2017-2018 Champion's League Thread

Discussion in 'Juventus' started by juveeer, Aug 18, 2017.

  1. thinredline10

    thinredline10 Member+

    Juventus
    Apr 2, 2017
    Great transfer strategy buying no running back so the right winger can play defense too.

    Maybe that is why this team is not scoring goals... we got Gonzalo who effectively is doing a kind of cherry picking up top, we throw Paulo underneath him and basically tell him... you make up for the lack of creation and also provide defense

    we don't really have a true defensive back on the roster... Licht is, but he is def on the decline... so we just plug in a trio of a failed mid(stu), the aging Licht, and MDS who never proved he was that. and sometimes we play Barzagli there.

    So the right winger must also play defense and basically a hybrid box to box outside mid. Sandro is talented, but he doesnt excel in defense and then we have a failed midfielder( didnt deserve his injuries and he works hard tho) who provides depth for Sandro.

    It is not surprising that we are planning to use Howedes there actually at all.

    Mario is the only one asked to play out of position who truly is consistent in quality, but Max plays him so much and without relief that he gets run into the ground in the 2nd half of the season. Mario is a boss and plays hurt, but it would be nice to see a rested and healthy Mario playing in big CL games.
     
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  2. IcEWoLF

    IcEWoLF Member+

    Juventus
    Jul 15, 2014
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Marchisio pre Injury was, but ever since he was out for so long he hasn’t been the same.

    As of right now it’s Pjanic and Matuidi our stars, Khedira is a close third because he can score and attack well when playing close to goal, Marchisio is 4th in the depth chart.
     
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  3. IcEWoLF

    IcEWoLF Member+

    Juventus
    Jul 15, 2014
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States

    Hopefully that happens when Pjaca gets healthy again, he is a beast and can dribble well, he just needs to stay healthy so we can finally rotate him into the System.
     
  4. Afghan-Juventus

    Afghan-Juventus Member+

    Oct 14, 2012
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Afghanistan
    but if he can get in good shape he can go back to the top with Pjanic.
     
  5. soccerr9

    soccerr9 Member+

    Jun 6, 2005
    Juve and Barca need 1 point to each qualify. Can't imagine that either team will take too many risks in their next match vs one another. Had Juve won yesterday, winning the group would have been a very real possibility. Instead Juve now need to beat Barca 3-0 which is never going to happen.

    Plus, finishing first or second won't be hugely important given the way the groups are shaping up. Real, Juve, Bayern, Chelsea, Napoli could all finish as runner ups.
     
  6. soccerr9

    soccerr9 Member+

    Jun 6, 2005
    #681 soccerr9, Nov 1, 2017
    Last edited: Nov 1, 2017
    Oops I thought Sporting was on 2 points. Juve need one win to quality or a Sporting loss in one of their remaining matches. With Sporting traveling to Barca in the final match day, Juve are 90% through. I can't seem Sporting winning in Spain unless Barca gift them a result.

    There is weird scenario where Barca, Sporting, and Juve could all finish with 10 points. Juve would likely be out in that scenario (head-to-head between those three teams is unfavorable due to the 3-0 L away to Barca).

    Frustratingly in the two matches vs Sporting, Juve gave up 3 shots on target yet conceded twice. Two years ago when Juve had their awful start, this is what I remember happening. Like that season, I doubt Juve will continue allowing goals on a minimal number of shots. Eventually (we can hope), this should even out.
     
  7. gumbacicc

    gumbacicc Member+

    Dec 7, 2004
    USA
    Perhaps the reason that Bernardeschi isn't playing is because he hasn't done enough to convince Allegri (who sees him every day) in training. Bernardeschi has not set the world ablaze when he has played. I'm not saying he is a bad player. However, he isn't this superstar you are making him out to be.

    You have taken issue with two players that have actually contributed this season. Cuadrado was our best player yesterday, and has been solid this season. That is why he is playing. Mandzukic, despite the poor outing yesterday, has been arguably the most consistent player all season. I haven't seen anything from Costa or Bernardeschi to show me why Allegri is mistaken in preferring Cuadrado and Mandzukic.

