Mueller indictment thread

Discussion in 'Politics & Current Events' started by superdave, Oct 28, 2017.

  1. HerthaBerwyn

    HerthaBerwyn Member+

    May 24, 2003
    Chicago
  2. soccernutter

    soccernutter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Tottenham Hotspur
    Aug 22, 2001
    Near the mountains.
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    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The political winds have shifted. There are states where Rep senators might not be as safe anymore. For instance, I'm thinking Ron Johnson here in Wisconsin. That was clearly an Individual One wave victory (just), and if there is a similar challenger he will lose.
     
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  3. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    VB, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Today Rudy said the Trump Moscow discussions went through Election Day 2016.

    He admitted it!
     
  4. russ

    russ Member+

    Feb 26, 1999
    Canton,NY
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
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    United States
    The base supports allying with Russia and breaking up the EU.
    This is literally not news.
     
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  5. soccernutter

    soccernutter Moderator
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    Tottenham Hotspur
    Aug 22, 2001
    Near the mountains.
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
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    United States
    Made it more gold.
     
  6. soccernutter

    soccernutter Moderator
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    Tottenham Hotspur
    Aug 22, 2001
    Near the mountains.
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    #1706 soccernutter, Jan 20, 2019
    Last edited: Jan 20, 2019
    The bold have a chance of flipping (TX assuming Beto is not he VP nominee). But there are other states as well, which have an additional 2 years beyond 2020 for voters to forget.

    That was only last wekk?!?!
     
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  7. NGV

    NGV Member+

    Sep 14, 1999
    One possibility might be that the Buzzfeed article was off on some facts, but also contained some true information that Mueller's office doesn't want made public yet - for example, because it would hint at the existence of a cooperating witness whose cooperation hasn't been made public yet. In that case they could issue a vague, blanket disavowal of the entire report to muddy the waters.

    That's just a wild guess, though. There's definitely something more going on than s simple desire to correct the record- the SCO spokesman has previously stated that there's incorrect information about the investigation in the press, but they've never responded to any specific story before.
     
  8. Cop Shoot Cop

    Cop Shoot Cop Member

    Sep 26, 2013
    Club:
    --other--
    I don’t think I can speak knowledgeably about other states, but if TN did not flip with Bredesen running against Blackburn in a Dem +9 election, not sure anything short of a Republican apocalypse could result in TN flipping in ‘20. I am often wrong, but it seems like wishful thinking for a Dem to win a Senate seat in TN in ‘20.
     
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  9. NGV

    NGV Member+

    Sep 14, 1999
    What's so bizarre about this story is the focus on the substantively minor detail of whether there's a paper trail of evidence that Trump told Cohen to lie under oath. Maybe that would be crucial in a court of law, but let's set that question alongside what we already know:

    - Trump was secretly pursuing self-enriching business deals with Putin while he was running for President, taking Putin's line on foreign policy, and (at the very least) openly inviting the Russians to undermine his opponent through criminal means.
    - Trump lied about the existence of these deals to the American public both before and after the elections, and his people lied about it under oath.

    Seems like kind of a big deal regardless of exactly how the perjury was arranged.

    And, as I've said, there's little chance that Cohen's lies were individual and spontaneous. Cohen may be a bad lawyer and dumb criminal, but would he really be dumb enough to lie under oath without somehow confirming that Don Jr. or whoever else would back up his specific lies?

    Anyway, hopefully we can count on the DC media to keep the relative seriousness of different aspects of the story in proper perspective hahahahahahaha never mind.
     
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  10. soccernutter

    soccernutter Moderator
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    Tottenham Hotspur
    Aug 22, 2001
    Near the mountains.
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
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    When I was living in Tenn, there were more and more educated Blacks moving back to the state. The inference is they will vote Dem (duh!). On the other side, there was a brain drain, but some of that was likely Rep, so I think there is probably a net Dem gain. And if the pattern continues, that will bode well for 2020.
     
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  11. soccernutter

    soccernutter Moderator
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    Tottenham Hotspur
    Aug 22, 2001
    Near the mountains.
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
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    Actually that is an issue - the how. Not who gave what directions, because there will be a limited paper trail even over most situations, unless there is a business contract, but multiple secondary verification as to what was said. And, IMO, I think the major thing Team Mueller is looking at is that meeting, and what was said (and if Individual One attended).
     
