2017 Gold Cup qualifiers [R]

Discussion in 'Gold Cup' started by Paul Calixte, Jun 8, 2016.

  1. Paul Calixte

    Paul Calixte Moderator
    Staff Member

    Orlando City SC
    Apr 30, 2009
    Miami, FL
    Club:
    Orlando City SC
    Country:
    United States
    Hi everyone,

    I normally would have waited until October, when the final round of Caribbean qualifying for the Gold Cup (the semifinal round of the 2016-17 Caribbean Cup) takes place, but there is some relevant news to share:

    We will have a debutant at the next tournament.

    FutbolBoricua reports that Puerto Rico, who have made it to the third round of the Caribbean Cup for the first time in their history, will be in the same group as Antigua and Barbuda and Curaçao. The winner of said group will qualify for the Gold Cup, while the second-place team has to avoid being the worst runner-up in the round to make the Caribbean playoff group - the winner of which will face the fifth-place team from the Copa Centroamericana (scheduled for January 2017 in Panama) for the final Gold Cup berth.
     
  2. EvanJ

    EvanJ Member+

    Manchester United
    United States
    Mar 30, 2004
    Nassau County, NY
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Country:
    United States
    Wikipedia says Antigua and Barbuda will be grouped with Puerto Rico and Curacao unless Antigua and Barbuda gets passed by the second place team from Group 4. http://www.royalgazette.com/soccer/article/20160608/bermuda-face-french-guiana-in-must-win-replay says the abandoned French Guiana-Bermuda game will be replayed June 19. Bermuda and French Guiana each have a -1 goal differential, and Antigua and Barbuda has a +3. Therefore as long as the French Guiana-Bermuda game is a draw or has a margin of victory of 3 goals or fewer, both of them will be behind Antigua and Barbuda.
     
  3. Paul Calixte

    Paul Calixte Moderator
    Staff Member

    Orlando City SC
    Apr 30, 2009
    Miami, FL
    Club:
    Orlando City SC
    Country:
    United States
    Now I told y'all that your NT promos aren't nearly as hype as Caribbean NT promos, right? :D

    Here's the one for Haiti-French Guiana (Facebook login may be required). I especially enjoy the part when the announcer says: "Jamaica? Beat 'em. Trinidad [& Tobago]? Beat 'em. Cuba? Beat 'em." :cool: Also the fact that the video's basically a Duckens Nazon mixtape :ROFLMAO:
     
  4. EvanJ

    EvanJ Member+

    Manchester United
    United States
    Mar 30, 2004
    Nassau County, NY
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Country:
    United States
    Why did the CFU choose to make a group of three second place teams to decide who finishes fifth? All four second place teams could have played in a group that didn't take any more matchdays than a group of three does. If the CFU didn't want to advance every second place team, I think they should have advanced two of them to play a two leg series.
     
  5. Paul Calixte

    Paul Calixte Moderator
    Staff Member

    Orlando City SC
    Apr 30, 2009
    Miami, FL
    Club:
    Orlando City SC
    Country:
    United States
    My guess, for this as well as the entire tournament format (final round excepted), is that while three matchdays are used, each team only plays twice, allowing the CFU to throw the tournament inside FIFA dates. If the CFU and UNCAF didn't keep the same formats from 2014 (making use of FIFA dates), I imagine it is because of pushback from FIFA and potentially from European clubs to shoehorning more than two games in the same FIFA window.
     
  6. Paul Calixte

    Paul Calixte Moderator
    Staff Member

    Orlando City SC
    Apr 30, 2009
    Miami, FL
    Club:
    Orlando City SC
    Country:
    United States
    This evening, Curaçao beat Puerto Rico 3-2 and Martinique overcame Trinidad and Tobago 2-0, both AET, to win their respective groups with 6 points and qualify for the Gold Cup.