    I agree with you regarding the transfer market. If Cuadrado still figured in Allegri's plans, it was foolish to go out and get both Costa and Bernardeschi. The season is still young. Both will get their chances; but let's not make it out to be some scandal that they aren't starting--and let's stop with the Bernardeschi is this great, young Italian player stuff. I love the national team, but Bernardeschi isn't Bruno Conti. I want Juve to win; not just to field players because they're Italian.
     
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  8. soccerr9

    soccerr9 Member+

    Jun 6, 2005
    I mostly agree with your take on Allegri's preferred starters, but to say that Costa and Berna hasn't shown anything at all isn't accurate either. Costa has 2 goals and 3 assists in only 555 minutes. Without him, Juve aren't 3 points ahead of Sporting. Berna has 2 goals and 2 assists in even fewer minutes, 217.

    To compare Cuadrado has 2 goals and 5 assists in 862 minutes. Unlike the other two, he is Juve's only right footed winger that gives high defensive contribution. In this 4-2-3-1, in attack it becomes a 3-4-3 with Mandzu pairing with Higuain while Sandro and Cuadrado become wingbacks. With the way Sandro is playing, I'd love for Allegri to start Costa over him in a straightforward 3-4-3. Maybe a return to a back 3 could be in the cards when Howedes is fit.

    It's a long season. Like last year, Juve won't look like this come Feb/March.
     
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  9. Dante

    Dante Moderator
    Staff Member

    Nov 19, 1998
    Upstate NY
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Can't tell, haven't seen him play in the past 7 months or so.
     
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  10. Dante

    Dante Moderator
    Staff Member

    Nov 19, 1998
    Upstate NY
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    What?!?
     
  11. thinredline10

    thinredline10 Member+

    Juventus
    Apr 2, 2017
    I didnt mean to infer that I have any issue with Mario being on the field, I think he is our best player. His work rate is consistent, he does all of the hard work and never has to be asked, and he is generally lethal coming back post if he is played a good ball.

    I just believe Max should give him some relief. He is 31 and because of his work rate, he is prone to putting himself at exhaustion. I would like to see him playing nearly every game... just subbed off in 3/4th of those games in the 60th-70th minute.

    I think a good time to do this is games where we have a good lead, that way Mario misses out the "stat padding" part of the game which may upset him because of course he wants to score, but it can be sold to him that its being done because he is so vital to the team and will be needed to be relied upon for the long haul.

    An example of this is the last Milan game where we were up 2 goals at the 63rd minute and the next two subs were Barzagli, Sandro, and Blaise. The subs were brought on to defend the lead sure... but why then would Max employ Sami and Asamaoh to begin with in such a crucial match? Obviously it worked out... but this seems like a prime chance to let Costa or Berna get minutes. This and the recent CL game are examples of Juan getting full 90 minutes.

    The next game is against Bene Witches... so in this instance, I think it would be a good chance to let the kids play or at the very least give them a solid 30 minutes as subs.

    This is what I am talking about, there are games where we dont need to run our best guys for 90 minutes, especially if you have 3 games in a week like we did last week and will have again in near future.

    Another upsetting thing is this addition of Gonzalo, for all that he brings to the team... he is also very fickle in attitude and his perceived potential and price tag have allotted him to get a very high amount of playing time. Now Max did sit him during his dry spell and deserves credit for that, but Paulo does not get the same treatment, Gonzalo almost always gets to play full 90 and taking him out while sliding the already starting Paulo or Mario into his spot allows Max to get the wingers on the field.

    I am also saying this because Pjaca will be joining the team in January and that is going to complicate things a lot in regards to playing time. We have two sets of wingers and no one has really seperated them selves from the other 3... I just want to see even playing time for everyone so the best ones are ready and able to contribute in knockout round of CL
     
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  12. gumbacicc

    gumbacicc Member+

    Dec 7, 2004
    USA
    I don't think that Costa and/or Bernardeschi haven't shown anything. I just don't see it as a scandal that they haven't been getting the starts based on what we've seen.
     
  13. thinredline10

    thinredline10 Member+

    Juventus
    Apr 2, 2017
    When is the last time tho that Sami scored in an important game? His stats do not warrant preferential treatment.

    Last year in the CL, he had 11 starts with 12 shots, only 3 of them were actually on target and he also had zero assists.

    For Germany, he started 5 times in the Euros and he had no goals or assist.

    This year in the CL, Sami has 2 starts and 3 shots, one of which only one was on target. He does have 3 goals in Serie A this year so maybe he does transfer this output to CL...

