Copa Panamericana 2016: CONCACAF leadership traveling to Brazil for negotiations
Posted on July 3, 2012 11:11 pm
I am sure that most visitors to BigSoccer noticed the temporary lull in new front-page articles, only broken earlier today with David Bolt’s coverage of the lamentable situation facing one of the most famous clubs in world football. Allow me to reassure you that no coordinated writers’ strike was at hand: on my end, for once, I have had little to discuss over the last few weeks. Between the World Cup qualifying matches in early June and the start of the next CONCACAF Champions League at the end of this month, only a pair of CCL qualifying tournaments have appeared on an otherwise blank radar. Then again, if the negotiations taking place this week are successful, this may be the last time we ever face a dearth of summer action in our region.
In 2013, Mexico will carry the CONCACAF standard at what promises to be a remarkably competitive Confederations Cup. Afterwards, the aztecas will (reluctantly) compete with 11 other participants in the off-beat Gold Cup, which will hopefully soon be condemned to the dustbin of history. In the following year, all eyes will be on Brazil for the World Cup; and in 2015, another Gold Cup will determine our representative in the 2017 Confederations Cup (itself a preview for the 2018 World Cup).
The only year with nothing penciled in (yet) for the international off-season is 2016, and today’s news further confirms CONCACAF Vice President Alfredo Hawit’s assertion that a “big enthusiasm” exists for organizing a hemispheric championship in that time period.
Various Mexican websites revealed today that a pair of CONCACAF Executive Committee members flew down to Brazil on CONMEBOL President Nicolas Leoz’s invitation, in order to attend the second leg of the 2012 Copa Libertadores Final and proceed with discussions on the 2016 “Copa América.” Unsurprisingly, they focused on the question of which North American country would be selected to host the tournament, with South American officials reportedly sharing Hawit’s preference for the United States. Another element of the story, however, is arguably more significant for our purposes: it is no surprise that Mexican Football Federation (FMF) President Justino Compean was one of the invited CONCACAF representatives, given the sui generis relationship between Mexico and CONMEBOL. The other, however, did not similarly hail from the North-and-Central-American bloc: the aforementioned Hawit did not get to make the trip, nor did USSF President Sunil Gulati (who has remained faithful to his low-key public stance on confederation affairs to date). Rather, CONCACAF President Jeffrey Webb was extended the opportunity to participate directly in these crucial conversations, a significantly encouraging sign from our side of the table.
How much Webb can claim to represent the Caribbean is up for debate at the moment: while he has apparently occupied the FIFA Executive Committee seat reserved for the islands (assuming that this arrangement between the three sub-regions is still in place), he failed to pull off the “Uncle Jack” hat trick, with Antiguan Gordon Derrick winning the CFU Presidency. Furthermore, the very concept of a common Caribbean interest (in a footballing sense) may be antiquated, given the split between the larger and smaller federations within the CFU. Regardless, the invitation to both Compean and Webb reinforces the assertion that making this tournament happen is not a partisan or factional issue; rather, the entire confederation stands to benefit. While acknowledging that no one can know how conditions will be four years from now, it is difficult to imagine a scenario in which a Copa Panamericana held in the United States does not generate a huge profit, enough for CONCACAF to redistribute a satisfactory amount to member associations. And as long as the qualifying process is open to all FIFA-affiliated CONCACAF members (whether through World Cup qualifying or the Gold Cup), Caribbean teams will have their fair shot at reaching the Panamericana. It should also be noted that as long as the Caribbean Cup remains a biennial affair, the smaller national teams will not miss the discontinued off-beat Gold Cup. Other than squabbling over the exact size of the tournament bonuses to be handed out, I fail to see why Caribbean officials would oppose this initiative.