    Elsewhere, Jamaica and Suriname both beat Guyana and will play off for the Gold Cup berth when their fixture gets rescheduled. Haiti's games got wiped out by Hurricane Matthew; French Guiana beat St. Kitts and Nevis 1-0, but both will have to play Haiti at later dates.
     
  7. Athlone

    Athlone Member

    Feb 2, 2013
    Country:
    Jamaica
    That's what happens when you leave all of your starters at home and expect to walk over a "minnow", even though you aren't exactly a powerhouse yourself. Jamaica is lucky to escape with the 4-2 win, that first half they played didn't look anything at all like a winning side.

    Big game coming up next against Suriname at home, which will determine which of us gets to go to the Gold Cup. As Paul Calixte noted, it will be in Jamaica at a date to be scheduled (my bet would be the November FIFA date, since both countries are out of WC contention and won't be doing anything; alternatively, if that doesn't work out, I expect a January match). Hopefully we call a stronger side this time. The team selected for this match was clearly a c-team and also wasn't even chosen by the coach, Tappa Whitmore (the outgoing coach, Winfried Schaefer, chose the side before he departed). Next time around we need to call more of our starters and ensure Tappa can pick the players he wants. There's no guarantee we get by this Suriname team - I don't take any Caribbean side lightly.

    On another note, huge congratulations arevdue to Curacao, who qualify for their first ever Gold Cup. They've relied heavily on their Dutch-born/raised diaspora (led by EPL veterans Leandro Bacuna and Cuco Martina) to get the job done this year and it has worked. I'm going to be very interested to see how they hold up against Gold Cup level competition. I think they'll surprise some.
     
  8. Surinamese-man

    Aug 20, 2008
    Club:
    --other--
    I can insure you that Jamaica will win this.It's not that i'm against my own team but the fact is,those local players from Suriname are low quality with poor performance.The Surinamese FA tried to make it possible to use oversees players,but politics will not cooperate.And i don't know when they ever will do.The only hopeful thing is that the Surinamese FA is going to professionalize football in 2017 probably starting with 8 local clubs,but this will take years to get everything organized well.

    It is wishful thinking to think at this moment that we can beat you guys ,simply for the reason that Jamaica's FA (also counts for Trinidad & Tobago) is much more organized playing at a top level for many years while Suriname has never done anything to get the football to a higher level.Yes,in 2017,but we are already very late!And even then there is no guarantee for a good working system.

    Also my congratulations to Curacao,they've done a good job so far.Always good to see Caribbean team making it so far.I hope we will some day,time will tell.

    I predict Jamaica - Suriname 3-1
    Good luck for both teams!
     
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  9. Paul Calixte

    Paul Calixte Moderator
    Staff Member

    Orlando City SC
    Apr 30, 2009
    Miami, FL
    Club:
    Orlando City SC
    Country:
    United States
    If winning is out of reach, I'd shoot to lose by only 1 - that way, Suriname would finish with 3 points and a goal differential of 0, better than Antigua and Barbuda's -1 GD and good for making the fifth-place playoff group.
     
    Surinamese-man repped this.
  10. Athlone

    Athlone Member

    Feb 2, 2013
    Country:
    Jamaica
    I see what you are saying. I have followed Suriname's efforts to get its overseas player eligible. It is a tremendous shame that politicians are holding that up, because the amount and quality of Suriname-eligible players in the Netherlands is so great. Suriname could really be a force if they were allowed to use those players. I think they would be better than Curacao.

    In any case, despite your warning, I will not take your side lightly and I will implore the coaches and administrators of Jamaica not to take your side lightly either. You may be disorganized right now and not competing at the highest level lately, but the ball is round and can roll in any direction it pleases. Anything can happen, and bigger surprises have occurred before.

    Whatever happens, good luck for both sides!
     
