US fails to qualify

Discussion in 'USA Men: News & Analysis' started by swedust, Oct 10, 2017.

  1. Adhitya Bagus

    Adhitya Bagus Member

    Jul 10, 2017
    Depok
    I totally cannot wrap my head around this. A revolution against him by himself. (slow clap)
     
  2. Suyuntuy

    Suyuntuy Member+

    Jul 16, 2007
    Vancouver, Canada
    It's my tribute to The Onion.
     
  3. Adhitya Bagus

    Adhitya Bagus Member

    Jul 10, 2017
    Depok
    Lol...you got me
     
  4. tudobem62014

    tudobem62014 Member+

    Feb 26, 2014
    Club:
    FC Barcelona
    Our problem is... we recalled all our talent back to mls. We can't pay for better talent cause no $. No $ cause the leagues are better abroad. They better abroad cause they been doing it a lot longer.

    Doesn't mean we can't win. Argentina, Germany have done well against the USA NBA basketball players.

    With our population and family soccer following we should be able to scrap up a pretty good team. Netherlands population is tiny and goes to the finals and the semifinals in consecutive years. It's mind boggling.
     
  5. thedukeofsoccer

    thedukeofsoccer Member+

    Jul 11, 2004
    Wussconsin
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    It's also simplistic to think it's the pool because two coaches who'd been under-performing beforehand and were hired by the same unpaid, part-time guy outside the game of football, didn't get results from them.

    Certainly not a pool issue to be out-performed by the likes of Honduras and Panama. Unless you really like to fetishize Latin American football. The same pool beat them by a combined 10 goals over 2 games. Beat Costa Rica by 6 in 2, btw.

    And no, Roldan, who is the best of the lot in MLS, was not really given the opportunity to take on the challenge, was he? None of the top prospects in that tourney were, like Hamid and Miazga. That was a totally botched exercise.

    IIRC, there were 7 uncapped players under Bruce who became capped. I'd say 5 of them - Lletget, Rowe, Dwyer, Villafana, and Morrow - appeared useful. That's a really high hit rate, indicating there was a lot of untapped talent out there. Problem was that's not enough still and only one was used significantly in the hex for unavailability, conservatism, and time. Which you claimed the new coach wouldn't have enough of to turn over the roster before the hire. Now you're changing your tune.
     
  6. IndividualEleven

    Mar 16, 2006
    The pool was good enough. There was a failure to adjust to changes in the pool, notably the declines of Howard, Jones, and Dempsey.
     
  7. russ

    russ Member+

    Feb 26, 1999
    Canton,NY
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    But why did we lose our defining characteristic?Why did we lose our physical and mental intensity?Why did we turn into a bunch of divers at Red Bull arena?Why did we jog for 90 on Tuesday?
    What happened?When will we find out?
     
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  8. IndividualEleven

    Mar 16, 2006
    Intensity = Jones, Donovan, Dempsey, Howard.
     
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  9. juveeer

    juveeer Member+

    Aug 3, 2006
    #1059 juveeer, Oct 13, 2017
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2017
    This is why Klinsmann went out and actively, even ruthlessly sought out dual Nats for this squad. He SAW the talent holes and knew there was't a way to fix it short term within the current pool so he sought o expand it by aggressively seeking dual Nats with experience abroad to come in and plug the gap until the pool improved.

    Then he and Sunil agreed to put him in charge of developing the talent. Something that is ACTUALLY WORKING now as the last 2 U-20 groups have been good even without all the best players ebbing there and now this crop of U-17s also looking good. These are the groups that JK as technical director had an influence over.

    But Bruce and the USS GOBs didn't like Ger/Ams or any other /Ams and so we got what we got. An all US based, primarily MLS group playing within their comfort zone with a retread American coach calling the shots.

    NOW we have people recognizing that the talent pool really isn;t that great. And the BA wasn't really the answer either. What a shock. BUT....they can't admit it cause Klinsmann has to be blamed for everything and he cannot get any credit for anything ever.
     
