Revolution Stadium Groundbreaking "12-24 months" Part XV

So, the seating capacity has grown by 50% (10K-->15K seats) between 2015 and 2017. Give it a few more years and at the current rate it will be in the 20K-30K "soccer specific" range.

Here's the site plan doc from Union Point website, as of 11/2017.
http://unionpointma.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/UnionPoint_SitePlan_17_1101_RenderedPlan_Site.pdf




The proposed stadium is in red; existing commuter rail stop on Rte 18 is yellow. Blue road between them is approx .7 miles. (Lime green is the sports complex already partially/mostly built).

 

Relative to standing pat, they realize the additional opportunities and costs that an urban soccer stadium can bring. “They don’t need a stadium “ keeps winning.

Frankly, over 25 years, I’d wager they could do as well if they put an additional $10M/yr into DPs, DTAM, stadium format and advertising. That way they don’t commit 200-250M up front.

 

I suppose that's possible, but Kraft does have a pretty impressive resume as a developer, so I'd put my money on him (and most other MLS operators) thinking that building an SSS in an urban area is worth doing.

I do think, because KIASBM, that Kraft has been, and will continue to be, very selective about agreeing to a plan.

 

Well, I’ve posted before (maybe 3-6 threads ago) that I certainly don’t see the financial sense to it.

The general theory here is that he is going to

1. Spend 200-250 million up front to build
2. Take on the stadium carrying costs AND
3. Spend more on the team

To average 10-13k more per game... I’ve never seen a compelling explanation why a savvy businessman would do that. There MAY be a business plan that makes sense if you flood the facility with other activities. That dilutes the title SSS though.

KIASBM and, short of the city building the stadium with the city/taxpayer money, will IMHO continue to conclude he doesn’t need a stadium.

 

Does he? He's basically done all his work on a plot of land he bought in a firesale in a town that I'm sure is more than cooperative. Boston's a whole different ballgame.

Perhaps the problem is that Kraft isn't good at this sort of thing.

 

No one has ever failed to build more stadiums in Boston than Bob Kraft.

 

I did receive a more recent packet than that but the revisions had more to do with water supply. The stuff you posted here I got on a cd rom last feb as well and this is exactly what I was talking about. Now, selfishly I'll say that if this comes true I -being an Abington resident- wouldnt be completely dissapointed

 

A SSS would take about 16 acres. Is there enough land to realistically put one on that site? I didn't think so but Union Pt. is certainly a huge plot of land.

 

It is a huge plot of land. 1,400 acres. The biggest chunk of contiguous developable land in the greater Boston area. I still come up empty when I try to think of what baseball entity could possibly want to build a stadium that size there.

 

Also keep in mind that the plan is malleable. There are no buildings existing yet around that proposed "baseball" stadium. Also, the developments that happen there are all fast track as the three towns agreed along ago what things could possibly go in there and the agreed upon things are all up to the developer. The only thing they need to do to change things are zoning adjustments which are subject to public hearing. So what I'm saying is this potential project would be largely immune to public obstruction.

 

Unless it was added purely on spec, I'd guess they were hoping to attract the PawSox.

 

10-13k more per game, at higher ticket prices, lower parking costs (likely less parking available and it definitely won't be free), much higher prices for luxury boxes, and richer sponsorship deals.

 

All vaguely appealing but not necessarily convincing.

I’d really like to see the in city SSS business plan that is SO compelling that I’ll start believing, despite MANY years of evidence to the contrary, that “they don’t need a stadium” isn’t going to keep winning.

I think that the Krafts will take on a tougher debt and cash flow burden primarily consisting of the following

1. Stadium cost. - I’m guessing in the neighborhood of $250M based on the last couple SSS built for MLS @~200M and the fact that it is in Boston and, with time will continue to go up. Optimistically, the city or someone gives access to low to 0 interest financing. So, $8.3M/year over 30 years to $25M/yr over 10 years.
2. Carrying costs - gas, electricity, maintenance, gardening... I have no idea what that costs.
3. Will he also have to pay for road improvements like he did in foxboro? Will he be paying for the cheaper (???) parking to be built?
4. He is going to start spending some mythical amount of money on the team salary in order to perform better? The top spenders are almost $15M over the cap. And that number keeps growing. What will it be in 5 years, the likely time he’d move in if he finds a place soon?

