2018-19 Roster Movement Thread

Discussion in 'Sporting Kansas City' started by vividox, Nov 30, 2018.

  1. Inca Roads

    Inca Roads Member+

    Nov 22, 2012
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Hard to say. I mean, Pete has been pretty clear that Nemeth should be the front runner.

    And I swear to god Hurtado better not be our main man. He's a downgrade from Shelton, who was in my opinion less than we needed...
     
  2. AndyMead

    AndyMead Homo Sapien

    Nov 2, 1999
    Seat 12A
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    But this is Peter who thought he should flank Dwyer with Zusi and Peterson for a season. Putting out wingers who aren't a threat to score is what Vermes does.
     
  3. Inca Roads

    Inca Roads Member+

    Nov 22, 2012
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    I dunno, he both placed goal-threat wingers on the field and then managing the team in a way to give them greater offensive license. Last year was an interesting evolution of ol Pete.
     
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  4. AndyMead

    AndyMead Homo Sapien

    Nov 2, 1999
    Seat 12A
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Sure, and he also seems to understand how subs work from time to time. I'm always afraid that he'll keep reverting instead of moving forward.

    Just a fear.
     
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  5. BenDover

    BenDover BigSoccer Supporter

    Aug 4, 2010
    Rio Verde, AZ
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    With the MLS draft coming up, I just don’t see SKC using any of their picks unless there is some rough cut diamond that no other team seems to recognize still available when it comes their turn. I think anything after their first pick will go as part of a trade or they will not pick anyone. I don’t think SKC has gotten an impact player in the draft since Dwyer.
     
  6. Buzz Killington

    Buzz Killington Member+

    Oct 6, 2002
    Lee's Summit
    Club:
    Kansas City Wizards
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Were not gonna make any trades, or I’d be surprised if we do. We’re drafting for SPR roster spots. If we sign any of our draft picks I’d pretty much guarantee they’d spend most of the season with SPR anyway.
     
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  7. mschofield

    mschofield Member+

    May 16, 2000
    Berlin
    Club:
    Union Berlin
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    I watched as much of one of the conbine matches as i could force myself to pay attention to and would have to say that even among the so-called best this draft has to offer, SPR is a good level, and most is a decent step up. I think the homegrown trend has really sucked most of the talent out of the combine. If we replaced the SPR first 11 with either of the 11s on display last night, it would be a step down in quality. They're certainly competent footballers, technically fine, but the explosiveness needed to make the next step? Are any of these players showing that? IMO this is a good thing. The ethical toxicity of big time college football and basketball is best avoided as we grow soccer in the US.
     
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  8. AndyMead

    AndyMead Homo Sapien

    Nov 2, 1999
    Seat 12A
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    This is my 11th Combine in the last 12 years. There's a real "dead man walking" feel about it this year. I think the Combine will continue to exist, but I can definitely see it changing. The SuperDraft isn't going anywhere, regardless of Homegrown signings and such, as long as it draws media attention to MLS in January. As long as the SuperDraft exists, there's a good reason to have a Combine.

    The parts of the Combine that are useful for the SuperDraft are:
    1 - player testing. The jump/sprint/relay and health numbers are important. One, you get a consistent number from a trusted single source across the talent pool. Additionally, it can help teams understand which players really are serious - the ones that understand that they need to keep themselves fit and ready in the offseason. Many of these players haven't played competitively since early to mid-November.
    2 - 1 on 1 interviews. This is where teams really get a chance to evaluate whether a player is mature enough and a good fit for their organization.
    3 - This one has a need regardless of the Combine/SuperDraft - It gets all the team technical staffs together in one location. It's a good annual connection point where everyone can spend a week on both social and business. Concerns and best practices can be covered as a group. It also allows everyone to get on the same page with regards to league initiatives that involve on field and off field technical issues and rules.

    I can definitely see the league pulling back to a more NFL-like Combine where the focus shifts to the player testing component and maybe even doing away with the games. Tomorrow will be interesting as this year does not feature the round-robin, but only two days with full 11v11 games. Tomorrow each of the four "teams" will have their own block of time at the stadium for small sided games and training.
     
