What is their play here? PSRA will probably send out a memo/statement condemning thr decision, but no one will really care. If they really want to make a statement isn't a strike the only real play if they want to play "hard ball" as you say?
That's the interesting thing here... the independent review panel is supposed to consist of a representative from US Soccer, Canada Soccer, and PRO. So does that mean PRO thinks this is an obvious error? Or is the PRO rep not really that independent?
The incident that led to the 2CT? It was a stomp. As I said in that thread, not sure how it's not VC or nothing. I don't want to go too far off the rails here since this is an important MLS discussion. But note I was talking about attempted strikes. Of course you can have a regular careless strike. But I think an attempted careless strike is less plausible. Reckless attempted strike is possible, but would be very rare.
As someone who saw this coming, you can't really be surprised at this. Orlando made a huge stink. Jason Kreis flipped out about it, and I can guarantee that he has the names and cell numbers of the guys on that committee. PRO obviously can't do a thing about it, because it was their rep that voted for this. The only action that would be remotely feasible for PSRA is for Ortiz to simply get tossed early on in the next game too. But that is bringing a knife to a gunfight. Or I suppose they could do what the Mexican refs did and simply refuse to referee any MLS game until Ortiz is suspended and the supporters guy is banned. But I honestly don't know if PSRA could pull that off over this. Finally, the PRO rep supposedly talked to Unkel after Unkel watched video of the incident. So if Unkel was dodgy about it after, then the PRO rep of course isn't going to back him. It would be interesting if Unkel leaked what he said after the game. If PSRA wanted to do something about this, they'd have to get Unkel's view of it out there, because if he did waiver, then this is over.
There's a lot of speculation in this post that I don't think will help me at the lower level. Although it would annoy me if some Jason Kreis Jr is calling my assignors. What bothers me is how PRO can emphasize Serious Foul Play one week, and then downplay it the very next. I'm not concerned about what a professional league committee does (for instance what if the player was hurt), I'm concerned about what us referees do. What lesson do we take from this? http://www.proreferees.com/news-play-of-the-week-2017-week-13.php Serious Foul Play “A tackle or challenge that endangers the safety of an opponent or uses excessive force or brutality must be sanctioned as serious foul play. “Any player who lunges at an opponent for the ball from the front, from the side or from behind using one or two legs, with excessive force or endangers the safety of an opponent is guilty of serious foul play.”
Simply put, this is bullshit. How they justify this, I don’t know. Ramos connects with Vincent’s knee, causes it to buckle, and takes him out. When it comes to potential leg breaking tackles (whether accidental or through an aggressive challenge), the league has to err on the side of punishment. This isn’t a case of mistaken identity. This is just them saying that the referee got it wrong and ignoring the LOTG. MLS just decided the "in the opinion of the referee" part doesn't apply. When it comes to referee harassment, they damn well better hand out lifetime bans for anyone distributing contact info. They got this 100% wrong. What a disappointment. http://i.imgur.com/Nu392Oe.gifv
While I can't know what every one of them is specifically feeling, I can assure you that, in general, they're pretty pissed off.
Lol bigsoccer refs forum when fans are upset about a referee's decision: "Stupid fans simply don't understand the lotg, how dare they accuse the officials of bias, incompetence and poor judgement. That is beyond the pale and disgusting. The refs know more than you do, and their decision is final. Why can't fans accept that like adults?" Refs forum when DisCo makes a decision they don't like: "REEEE the DisCo is incompetent, takes its marching orders from Don Garber, Jason Kreis, OCSC supporters, and ISIS!!! MLS refs should go on strike forebber and hold their breath until they get their bedtime extended by an hour!!" OCSC followed the proper procedures, and DisCo overturned the red based on their judgement of the facts within the context of those procedures. Deal with it, just like you tell fans to deal with it when they don't like how a call went against their team.
I was going to engage here, only to the extent that I was going to point out that you don't know what you're talking about because the DisCo didn't overturn the card. Then I was going to leave the post and let others engage you. But then I looked at your profile. I see that since 2004, on this entire site you've posted twice, both times to troll the referee forum. So I decided to deal with the obvious fact that you're a sock puppet for another account and took action. If you don't like it, contact the DisCo. @Ismitje
When people see inconsistencies they point them out as being unfair. This ruling is inconsistent with what the MLS and PRO tell us is the proper way to rule red cards. So that's either a communication problem, or interpretation, or it's something else. We want to know what they see that we do not see, what has influenced their decision and what "Facts" you say they took into account. That's the problem with this situation, this is a secretive group that will not come forward with an explanation, just tells us it's ruling, and the ruling doesn't make sense. I'm sure being from "New Yawk" you can understand how frustrating that could be.
DisCo did not overturn anything. There is an independent review panel composed of 1 rep each from PRO, US Soccer, and CSA (Canadian Soccer)
PSRA posted an open letter to the Professional Referee Organization here, which is a really good read: http://www.refereeassociation.net/a...-mls-fans-players-teams-supporters-and-staff/ A couple key quotes from the letter:
The contradiction here is the key. The body in charge of referees told the referee in question he got it right. Then the same body uses its voice to overturn the red card, when if it had remained consistent, the card would have stood. That should concern all MLS fans, regardless of what they think of the tackle. Because either PRO is issuing bad instruction (and therefore wrongly praising Unkel in private) or it is kowtowing to public pressure from a club to rescind a legitimate call. That's a scandal.
"This lack of transparency and inherent inconsistency should be of concern to everyone" Welcome to MLS! It has been ever thus since 1996. No one should be surprised by this
I can't imagine why PRO thought they could get away with this without this coming out. Why don't we not have PRO? Why can't we go back to having an Independent Professional Referee Organization? I think the power is in the referees hands again, to walk away and see if PRO wants to find more scabs.
If the quote attributed to Peter Walton in that letter is accurate, he is a feckless moron who is unfit to lead a referee organization at any level.
That was a VERY well written statement and is very damning to PRO. As a fan of the game, MLS and the Sounders, all I want is for consistency and the laws of the game to be upheld, even when I don't fully understand them or when it doesn't go in my teams favor. Perhaps the PRO representative on the Independent review panels needs to be removed and someone from the PSRA should be their replacement.