    I know he is not one of those guys who does the flashy stuff and that is why his stats reflect this, but if Juve is going to run only 2 mids.... they need to be able to create chances....


    I also realize its difficult because of what is being asked of these two, but if this team wants to make a serious one... the midfielders are going to have to create these chances and find the back of the net.
     
  14. Dante

    Dante Moderator
    Staff Member

    Nov 19, 1998
    Upstate NY
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Barca's Sergio Roberto and André Gomes will miss the CL game against Juve.
     
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  15. gumbacicc

    gumbacicc Member+

    Dec 7, 2004
    USA
    Statistics are overrated. Anyone who has watched Khedira play the last year and a half or so can tell that his contribution has diminished, whereas Matuidi gives us more. We don't need statistics to tell us that. On form, Matuidi should be starting.
     
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  16. Falc

    Falc Member+

    Jul 29, 2006
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    Bernardeschi is being brought along as is Costa. Both need to work on their defensive duties. But both were brought on yesterday, which means Allegri has faith in them.
     
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  17. IcEWoLF

    IcEWoLF Member+

    Juventus
    Jul 15, 2014
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Lol, Real losing and Napoli losing too!
    EPL might not be a joke of a league anymore.
     
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  18. Italy-Azzurri-Fan

    Nov 15, 2014
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    They never were.
     
  19. Italy-Azzurri-Fan

    Nov 15, 2014
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    Something we just did a few months ago. Very well could happen. I am not saying I predict that, but that is far from impossible. If we score first, it could get crazy.

    I agree with you there. Now that Real Madrid is a runner up, I probably would rather finish second honestly. Also Heynckes' Bayern Munich would be tough to go against, so it might be best to finish second, especially given we cannot face Barcelona.
     
  20. soccerr9

    soccerr9 Member+

    Jun 6, 2005
    1st
    Man United
    PSG
    Roma
    Liverpool
    City
    Barca
    Besiktas
    Tottenham

    2nd
    Basel
    Bayern
    Chelsea
    Sevilla
    Shaktar/Napoli
    Juve
    Porto
    Real

    There are equally tough teams in each pot.
     
  21. Afghan-Juventus

    Afghan-Juventus Member+

    Oct 14, 2012
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Afghanistan
    Drawing City or PSG would suck
     
  22. soji22

    soji22 Member+

    Juventus FC
    France
    Feb 8, 2004
    Orlando, FL
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    Nat'l Team:
    France
    Tottenham have become a very good team over the last 2-3 years. Real were missing key players, but people still thought they would win today. I have to say that Real might not be as strong as last year. They offloaded Morata, James, and Pepe among others, and their right back Dani Carvajal is currently sidelined with a heart condition. Losing to Girona at the weekend was not the ideal way to prepare for this match. If Real finish second in their group, I think this season's CL will have a very open feel to it.

    Napoli might play prettier football than Juve, but I think they struggle at continental level. I think a bit of pragmatism, a very Northern Italian trait, would do them well. At the moment, Manchester City look very strong. It remains to be seen if they can maintain this breathtaking form until the end of the season.
     
  23. Italy-Azzurri-Fan

    Nov 15, 2014
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    LOL Zidane is probably gonna get sacked in December. Who knows what Real will be like under a new manager? Considering the team they have on paper, I'd like to avoid them until later. It doesn't matter how awful they are doing, the players on paper are still world class and could start to click any minute. Also don't forget Real finished second last season and still won UCL.
     
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  24. Italy-Azzurri-Fan

    Nov 15, 2014
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    Not really. I mean they wouldn't be the best draws for us, but I'd be confident we would progress against either of them.

    Both of them play Tiki Taka and are very prone at the back. Something we know how to exploit pretty well. Their midfields are also not that great. PSG only has Verratti. The rest of their midfield is blunt (So happy we have Matuidi).

    Man City doesn't have that great a midfield either. Both of them have good players in attack and some great attacking midfielders like De Bruyne and Di Maria, but with a full squad, I think we could probably boss the midfield around pretty well. Now don't get me wrong PSG and City are tough teams and will not be easy, but I am just saying you would probably be surprised with how well we would do against them.
     
  25. Italy-Azzurri-Fan

    Nov 15, 2014
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    I think Sevilla will top against Liverpool.
     

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