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  9. Blando13

    Blando13 Member+

    Dec 4, 2013
    Lee's Summit, MO
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I think I'd feel the same with if SKC has the #1 overall pick. The quality coming out of the draft is squad level MLS at this point in time. Yes, a player can get drafted and fill in nicely, or maybe it's a perfect fit, but at this point, the odds are way against getting a player that can earn 20% of the available MLS minutes (on SKC anyway).
     
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  10. Blando13

    Blando13 Member+

    Dec 4, 2013
    Lee's Summit, MO
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Do you think the Draft will get shortened? Honestly 2 rounds is probably too many, but I doubt they get smaller than that, but there is no reason that if teams have an eye on a player that falls out of the top 2 rounds, they aren't able to "pick" them up without having to compete internally (vs other MLS squads). I'd be up for getting USL more involved and maybe paying for part of the Combine and allowing them to pick a couple of rounds after MLS picks 2 or something similar. Not sure how realistic that is at this point though.
     
  11. AndyMead

    AndyMead Homo Sapien

    Nov 2, 1999
    Seat 12A
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    I think my first SuperDraft (KC, 2003) was 6x10. with another 2 or 4 supplemental rounds later. Now it's 2x24 with two more supplemental rounds later.

    I don't think there's a need for 96 picks, but then baseball has hundreds and hundreds. The NBA on the other hand only has 60 picks total.

    We've reached a point, especially with homegrown signings, where there's really no need to go much further than 48 (or next year 52) picks - unless there's a restructuring that includes how USL rosters are made up. NBA teams only have 15 or so contract players with the rights to a few G-League bodies. MLB teams have a "40 man roster" with 25 MLB and 15 in the minors, not to mention a lot of minor leaguers under MLB team control. MLS is much more akin to MLB with 30/25 and only one level of minor league team.

    The current value of the two supplemental rounds is that those draft picks are kinda the monopoly money trade balancing picks that people throw around.

    If the MLS/USL agreement persists and the more successful MLS teams show that having a farm team is important, than I would expect that third and fourth round to remain as roster builders for the USL side - as long as, say, SKC can assign a player to SPR without burning a 30-man roster spot.

    It's not in the league's interest to create free agents. The MLSPA, on the other hand, would probably like to chop the SuperDraft down to one or two rounds. The NBA Draft went to two rounds as part of CBA negotiations. And that would be a rather cheap concession from MLS to MLSPA - but it's a concession that can only be used once.

    Short answer: No freakin' clue.
     
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  12. Blando13

    Blando13 Member+

    Dec 4, 2013
    Lee's Summit, MO
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I can't find it now, but this morning I thought I read that Atlanta United signed a draft eligible player (one maybe not at the Combine), a GK, to a ATL U2 contract ... effectively bypassing the draft process to sign a player to a USL contract. If that's the case ... wtf are we doing this draft thing for if you can go sign a player to a USL contract prior to the draft.

    Now, if a MLS team other than ATL "drafts" that player, would they have his MLS rights, meaning ATL needed to trade for those rights or not be allowed to put him on the MLS roster?

    The CBA/MLSPA method of shortening the draft is interesting. I think they (MLSPU) should also try to work towards having players enter the draft earlier than Senior (or the G.A. program). That would help get players to Free Agency sooner if they're drafted younger. Those players can obviously leave college, sign with USL teams and get an MLS contract prior to their senior season as well, but it's a bigger risk to ditch college for a USL contract (right now anyways) than for a MLS one.
     
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  13. mschofield

    mschofield Member+

    May 16, 2000
    Berlin
    Club:
    Union Berlin
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    It's tough to do away with the draft because it's expected in the US, and because the club density is pretty low. There are probably a lot of decent players who go unseen by MLS or USL clubs before college.
     
  14. Buzz Killington

    Buzz Killington Member+

    Oct 6, 2002
    Lee's Summit
    Club:
    Kansas City Wizards
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    On the USL/MLS thing I'm not sure how that works, because there's a certain number of players on your USL team that you can "claim" as your own (we named Oliveira one back the first year we had him with SPR).

    As for letting players leave school earlier without GA, I'm not sure MLSPU would go for that, b/c it would affect their current members, potentially leading some to lose their job. It also really won't help that much in getting to free agency earlier, players still have to be 28 AND have 8 years experience. Those likely to reach both milestones are already likely to leave early as GA anyway.
     