I have already gone on record stating that I hope this tournament takes place, that it succeeds, and that CONMEBOL is sufficiently impressed to justify a permanent expansion of the Copa América to 16 teams (10 CONMEBOL + 6 CONCACAF guests). Of course, this could mean no breaks for whichever CONCACAF team reaches the Confederations Cup, in which case they would have to negotiate with the European employers of some of their star players to decide which tournament they sit out. But with that and other minor issues aside, I would be truly shocked if no one involved in the 2016 Panamericana left with the impression that this should happen more often.
Thanks for this informative article. I agree that this tourney most likely will become permanent because money rules everything, and a US Copa would have plenty to spread around.
hell yes
great news.
this would never have been possible with that crook Jack Warner.
I would suggest 10 CONCACAF and 6 CONMEBOL. Not to say that CONMEBOL #7 is worse than CONCACAF #10, but it would give the South American teams the opportunity to hold qualification games for the tournament. It might weaken the final tournament field a little, but if you can’t finish in the top 6 of a 10 team confederation, then too bad.
Thanks to their World Cup qualifying format, South American countries already get plenty of games against each other; and seeing as they would officially run the tournament (i.e. the Panamericana would be registered in the FIFA Calendar as a CONMEBOL event), it is next to impossible that they would agree to such a suggestion.
dont think so
the 10 CONMEBOL almost surely will already be in. If this tournament is to replace the Copa America (which doesn’t have qualification) then there’s no chance in hell you would get the lesser CONMEBOL to agree to it. Besides, once you get past #6 in CONCACAF you are really getting into minnow territory.
i’m bored and cant sleep so here is my group projections:
Argentina
Ecuador
Costa Rica
Peru
Brazil
Columbia
Panama
Venezuela
Uruguay
United States
Paraguay
Bolivia
Chile
Mexico
Honduras
Canada
It’s not exactly Euro 2012 quality but it would make for a much more interesting tournament that we are used to on this side of the hemisphere.
I think there would be a lot of competition for spots 3-8 in Concacaf. There seems scope there for qualifying – is that what we’re talking about?
This competition can only make us and Mexico better. I can also see it giving Mexican and MLS sides a really good look at South American talent. Ideally, I would like to see it come the year before with the highest finishing team from each region representing at the Confed cup. …realize that is not on the cards at the moment, but it would just make sense. and as Socowarrior says, it would certainly follow the money to put more weight on this inclusive tournament.
One in the middle looks like Bob Arum.
Like I keep saying: as long as all the St. Maartins and Arubas and Grenadas want is to have some money tossed their way for them to steal and/or waste, I’m good with that.
It’s like when an old rich guy marries a young hottie. Nobody is fooled. She gets to live wealthy and he gets laid. Everybody is happy.
My only complaint comes in when the minnows want to make policy and/or get an even-Steven percentage of all the money that Mexico and the US generate. They need to be satisfied with 50 times more than they could possibly have earned or are entitled to.
The key here is of course access to the North American TV market. CONMEBOL has pretty much maxed out their own regions TV potential, and their product is only marginally saleable up here so there’s noplace for them to go. Incremental yearly stickups of their local broadcasters isn’t going to make them all as rich as – well, as Nicolas Leoz has gotten.
(And Leoz is as filthy a thieving bastard as Jack Warner ever was, a truly reprehensible man)
So obviously the only way to tap into all that lovely Norte Americano money is to do a combined event.
Some people want to believe that this is the first tentative step towards a new hemispheric confederation, but I doubt it. The US and Mexico (along with Canada, Costa Rica, El Salvador, Guatemala and Honduras) are enjoying a little muscle-flexing these days and have no desire to go from being out-voted by the Caribbean to being out-voted by South America.
Webb will go along blissfully, as long as he gets a healthy cut of the cash to spread around down in the islands to buy the support he needs.
All the North/Central feds want in return for the money is for him to stay out of their way.
On the question of the possible “new hemispheric confederation”: I would argue that a joint continental championship is the ideal level of integration for CONCACAF and CONMEBOL. Besides the point that you mentioned, a full-blown merger would involve the USSF and FMF risking their chances of reaching the World Cup, while I presume the South Americans would prefer not to have to deal with qualifying groups including Barbados and Belize. At least in an expanded Copa America, they would only have to face the best the North can offer.
