I've heard multiple MLS owners are open to it from multiple sources. And I'd far rather have this play out as a more open system that is moving towards Pro/Rel rather than an entrenched MLS that finally decides to "take off the single entity training wheels" so that aspiring superclubs in Atlanta and Seattle can spread their wings (but not NYC, as that was by league design)..... that would be the worst of both worlds IMO, not unlike having an imposed European closed league that eventually treats everyone and everything not in that closed league as "minor league".... Hey, American soccer fans in both MLS and non-MLS cities are choosing to watch actual clubs like ManU, Arsenal, Chelsea, and Liverpool over MLS outlets in big-ass "major league" cities who've marketed themselves with euro-nicknames while pretending to be authentic "clubs.?" Who knew!!!! You're smarter than this, I hope... The trend over the last decade has been towards a bigger regional (dare I say national) footprint. Notice the B1G didn't "relocate" to Maryland and Rutgers by forcing members Nebraska and Iowa to join another conference. The Big East added the Creighton Blue Jays, at least partially, based on sporting merit and not market size. The Big East's football playing members split to form the American Athletic Conference, adding Tulsa, Tulane, and East Carolina in 2014. The AAC recently added Wichita State, despite the fact the Shockers (with America's ugliest mascot) haven't had a football program in over 30 years. Why would they do this for a "small minor league market" like Wichita? BULLSHIT. MLS got a TV contract due to the strength of USWNT and USMNT with SUM kickbacks to USSF, a conflict of interest which should be illegal. The NFL did without any teams at all in LA for decades. Now they have two. Raleigh-Durham replacing the Mets would be no worse than the Rams moving to St Louis in 1995, staying there for two freaking decades, then moving back to LA in 2016... at least MLB would still have the Yankees... I'd venture to guess that if there had been a reasonably strong D2 alternative in pro football that the Rams could have played in from 1995-2015, they might actually have a more loyal fanbase than is the case in 2018.... rather than having to "steal back" their team.... LOL. I know each country has standards... I'm not against the existence of standards. I've said multiple times times that I didn't trust the NASL's Cosmos/Peterson conversion to Pro/Rel, because they lobbied USSF to deny USL a co-D2 status while gaining D2 exclusivity for themselves. I'll take reasonably attainable baseline standards that benefit all of pro and amateur soccer over self serving, largely aspirational standards that only serve to further stratify an already stratified closed shop. And I'll take a ten year "runway" from USSF that would allow Rocco's half billion dollar offer to come to fruition. You're mischaracterizing the situation on multiple levels. Typical anti-Pro/Rel douchebaggery. No, eff YOU! I hold MLS at least partially (if not mostly) responsible for this FACT: "Why would we want to watch MLS teams with European names on TV when we can watch the real thing?" Listen bub, you and your MLS apologist ilk on Bigsoccer are the biggest snobs on the planet. You think the only way major league soccer can succeed in this country is by going strictly by market size and whether a token billionaire in that market is an MLS investor. If you think the decisions to opt for EPL on TV over MLS on TV by soccer fans in such conservative places as West Virginia, Alabama, and Oklahoma are based on us wanting to be Europeans based on anglophile snobbery, you need to have your ******** head examined.
Can we please quit romanticizing Americans' support of elite UEFA teams. It's not some grand proclamation of their rejection of MLS and desire for "the true essence of football", it's not because they're "real clubs", it's not because "we don't have pro/rel and independent clubs". It's because they're the biggest clubs on the planet that have the best players and compete at the highest level. That's why they garner similar support in nations across the globe that do have pro/rel and independent clubs. Many of these nations even have century-old clubs steeped in tradition and local culture. I mean, we can even objectively point to these super clubs as indulging in the kind of behaviour that people reject MLS for... even though in MLS's case, it's usually little more than speculation and conspiracy theory. I've said it before and I'll go on saying it: I strongly suspect that if MLS was fielding G14 caliber rosters, a large chunk of these detractors would be eating it up, regardless of pro/rel, roster budgets, playoffs or anything else.
I suspect that if you ask American Premier League fans which teams were relegated last season most would struggle to name them. I agree that most American fans who prefer European leagues do so because they have the biggest teams and best players, not because they have pro/rel. It's interesting though that MLS has become more popular since foreign matches became widely available on TV.
Nah, in a billionairs buyers and their local thread special friend's world it would be mean to the Germans to relegate because, no not because the Dutch merit sent them down, but their coach had a flue in his brain, the player were temporarily out of form, the Dutch were supposed to suck, etc.
According to Yanks standards we Dutch are the best of the world, because, no not bevause we came on top of a competition, but because we beat the crap out of World Champions 2010 Spain in 2014 (5-1), we beat the crap out of European champion Portugal (3-0), we beat the crap out of WC2014 Germany (3-0) and now we beat the crap out of WC 2018 France (2-0, should have been 6-0). But that's a Yanks perception.