  15. Blando13

    Blando13 Member+

    Dec 4, 2013
    Lee's Summit, MO
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I forgot about the 28 years AND 8 years ... thought it was "OR" instead of AND.
     
  16. mschofield

    mschofield Member+

    May 16, 2000
    Berlin
    Club:
    Union Berlin
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    I have to admit, I kind of wish we'd made the deal Philly did. As far as the SKC roster is concerned, I think we've got room at the top, but not the depth position, and certainly not at the next year development level (we are loaded there).
     
  17. Blando13

    Blando13 Member+

    Dec 4, 2013
    Lee's Summit, MO
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Couldn't agree more. I mean, add in where we're drafting and it would be a no brainer. How does Cinci expect to roster that many players without a USL squad. Sounds like teams are wanting to move down and that draft picks aren't worth what they once were regarding TAM/GAM. To be honest, I'd have taken less than Philly got.
     
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  18. BenDover

    BenDover BigSoccer Supporter

    Aug 4, 2010
    Rio Verde, AZ
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Either FCC knows something no one else in the league knows or they are just rolling the dice hoping for that one or two guys out of the draft who just might make an impact. They may want to peek over the fence at Atlanta or LAFC for ways to build a club while completely ignoring the Orlando or MUFC models.
     
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  19. mschofield

    mschofield Member+

    May 16, 2000
    Berlin
    Club:
    Union Berlin
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    I think Cinci has done a decent job to this point, making the defensive side a bit of a priority but with a strong striker for goals. But looking at the roster on their page, they have 21 players right now and they're saying they won't be adding another DP. They might be thinking or keeping the best four or five or even 7 of their 10 picks. We have a couple empty spots, but I'd think those are to be filled only by players who at the very least can challenge for a regular starting spot. Plus, of course, a replacement for Davis, Mapp or Evans. Can't do without one of those.
     
  20. Inca Roads

    Inca Roads Member+

    Nov 22, 2012
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Are we still lacking depth for Ilie? Will this be his third season in a row without anyone to soak up some of his minutes?
     
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  21. mschofield

    mschofield Member+

    May 16, 2000
    Berlin
    Club:
    Union Berlin
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    Fontas? He played some Dmid in La Liga. I mean, only 24 matches versus the 120 he had as a CB, but it is enough for an Ilie backup perhaps
     
  22. mschofield

    mschofield Member+

    May 16, 2000
    Berlin
    Club:
    Union Berlin
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    Also, could Roger work as a dmid? He can tackle, pass and reads the game well. A couple years ago it would be an obvious no, but he's more controlled now.
     
  23. Blando13

    Blando13 Member+

    Dec 4, 2013
    Lee's Summit, MO
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I also think Felipe can play there and get a bit more attack minded in the midfield with Rowe or Busio playing Felipe's spot.

    Also, there's a D Mid from Wake that I've read would be a potential fit but I'm not sure he'll fall to our 1st round pick and even LESS sure Vermes would draft him, but he's a possession oriented #6. Brad Dunwell's his name. The McCabe kid from ND who plays the same spot would be another option.

    I also could see us going fullback due to the depth there.
     
  24. Inca Roads

    Inca Roads Member+

    Nov 22, 2012
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Not sure about Fontas. I mean, we won an MLS Cup with a CB playing that position, but I'm leery about moving a center back into the midfield and calling it a day. Usually doesn't work particularly well.

    I still think Roger is a strong no on that. Same with Gutierrez. Not only are they important starters at different positions in the midfield, the dmid position is incredibly important in Vermes's setup. Such a guy needs a handful of specific talents and tendencies, and I think neither Roger nor Felipe are positionally astute enough to fill that role. I could be wrong.

    I just don't see anyone on this roster right now I'm at all comfortable seeing fill in for Ilie.
     
  25. Blando13

    Blando13 Member+

    Dec 4, 2013
    Lee's Summit, MO
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I could see that, but think Felipe would be more likely but that's based on what I thought of him BEFORE he came to KC ... where he's surprised me a bit on his offensive abilities.
     

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