They should do like Euro 2016 and make it a 24 team event. The payout from a round of 16 playoff is comparatively higher than a group stage game, so could handle the inevitable duds like Brazil vs. Grenada.
“They should do like Euro 2016 and make it a 24 team event.”
No. You’d be going down to the 13th and 14th-placed CONCACAF teams which is below WCQ semifinal round-level. Euro 2016 going to 24 teams is just a money grab plain and simple, there’s nothing to be gained from adding 8 more teams than money and giving the bigger countries one or two more early wins. With a 16-team Pan-Am tourney, you’re effectively combining CONMEBOL with the teams from the Hex.
I love it! Hard to escape the thought that were it not for small-minded crooks we would have had this years ago.
I think the USSF should tell them to go jump in a lake before we’ll host this event. Get the corruption rooted out, and then maybe we can talk. The only thing these guys understand is money.
We’re talking about the same USSF, right? As in, the one that decided to vote for Sepp Blatter?
Right after we do that with congress right? :-O
Two sides notes to add to the conversation:
1) For those of you who missed the Copa Libertadores Final, CONCACAF President Webb stood right next to Leoz during the awards ceremony, handing out medals and shaking hands (although a couple of Corinthians players left him in the cold). Can anyone imagine Warner or Blazer in that position?
2) Justino Compean also mentioned the possibility that Mexican clubs could return to the Copa Sudamericana in the near future. In my opinion, although I think the CCL is well-served by the status quo, giving in on this issue is a small price to pay for expanding the Copa America on a long-term basis.
We’re in the middle of the MLS season. How can you call it a “dearth of summer action”?
I meant on a continental level: from June 12 to July 31 of this year, there is no World Cup qualifying, Gold Cup or Champions League-related activity in sight, outside of the aforementioned pair of CCL qualifying tournaments.
I don’t usually comment, and this is kind of late, but i was dreaming, yes dreaming, and not that i care, i’m a holland fan. But it came to me. They can hold qualifying games. and technically include every country. Hear me out. Instead of wasting time having brazil play aruba.
Could split it, Concacaf Sends 6 automatic from qualifiers
and conmebol sends 6 automatic
and then the 4 next places get fought for by 6 teams, 3 from conmebol, and 3 from concacaf.
Let me explain the concacaf qualifying, Keep it like the world cup, with some exceptions.
26th thru 35th ranked teams play home and away, give them some meaningful games right,
Then the second round is a group stage of 4 teams playing home and away, with 7th thru 25th included, but for this tournament, instead have the top ranked teams teams host the 4 teams, in a group stage, 3 days between games, and play it out like a regular group, winner of group moves on. only playing 3 games.
Then the third round plays out like it normally does in concacaf, with my mentioned exception of instead of home and away, one game, and it’s playing at the top ranked country as host, so mexico, usa, and honduras would host right, So then top two automatically qualify, third place finishers go to pre-tournament qualifier
Now conmebol, split it into 2 groups of 5, Top 3 of each group advances, 2 groups have hosts, Uruguay and Argentina (no brazil is weird right) bottom two of both groups, Go into another group, 4 teams play at another host, giving the top ranked lower country a chance, maybe peru, or bolivia, or venezuela chances to host, And top 3 go to pretournament
So the last phase of qualifying is the 3 teams from conmebol, and 3 teams from concacaf play in a 6 team group, top 4 going to tournament, Can Split it and the group can split games between concacaf host, and south american host, or simply the higher ranked team hosts, one host, and yeah,
Then you have a tournament 16 teams, just like the euros
I’d be surprised if such an alternative is even negotiable. While there will be collaboration among both confederations, and the CONCACAF berths will be available to all members via a qualification process (for which reason I’ve decided to cover this tournament), the 2016 Copa Panamericana will be a CONMEBOL production first and foremost. With the exceptions of the Guyanese trio, all South American teams are guaranteed to participate.
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