It's not at all ludicrous or unfounded, but it does contain justifiable vitriol. So maybe you and Crazy and Paul can put me on ignore?
In much of the Midwest and the South, the college football team is a big part of community/regional/state identity. There are a LOT of Husker fans in Nebraska who never attended UNL. I know you know this, I'm just pointing it out.
I think this is probably MORE true now than it was 10 years ago. Being a soccer fan is more mainstream, which means more casual fans. I used to argue that the average American soccer fan was more knowledgeable than the average European fan--keeping in mind that back in Europe the sport is much more popular meaning that lots of people show up on game days or watch matches in pubs without putting in a lot of time and effort following the sport otherwise. Whereas it used to be that being a soccer fan in the USA was very much a conscious swimming-against-the-tide decision to seek out information on something niche and not at all mainstream. But now, that's a lot less true. The growth of soccer means lots of bandwagon/casual fans. Which is fine--great, even, because that's better ratings, more tickets sold, etc. Once you get into soccer it's hard NOT to be drawn to the big Euro leagues--they have more tradition, they generally play at a higher level, and that's where the biggest stars are. I've slowly lost interest in Arsenal and the EPL in general. I mostly care about the Bundesliga these days. (Outside of MLS and American soccer in general of course). Yup. More people become fans of the sport through TV and then start looking to get a "live game" fix. Nobody at MLS matches thinks they're watching a league that's on par with the top Euro leagues.
It has been outlined in here time after time to underline the peculiar shedule of the mls competition. If you donot beat the best you're not the champion.
We understand the difference between playoffs and knockout-round competitions vs. one-off upsets just fine.
Aside from the Champions League knockouts my interest in Euro soccer has been waning the past few years. Once I actually got into my local team it's amazing how I can be on the edge of my seat for a USL game but struggle to stay awake during a top six EPL matchup.
I'm almost 50 years old. When I was a kid, Saturday mornings were for cartoons. I think the EPL has replaced Saturday morning cartoons for people from 40 to 60 years old. Now I wake up and flip the game on because that is the only and best thing on tv at 7 am. By the time MLS games come on they are battling with kids games to attend, lawns to mow, college or NFL football to watch, family stuff, summertime activities, etc. Kind of like when you were a kid you had the tv to yourself before your parents got going for the day and you were dragged away to clean your room, get dragged to grocery shopping, visiting grandma, etc. The EPL is the current version of Saturday morning cartoons, the time of day where you are unencumbered by life.
I'm not interested in you denials. Your views on this forum and those who post here are well known and add nothing of value. If it's all you claim, leave us to our dying website and deluded echo chamber. Putting you on ignore wouldn't prevent you from dragging this thread off topic.
You've been on ignore for a long-time. I just look at ignored content from time to time. We were having a nice discussion about the subject at hand on page 712 without you.
I used to love watching Soccer chat shows--ESPN FC, The Locker Room, etc.--but the tendency to focus like a laser on the top teams and ONLY the top teams gets boring. I mean, I still follow Arsenal but I feel almost no connection and if I'm busy (which, thanks to grad school and a second job, I pretty much always am) I'll record the games and fast-forward through them later.* I still dig the Bundesliga and lately that's just about the extent of my Euro viewing (although I still try to catch French & Spanish highlights on BeIN). I actually enjoy the Europa League just because you get to see different clubs that the one which suck all the oxygen out of the room on most coverage. But yeah, for the most part I mostly care about DC United, the new USL club coming to Loudoun County (just north of Prince William County where I live), the college and youth soccer scene here, etc. *Also how I follow Nebraska football these days.
I do wish Bundesliga games started an hour or two earlier, for this very reason. Of course, if I still lived in the Central Time Zone it would be perfect!
That's a good point. I'm so old that when I was growing up in England there would be those old movie theater serials in like Lassie or The Lone Ranger, cartoons, old black and white comedies, or dubbed foreign children's dramas like the brilliant Robinson Crusoe and Swiss Family Robinson on Saturday mornings. I must have watched and rewatched many of these shows and movies many times over the years. If by some quirk of time NFL or NHL games had been shown during those time slots I'm sure if I'd an addict until this day.
Well, to defend the odd schedule of mls and play off it is said in here (multiple times) that's because Yanks donot consider you a champion if you didnot beat the best. So we just beat the crap out of France, they were lucky, also according to French papers, it was 2-0 and not 6 or more. According to Yanks reasoning we're the best now, beating in a row the best of Europe, the best of 2014 and the best of 2018 in a span of 4 months.
That is still absolutely not what anyone thinks. Nobody thinks that the Giants were better than the undefeated Patriots in 2008. They just won the game that mattered. Did that diminish New England's unbelievable accomplishment that season? You bet your sweet ass it did, but it was an amazing outcome and the way the competition is structured, going 16-1 makes you first place loser if that 1 comes at the end. And, frankly, it was by far the most satisfying outcome.