  10. juveeer

    juveeer Member+

    Aug 3, 2006
    Wait....that article wasn't a joke?????

    Really?????
     
  11. russ

    russ Member+

    Feb 26, 1999
    Canton,NY
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Klinsmann had nothing to do with the U-xx improvement.Don't use this to rehab JuerK.
     
  12. juveeer

    juveeer Member+

    Aug 3, 2006
    Of course he does.

    Before JK took over those groups flamed out. Since he took over the younger age groups have done well.

    We threw the baby our with the bathwater here thanks in large part to MLS owners and Garber who couldn't abide Kilnsmann telling the truth.

    You can complain bout his game day coaching all you want, but he had the development and talent eval side down much better than anyone in the USS GOB network.
     
  13. skim172

    skim172 Member+

    Feb 20, 2013
    I agree that our talent pool and youth development are in need of reform.

    But the team we put out there - problematic as they were - against Trinidad? That still should've been enough. The roster callup was questionable and the talent on that roster less than elite. But against Trinidad's experimental youth side? It still should've gotten done. They were up against what was, skill-wise, equivalent to maybe a middling NASL team.

    So the US talent pool isn't great - but T&T's talent pool is undeniably worse. And the players on their roster? They had a median average of 10 caps. The players on our roster? Not a single player with less than 12 caps - and a median average of 47.

    But it didn't look like it on the field.

    Which means even though our roster was lacking in top-quality talent - they were still punching below their weight. Because that young T&T squad was controlling the game.

    And I believe that the blame for that lies with the manager. A good manager gets his players to play above their level; be it through gameplan, training, preparation, or conditioning, a good manager finds a way to best utilize the pieces he's been given. There's a limit to just how much he can get out of them, of course - but he'll find a way squeeze out every drop of ability that he can on gameday.

    Because that is the role of the manager. That is the primary purpose of his job.

    So when we make our next coaching hire, our most immediate priority should be: "What can he get out of the players." Is he the type of guy who, on gameday, will be able to get his players to play up to and beyond their limits?

    The other priorities - like can he build up our talent development (Klinsmann) or can he motivate and unite the locker room (Arena) - are important. But neither of them were able to get the gameday stuff done.

    Our players probably aren't as good as they should be. But they're not even playing up to the level of their own mediocrity.

    And that is on Bruce Arena.
     
  14. canammj

    canammj Member+

    Aug 25, 2004
    CHINO, CA
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Where does one start? As for the game itself, no urgency seen, no fighting spirit, combined with a few poor lineup choices and key failures by a couple key players. Not more to be said.

    Going forward.
    Much more scouting for domestic players, not just the suburban club players or the NCAA route.
    MLS academies are starting towards this goal. Urban, non-pay for play, players who won't go to college.
    More qualified coaches, IE: get more licensed, former players who have the passion for the game
    Separate the pyramid near the bottom-
    >pro route. Academy u6,u8,u10,u12,u14,u16,u18 (mls high schools), PDL u23, reserve team, parent team
    (players scouted at earlier age where college is not the first option, but still get a quality HS education)
    >amateur route. all leagues, AYSO, club, ethnic, police leagues , church leagues, whatever. We have too many options all with their own agendas. This is why the amateur side needs to be completely separated from the professional side of the soccer business.
    ( for kids to enjoy the game- then through high school- college. Once again if scouted, to U23 and onwards)