    Surinamese-man repped this.
  11. Paul Calixte

    Paul Calixte Moderator
    Staff Member

    Orlando City SC
    Apr 30, 2009
    Miami, FL
    Club:
    Orlando City SC
    Country:
    United States
  12. Paul Calixte

    Paul Calixte Moderator
    Staff Member

    Orlando City SC
    Apr 30, 2009
    Miami, FL
    Club:
    Orlando City SC
    Country:
    United States
    They just conducted the draw for the Copa Centroamericana 2017 in Panama, resulting in the following groups:

    Group A

    Panama
    Honduras
    Nicaragua
    Belize

    Group B

    Costa Rica
    Guatemala
    El Salvador
     
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  13. EvanJ

    EvanJ Member+

    Manchester United
    United States
    Mar 30, 2004
    Nassau County, NY
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Country:
    United States
    Group A has 4! = 24 possible combinations, but anything other than these four would be very surprising:

    1. Panama-Honduras-Nicaragua-Belize
    2. Panama-Honduras-Belize-Nicaragua
    3. Honduras-Panama-Nicaragua-Belize
    4. Honduras-Panama-Belize-Nicaragua

    Group B has 3! = 6 possible combinations, but it would be shocking if Costa Rica didn't win the group, which leaves two combinations. Multiplying the two groups, there are 144 possible combinations, but anything other than a specific 8 would be very surprising.
     
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  14. Paul Calixte

    Paul Calixte Moderator
    Staff Member

    Orlando City SC
    Apr 30, 2009
    Miami, FL
    Club:
    Orlando City SC
    Country:
    United States
    MAJOR update: FIFA has just suspended the Guatemalan federation over government interference - specifically, not accepting the FIFA decision to extend the normalization committee's mandate. If they don't get in line in time, Guatemala are out of the Copa Centroamericana...at which point, I guess UNCAF would have to either redraw the whole tournament or just redraw Pot 3 to see which of Nicaragua and Belize head over to Group B.

    Btw: technically, a 6-team Copa Centroamericana wouldn't eliminate anyone in the group stage, which would be a first in world football IIRC.
     
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  15. edcalvi

    edcalvi Moderator
    Staff Member

    May 1, 2005
    Nevada
    The best option is just one Group of 6 national teams round robin. .
    This is the format that Copa UNCAF had in the past.
     
  16. EvanJ

    EvanJ Member+

    Manchester United
    United States
    Mar 30, 2004
    Nassau County, NY
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Country:
    United States
    Who is the newest member of UNCAF? You quoted my post from yesterday in a Guatemala topic. I'll repost it here:

    "If the suspension remains, Guatemala can't play in the Gold Cup. The more immediate concern is the Copa Centroamerica. Guatemala was put in the group of 3, which also has Costa Rica and El Salvador. If Guatemala doesn't play, I hope Belize or Nicaragua gets moved to that group to make 2 groups of 3. If there is a group of 2 (which isn't a "group") and a group of 4, there couldn't be the Fifth Place Game between the third place teams because one group wouldn't have a third place team. Alternatively, rather than playing a Group Stage, Semifinals, Final, Third Place Game, and Fifth Place Game; with 6 teams everybody could play each opponent once, which wouldn't take any more matchdays than the 5 that are already scheduled. I don't think UNCAF would change the format to that on short notice, but if I had to plan a Copa Centroamericana with 6 teams, I would have 5 matchdays with 3 games each and every team playing each opponent once."

    Imagine if Guatemala had reached the Hexagonal and then gotten suspended.
     
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  17. slaminsams

    slaminsams Member+

    Mar 22, 2010
    As far as I can tell the UNCAF has only had a single table of six countries once in 2003. The newest member being Belize which started playing in 95 but before then teams would have to qualify for the UNCAF cup which was between 4 teams. They moved to six in 97 with a play in game and two groups of 3. The current format of a group of a group of 4 and one of 3 looks to have started in 2001 with the change in format in 03 of one table with six teams then back to two groups after that.
     