  12. Cascarino's Pizzeria

    Apr 29, 2001
    New Jersey, USA
    Also Trump campaign was warned by our IC in summer 2016 that Russia was meddling (well of course TrumpCo knew already first-hand) and continued negotiations over a tower anyway. Certainly makes them subject to blackmail. Trump was trying to say it ended even before he was the nominee. So the OSC has evidence it went on to election day & beyond.

    He's super compromised as we all suspected.
     
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  13. Boloni86

    Boloni86 Member+

    Jun 7, 2000
    Baltimore
    Club:
    DC United
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    Gibraltar
    Also Bredersen was a weak candidate. A 75 year old white dude who's already served as governor, and was weighed down by the baggage of what many considered a sub par 2nd term, and some corruption that happened under his watch.

    Bredersen was a Republican Lite candidate. Not the kind of guy that's going to excite the Dem base. I think the Dem formula in Tennessee is to excite the black vote in Memphis, the youth vote in Nashville, all while not alienating the moderates in the suburbs.

    Not saying the formula is easy, but I'm sure that Bredersen does not represent a hard ceiling.
     
  14. Cop Shoot Cop

    Cop Shoot Cop Member

    Sep 26, 2013
    Club:
    --other--
    Possibly true, yes, but Bredesen got 43.9% of the vote, as opposed to the Dem candidate for governor, who got 38.6%. Bredesen did better than a generic Dem, is the conclusion I would draw from this, though, again, I could be wrong. For comparison, Hillary got 34.7% of the vote in 2016. And, again for what it is worth, turnout in 2018 was 10% off of 2016. It is possible a Dem candidate who appeals to the base more than Bredesen could do better in ‘20, but I still think it is a tough row to hoe.
     
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  15. charlie15

    charlie15 Member+

    Mar 9, 2000
    Bethesda, Md
    Club:
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    I didn't have much doubt that the Buzfeed article was accurate. I think Mueller carefully worded statement was more intended to give to get Congress to hold their horses until he release his report. The fact is that Rudy basically confirmed the report findings.
     
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  16. Cascarino's Pizzeria

    Apr 29, 2001
    New Jersey, USA
    The Buzzfeed editor & writer were grilled on CNNs Reliable Sources and they continue to stand by their sources
     
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  17. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
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    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    Exactly!

     
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  18. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
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    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    Exactly

    And Don Jr lied to congress as well

    This is a criminal conspiracy in broad daylight
     
  19. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    VB, VA
    Club:
    DC United
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    United States
    Are there tapes, or did the world's worst lawyer just ******** up?

    https://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog/um-tapes

    This is in the context of the Buzzfeed report.

    "RG:But I can tell you, from the moment I read the story, I knew the story was false.

    NYR: Because?

    RG: Because I have been through all the tapes, I have been through all the texts, I have been through all the e-mails, and I knew none existed. And then, basically, when the special counsel said that, just in case there are any others I might not know about, they probably went through others and found the same thing.

    NYR: Wait, what tapes have you gone through?

    RG: I shouldn’t have said tapes. "

    No, you shouldn't have. WHY you shouldn't have will be interesting.
     
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  20. dapip

    dapip Member+

    Sep 5, 2003
    South Florida
    Club:
    Millonarios Bogota
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    Maybe Trump's defense now hinges on that nobody should take Rudy seriously.
     
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  21. Cascarino's Pizzeria

    Apr 29, 2001
    New Jersey, USA
    Incompetent counsel. Same excuse he'll use for Cohen "look, he finished last in his class at Western Bumf#ck University. I only took him because his Russian FIL asked me to. I did it outta sympathy"
     
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  22. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
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    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    Seriously who hires Counsel for an epic case aged 74 years?

    Lets face it, RG key role is as talk show front man. He is not doing serious law work.
     
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  23. Cascarino's Pizzeria

    Apr 29, 2001
    New Jersey, USA
    Dude just talks in circles. I think networks have him on just to see him make a jackass out of himself.
     
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  24. KensingtonSC

    KensingtonSC Still Lazy After All These Years

    FC Vaduz / Philadelphia Union
    Jan 7, 2010
    Andalusia, PA
    Club:
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    [​IMG]
     
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  25. JohnR

    JohnR Member+

    Jun 23, 2000
    Chicago, IL
    It's not that Rudy is old, it is that he is old and washed up. Robert Mueller is a very different version of 74 years old.
     
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