    This separation also has to happen at USSF level. Someone clarify for me, but the amateur side gets equal representation and voting ?
    -
    As for the profession leagues, stop having competing leagues, build a very straight forward pyramid.
    MLS > USL 2 > USL 3> PDL> ACADEMY
    -There literally should be a hand out chart and a USSF members card given to every player enrolled in any league in the country showing the progression.
    -We also at the minimum have pro/rel between MLS and USL 2. We have to make every league game do or die for teams/players to stay in the top tear. I would also emphasis this by getting rid of the MLS Cup, make your trophies the Shield for regular Season and the USOC as national champion. The MLS Cup is like getting a participation medal in AYSO, it a fall back. WHY would finishing 5 or 6th and getting into the playoffs be good enough?
    You should get nothing because that is not good enough.
    -
    I also feel we need to revisit how many US citizen players on the field in MLS games.
    I couldn't find anything on MLS website, but there is a big difference about being on the rooster and being on the field. We may need to start thinking about only 3-4 foreign players at a time on the field or something similar.
    -
    Ok, I could keep ranting. I have had low expectations from USSF for a while, now after our debacle, even lower.
    I truely hope the upcoming elections we get a new leader who is an actual soccer person/player etc. rather than some professor/lawyer/business person whatever. I want our leadership to be passionate about the game from top to bottom.
     
  15. vexco

    vexco Member+

    Nov 2, 2013
    Lol.
     
  16. y-lee-coyote

    y-lee-coyote Member+

    Dec 4, 2012
    Club:
    --other--
    I don't think we failed to qualify because we do not have enough talent. We failed to qualify because we did not play for each other. For whatever reason we want to divine, it was plain for all to see.

    Poor, and I mean really poor tactics. Bradley/Nagbe was never a functional midfield. Complaining about Omar not being fast enough on the ball? Really Bruce, you start Omar and criticize him for playing the ball exactly like he has done his entire career?

    There is something very, very wrong with the team and that must be fixed.

    Captain Bradley should be done if for no other reason than walking to take a corner late in a game that you are down, much less with a trip to the WC on the line.
     
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  17. vexco

    vexco Member+

    Nov 2, 2013
    The coaching and reliance on players(Omar, Zusi, Villafana, Nagbe) and tandems(Bradley/Nagbe pairing) that have proven to not be good enough over time.
     
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  18. Suyuntuy

    Suyuntuy Member+

    Jul 16, 2007
    Vancouver, Canada
    But you cannot be the coach of the NT, who needs results right-now, and in charge of development, planning for the future.

    The Director of Development is focused on the future, and he will put pressure on the coach to "blood" younger players to open the way. The coach of the NT cannot do that, at least not always, because his first duty is to win silverware --or at least to qualify.

    Klinsmann should have been given a shot as a director, not as a coach. In the end, trying up both jobs together meant when we lost the mediocre coach, we also lost the (maybe) good director.
     
  19. Fiosfan

    Fiosfan Red Card

    Mar 21, 2010
    Nevada
    Club:
    New York City FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    918266085715136513 is not a valid tweet id
     
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  20. soccerusa517

    soccerusa517 Member+

    Jun 23, 2009
    Ohio
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Not written by Jozy of course. Careful, if you call him out he'll block you. Mentally fragile player.
     
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  21. MarioKempes

    MarioKempes Member+

    Real Madrid, DC United, anywhere Pulisic plays
    Aug 3, 2000
    Proxima Centauri
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  22. roadkit

    roadkit Greetings from the Fringe of Obscurity

    Jul 2, 2003
    Fornax Cluster
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I am grieving in my own way. I'm grieving by telling others to get over it and move on.

    We might have an all-important friendly with Slovakia next month.

    We need to focus.
     
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  23. roadkit

    roadkit Greetings from the Fringe of Obscurity

    Jul 2, 2003
    Fornax Cluster
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    No. Shit coaching. Arena went with the guy he had playing for him on the LA Galaxy.
     
  24. shinpath

    shinpath Member

    Feb 14, 2003
    Shanghai, PR China
    Club:
    --other--
    It is going to impossible to think about wearing any of my several USMNT shirts, dating back to 1994, at any time in the next four years. If that is bad, I can tell you Nike isn't going to sell any new ones during that same time period too.
     
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  25. lynne

    lynne Member+

    Oct 11, 2003
    Add a few more questions to the list --
    1. Why do we play like we've never met each other before? (no matter how many games in to a tournament)
    2. Why can't we pass to our own team?
    3. Why are we so slow? (at a run, not when we were jogging)
    4. Why did the midfield neither defend nor attack?
    5. Why did no one attempt to protect Pulisic?
     
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