fact I'd dare to say Jaramillo was even better. It's about believing how great you are. Celico convinced these kids they are. And unlike Vizuete's Ecuador, they never encountered a moment where they looked like they were satisfied with what they had accomplished. How do you teach THAT?
With Bolillo, I find it hard to believe that will break THAT barrier because he is the first one to set it amongst our players. "No vamos a la Copa America a quedar campeones. Mi objetivo es legal al mundial." -> That right there is why we need to refresh our main squad with a different mentality.
The highlight of the tournament to me was just about every player who was a part of this squad. But the biggest stand outs were Leonardo Campana, Moises Corozo, Sergio Quintero and Jose Cifuentes (my two favorites), Jackson Porozo, Emerson Espinoza, John Espinoza, Exon Vallecilla, and Richard Mina.
Honorable mention to: Jordan Rezabala, Alexander Alvarado, Gonzalo Plata, and Diego Palacios. I think Plata is the most talented of the 3, BUT I think he has a lot to improve and that move to Sporting Lisbon may have distracted him just a little, but he has a bright future. I hope he is the guy who will fill in the spot that Antonio Valencia leaves vacant because it will be vacant VERY soon and must be filled. Alvarado and Rezabala IMO are not cracks like many believe. They remind me a lot of Sornoza and Uchuari, but with a lot more depth and finish which is the positive aspect. I find it hard to see them succeeding in a big league in Europe due to their size. I know, everyone is going to say, but look at Messi and Neymar....BUT, they don't possess that level of talent. If they can increase their muscle mass and continue developing, I think they may succeed in a league like Brazil or Mexico....but we'll see. Personally I find them over-hyped, despite the fact that they had a big tournament which I congratulate them for. I've seen many Joao Rojas, Jeff Monteros, Fidel Martinez, Angel Menas, and Uchuari's....these kids will have to convince me they aren't the same. As far as Diego Palacios, he attacks better than he defends. Looks like another Cristian Ramirez. Not bad at all for his age, but he has a lot of improving to do before he gets to the senior national team. He has lots of ups and downs during games.
Let’s say these kids do an amazing job at the WC....will they be given a chance by Bolillo?
Pretty awesome we finally won a cup! Watched the whole tournament and these kids are the real deal. Talent potential might not seem as good as Vizuete’s squad in some areas, but they are already more refined skills wise than any of Vizuete’s players ever were.
The positioning and skills are way ahead than other U20 teams I’ve seen from Ecuador ever. This is because these kids come from better youth schools now, and Celico’s coaching and leadership made a huge difference as well.
Also, this team is probably actually U20 in age lol. Anyways, it feels great to see Ecuador pull through, and instill a sense of “can do” attitude to all Ecuadorian around the world. So happy for the kids, can’t wait to see them evolve into NT players.
Positioning is one of the main things that impressed me with Rezabala and his vision of play is fenomenal as well as his technical skills.I saw some footage of him from his sub 17 days,where he ran around defenders but to his detriment,he held the ball too long.I think in this tournament he made an improvement but still has. some work to do there.He really deserves some credit for his early performances in sub 20 and most important of all ,that last minute pass in the Colombia game ,that allowed the team some breathing room.
So we got in the B group with Mexico,Italy and Japan,similar to our first World Cup minus Croatia.
Except this time we are not the new kids on the block. Celico is eager to preform great in this WC our squad as well.
Celico also mentioned that he aims to include Kike Saverio and Jordy Govea there is also the chance that Stieven Plaza may be included given his team give them the Ok this time. If we get these players in this squad we will have real depth. Saverio coming in to sub Alverado and Plaza for Campana.
In your opinions who are the big teams in this U20 WC ?
I have no idea as to what European team is up to,I’m only going on history.We know what Mexican teams bring,but somehow they have our number,hopefully with this squad ,we can get better results.Italy is probably going to bring their usual aggressive defense minded game,I’m glad that we avoided them for our first game ,let Mexico wear them down.If the Japanese play as their main squad,this will also be a fast counter ,fast attacking game,our advantage here is our size,we can probably bully them a little bit more in defense.Is Celico going to bring Plaza and have him and Campana up front?I hope so,with Plaza physicality and Campanas cool headed approach should be a very interesting duo.keeping my cool on these two,because anything can happen,I’m just hoping for some awesome goals.
The next friendlies for the major squad are coming up in two weeks. I'm interested in knowing what Bolillo's approach will be for this roster. He closed 2018 on a more positive note with the last FIFA dates we had. Some players have lost consistency in their club teams, others have gained it, and there's other who have maintained it. Nonetheless, in certain positions we have limited options in comparison to other, so some players may need to be called up since we don't have much more to choose from. Below are my best 23-24 players:
Juan Carlos Paredes
Beder Caicedo/Cristian Cruz
Jose Cevallos Jr.
Additional player/guest invite: Johan Julio
4-3-3 Starting 11: Dominguez; Paredes, Mina, Achiller, Ramirez; Orejuela, Intriago, Mendez; Romario, Enner, Mena
Intriago & Orejuela:
As most Ecuadorian futbol media outlets, I think the two current best center mids in Ecuador AND the best duo are Orejuela and Intriago without a shadow of a doubt. I really enjoyed how well Gruezo, Orejuela, and Mendez played as a trio in the mid in the last few friendlies, but I think the consistency and number of games Orejuela and Intriago play together week after week, makes them a better duo, ESPECIALLY thinking long-term in a qualifier (both of them play in Quito, so it is to our advantage that we start these two). Our selection of center mids suddenly has become the best I've seen. Adding Mendez to this duo makes our midfield only stronger. What a f*cking midfield man...wow!