I think spending on the product (Item 4) is key. If he doesn’t do that, I think any new stadium will, in the long run, return to low attendance. Or, they will have to keep the ticket and parking prices low to fill it. One or the other. While he waits, why doesn’t he spend on the product, advertise more intelligently and try to get Foxboro attendance up 13K? Even at current ticket prices (adjusting over time to keep up with inflation), I believe that might have a greater return on investment than laying out for a Stadium, infrastructure improvements, AND a better product in Boston.

 

Under the "new" Federal tax setup a business can write off 100% of ALL development costs. I maybe uninformed, but it seems to me that BK can now build a stadium for the Rev at NET ZERO COST to Kraft Sports.
.

 

Interesting. if true. This may be at the heart of why Bob Kraft sent a huge "high five" to the President afyer the Bill was signed. He also said he was going to build another paper mill in North Carolina.

 

If this is true, the regulations haven't been written and nobody is exactly sure what is actually in the bill; except for the specific goodies written into the bill for Senators to get them to vote for it. What it means is that (my speculation) a business could write off the architects' fees and maybe the initial grading and prep work for a building. What the current rules are, is that those expenses would be added to the total cost of the building and depreciated over 39 years. Businesses get to write-off everything they spend on their business; the issue is how and when do they get to do it. If BK spent $10m for development of a SSS in 2018 and gets to write it off in 2018. He would (simplistic analysis) reduce his taxes by $2.1m. 21% top tax rate for corps. He still spent the $10m and under the "old" rules he would have reduced his taxes by $2.1m (new rates) over 39 years. That's your tax lesson for today!

 

My previous post was unclear - I meant that parking will be cheaper for Kraft. Currently, he gets no income from parking, and has to pay to maintain the parking lot (additional wear & tear from Revs games) and staff to direct traffic, etc. With more fans arriving via transit, each Revs game will require fewer people to staff the parking lot, and the smaller parking lot will require less maintenance. He'll also get income from charging high Boston parking rates. Thus parking as a cost to Kraft will be cheaper.

 

Possibly, but that ship has sailed. Another thing is that a baseball park depiction may be a red herring just to slip the plan past the public hearing process without much notice.

 

Yes, Kraft is pretty unproven in acquiring land in urban Boston, but his acquisition history in Foxboro is pretty shrewd/impressive, the financing of the stadium received accolades from all over due to it's "creative financing" and the development of Patriot's Place has been very successful - turning a one-event destination into a much more diversified, year-round/week-long enterprise.

Actually, that's the one thing he didn't have to pay for in building Gillette (or CMGI, as it was to be named). The little public aid that the project got was for improving rt. 1, which was sorely neglected for years IMO.

 

They're not sticking a 15K stadium in Weymouth, even if Weymouth agrees to build the entire thing for them (and it won't).

Weymouth was surely angling for the PawSox, but it looks like Worcester's the leading alternative destination for that team. MLS is not a fallback option for a locality that's rolled snake-eyes on minor league baseball. It would be a larger project than their current zoning approval, and I'm guessing the local residents would not take a shine to the bait and switch. It's turn may roll around if MLB expands in the near future (been 20 years since the league's last expansion). Then the International League (AAA), Eastern League (AA) and New York-Penn League (A-) might be looking for new teams.

It's also a bad site for MLS, which is hardly going to seem "major league" in an out-of-the-way, suburban stadium. That doesn't even get into the gulf between the T and the commuter rail (I live right next to a T line and it's not easy for me to get anywhere via commuter rail).

Anyway, the very idea of a SSS in Weymouth seems to be built on landmines.

 

This.

 

I agree with everything you say except your assumption that this is entirly in Weymouth's hands. It is not. It's the Tri-town agreement between the developer and Abington, Rockland and Weymouth, (formerly the Tri-town Development Corp.) that has the decision making power, pending public hearings. The developers have certain pre-agreed upon latitude. Again, I'm not saying this is even going to happen or that Kraft is interested. I'm only going on 2 things which forms a theory: The Union Point sponsored luxury suite at Gillette and the fact that the Union Point plans call for a sports stadium -which has to my knowledge has already gotten past the public hearing process.

 

Thinking PawSox as well.

 

Do you think they'd put the PawSox that far out? Just seems like a trek. Great post though, I agree Weymouth would be a weird spot for baseball or MLS.

 

MiLB is a small city operation. The 128 belt probably would be a prime draw for families in the region that don't want to shell out the cost for a Sox game. Weymouth/Quincy/Braintree/Hingham makes for a nicer immediate feeder area.