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  18. Paul Calixte

    Paul Calixte Moderator
    Staff Member

    Orlando City SC
    Apr 30, 2009
    Miami, FL
    Club:
    Orlando City SC
    Country:
    United States
    Mind you, this would mean a massive increase in fixtures...to 15, rather than the current 14. :D
     
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  19. edcalvi

    edcalvi Moderator
    Staff Member

    May 1, 2005
    Nevada
    How about a single group, everyone plays each other once. What do you think is better?
     
  20. Paul Calixte

    Paul Calixte Moderator
    Staff Member

    Orlando City SC
    Apr 30, 2009
    Miami, FL
    Club:
    Orlando City SC
    Country:
    United States
    Under the circumstances - if UNCAF has to hold this tournament w/only 6 teams, and outside of a FIFA window - it is arguably the best option. And it's not as if the bigger teams can complain: unless they planned to be in the Fifth-Place Match, they were going to play five games anyways.
     
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  21. Paul Calixte

    Paul Calixte Moderator
    Staff Member

    Orlando City SC
    Apr 30, 2009
    Miami, FL
    Club:
    Orlando City SC
    Country:
    United States
    And the shockers keep coming... French Guiana beat Haiti 5-2 in Port-au-Prince to take six points, win the group and qualify for their first-ever Gold Cup. Now the St. Kitts and Nevis-Haiti match on Sunday will determine who will finish second; keeping Antigua and Barbuda's -1 GD in mind, St. Kitts and Nevis can win by any score to reach the 5th-place playoff group, while Haiti must win by two.
     
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  22. EvanJ

    EvanJ Member+

    Manchester United
    United States
    Mar 30, 2004
    Nassau County, NY
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Country:
    United States
    In another group, Jamaica hosts Suriname and they have 3 points each. Jamaica is at +2 and Suriname is at +1. Jamaica and Suriname both beat Guyana in extra time, and Wikipedia says the tiebreaker after goal differential is wins in regulation, which would give Antigua and Barbuda the tiebreaker over Jamaica if Jamaica lost by 3 to go to -1 or over Suriname if Suriname lost by 2 to go to -1. If Jamaica vs. Suriname is a draw, a win by 1 goal, or a Suriname win by 2 goals, Jamaica and Suriname would both be ahead of Antigua and Barbuda. I think Jamaica is more likely to beat Suriname than to lose to Suriname. If Jamaica were to win by 3 or more to make Suriname go to -2 or worse, the St. Kitts and Nevis vs. Haiti winner would advance over Suriname with a regulation win by any score. The games are on Sunday, with Jamaica vs. Suriname at 6:00 P.M. USA Eastern and St. Kitts and Nevis vs. Haiti 1 hour later.
     
  23. dinamo_zagreb

    dinamo_zagreb Member+

    Jun 27, 2010
    San Jose, CA / Zagreb, Croatia
    Club:
    --other--
    Country:
    Croatia
    Congrats to Guiana. So at least two teams set for their debuts.
     
  24. Paul Calixte

    Paul Calixte Moderator
    Staff Member

    Orlando City SC
    Apr 30, 2009
    Miami, FL
    Club:
    Orlando City SC
    Country:
    United States
    Mind you, if the three qualifiers so far are surprising, it's not entirely unexpected. Martinique's been to the Gold Cup on several occasions; Curaçao and French Guiana were regularly participating in Caribbean Cup finals, so it was only a matter of time before they finally broke the mold.
     
  25. Brokostong

    Brokostong New Member

    Jan 17, 2009
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Country:
    Surinam
    Athlone,do you have any idea why Jamaica didn't call up their pro League players? Because the news came in the Surinamese media that the JFF Didn't or almost didn't call up their Jamaican pro players.Why is this?

    I saw these names (below) and many Jamaican fans are angry and very disappointed.

    GOAL:
    Andre Blake

    DEFENDERS:
    Dicoy Williams
    Damion Lowe
    Shaun Francis
    Rosario Harriott

    MIDFIELDERS:
    Dwayne Ambursely
    Ewan Grandison
    Michael Binns
    Owayne Gordon

    FORWARDS:
    Dino Williams
    Corey Burke,
     

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