I included Cevallos Jr. and not Gaibor onto this list because Cevallos is much more consistently playing and getting more minutes than Gaibor. Also, Cevallos tends to perform well when given opportunities. His opportunity on a consistent basis is overdue at this point.
Beder Caicedo or Cristian Cruz?:
This one is tough. I like Beder's last few games on the NT, but this season he hasn't really had the same spark as he did last season. With Mario Pineida riding the bench, he still seems to be the best option in BSC, and there aren't many other great options in the country. Ronaldo Johnson from Emelec does not convince. Cristian Cruz is a great option. Very consistent in Liga since last season and has carried over that consistency and performance into this season as well. Had an incredible game in Libertadores yesterday. This one is a tough decision IMO.
The absence of John Cifuente:
This was coming. Cifuente chose the money over his career development...which is completely fine, but not if you want to maintain yourself on this NT. In 9 games I think he's scored 2 goals which is far from the Cifuente we knew in Católica. Although he is mostly a starter in his team and plays 75% of most games on average, I don't see him being in his best moment so I consider him undeserving of being on the NT. Just my opinion.
Gabriel Achilier and JC Paredes:
There's no one topping these guys right now. If Byron Castillo from BSC were really Ecuadorian, I'd say that starting spot on the NT would be his, but it's too risky to call up that kid. And Achilier, wow....that man shut me up the last two games he played on the NT with Mina, so does he deserve to be on this list? Yes, no questions asked. Consistent starter and captain in Morelia. Until he proves otherwise, he should still be on the NT.
I’m thinking of going to the game in Orlando.
The list of players is out now http://www.futbolecuador.com/site/n...uador-para-enfrentar-a-eeuu-y-honduras/101851
Overall, I give it a 7/10. The list was very close to what I expected. I'm VERY surprised we did not include Robert Arboleda or Arturo Mina who are two of our most consistent and best defenders playing abroad. Especially Mina, who had performed really well in the last two friendly games we had. It was quite surprising to say the least, but on Transfermrkt it says he suffered a toe injury two weeks ago, so I'm assuming that is why. But as far as Arboleda, why is he not included? He's been consistent in Sao Paulo since he arrived there. I find it very weird. Maybe there was some act of indiscipline by him again that we don't know about and Bolillo stopped including him on the list. Jackson Porozo was definitely one of the most consistent players of the U-20, but I don't know if he deserves a spot over Arboleda. Unfortunately right now Franklin Guerra is just starting to get playing time since he came back from his injury, but he would definitely be someone to consider once he's fully recovered.
As far as Sornoza and Cazares not being on the list, I understand it...they never make an impact. So the people who consistently ask for them, that's your answer. I wish Cevallos Jr. would've made the cut, but he didn't.
My main concern: Where's Bryan Angulo and Miller Bolanos? We don't have better 9's than Angulo. Campana is not ready for the major NT. He's not even a starter in BSC. And Miller is doing pretty well in Tijuana to just ignore. Bolillo's failing in certain areas.
Narvaez is back on the list. The last time, there have been doubts on his inclusion but this time I am 100% certain he is no fluke. He is by a country mile the best CB in Peru and has been playing to a superb standard in the Libertadores
I haven't seen much of Narvaez to be honest, but I've heard his run in Peru has been really great. In Ecuador Narvaez had trouble standing out in his latter seasons with Liga de Quito. In Emelec he played as a right full-back and did pretty well, but after his time there he disappeared off the radar. Personally, if it weren't for so many injured center backs we have, I don't think he'd be considered in this list. Dario Aimar (Barcelona), Franklin Guerra (Liga de Quito), Anderson Ordonez (Liga de Quito), Arturo Mina (Yeni Malatyaspor, TUR) are all returning from injuries or currently injured. And then there's Robert Arboleda who has had an excellent run in Sao Paulo, but for one reason or another isn't being included in the roster anymore. It surprises me honestly. So there's a good 5 center backs on the verge of returning, in addition to Xavier Arreaga and Gabriel Achilier who are already on the roster, which makes it hard to believe Narvaez will be included in the future. I honestly don't know if he should even be there now because that should be Robert Arboleda's spot.
In any case, I hope he performs well if given the opportunity.I think the starters for the next two games will be Arreaga and Achilier though. I will be very surprised and to some degree disappointed if Bolillo goes with Narvaez as a starter, but then again I don't expect anything great from Bolillo.
Liga de Quito players shi**ting the bed. Not sure why they were called up. Waste of time and $$$$.
I just got my tickets for the game in Orlando.
What’s up with this line up? Why no forward? It never works for us. Achilier and Paredes
I’m expecting the right side to get owned by USA unless Valencia drops that far down.
For real,It’s like Bolillo is just going to learn.
4-3-3 for both sides,should be interesting!
What did I say about Paredes?
And Achilier getting beat in the air why are we still calling these two up? Anyone else can fill their shoes.
So,0 plays generated so far ,except for that Valencia pass.