I know LCS played for us in that world cup but to me, he just wasn't a huge contributor in 2002. 2006? Sure. And like I've said, Park Ji Sung already had 2 seasons of professional football under his belt when he got to 2002 WC.
It was many. I guess it's all relative but I remember how excited BSK was when we hired Hong. The talk of Gunes has been around forever, and the talk of Gunes will forever continue as long as Gunes is still managing and as long as our NT struggles finding a good manager.
You once said you liked Ji Dong Won over Son Heung Min because that's who Hong Myung Bo went with, and that was clearly good enough reason. If that's not putting HMB on a pedestal, I don't know what is.
I brought up errors from the past because posters here seem absolutely certain when they speak of things. Do I think Shin Tae Yong is going to make us competent in Russia? Most likely not. Do I want Hiddink to be our manager? Absolutely. But my point is, stop criticizing someone else for having a different opinion. I don't agree with that poster saying STY is the right man for the job but he's not being completely egregious about it. I don't agree with many of StevenM (whatever his name is) posts but at least he makes some reasonable premises to support his conclusion.
Whats your point man? I wasn't directing the post at you (although yes, i was quoting your response to make the point). And you think the discussion over who our next manager should be was confined to one single thread? Your incessant need to have to be right all the time gets exhausting sometimes. I made a pretty generalized statement about the general temperature of BSK at the time of HMB's appointment. I don't care what you (specifically you) personally thought. I am aware you don't speak for everyone.
Yeah wasn't meaning it as an attack on you and I was kind of agreeing with you on posters seeming too sure on things sometimes. It is a message board after all.
@sac517 @toohyper Was making a minor point/correction to the point of "after" HMB was appointed. Also sac, no need to be all jumpy man, I wasn't hitting back either.
Why the hell would STY even WANT to go to the World Cup with this raggedy-ass team? He's almost guaranteed to be HMB II. Perfect situation for him would be to step aside as the hero who got Korea into the WC, let Hiddink take the fall if things go as expected, then return when KNT is in better shape.
Ignoring how you're torturing my comment out of context, was HMB's decision wrong? Did we not end up with a bronze medal after HMB decided to use JDW who he trusted through the qualifiers? Did JDW not score in a crucial knockout match and play an integral role throughout the tournament? Did we not avoid the craziness of a helicopter parent who acted rashly (and wrongfully out of place against CKR) at precisely the crucial moment before HMB made his selections? I still didn't like HMB's decision not to take SHM to London. Playing out the counterfactual scenarios, SHM may have made the difference against Brazil. But we don't know if his father's circus would have hurt the team dynamics and morale at the time. And we don't know if SHM would have ended up sucking at London like he often does for the KNT. So I respected HMB's decision and supported it. Is that putting HMB on a pedestal?
Of course, the most salty part of this -- looking back 5 years -- is that SHM didn't get the exemption. But yes, it's pretty dang hard to dispute JDW given the humongous goal he scored against GB. No Bronze without it.
I never said picking JDW over SHM was the incorrect decision, did I? I'm talking strictly talent wise. If you remember that convo (which I vividly do since even Sky chimed in), you had said Ji was the better prospect of the two and that one of the main reasons why you liked Ji over Son was because Hong took Ji, and that was enough reason. The discussion was never about whether picking Ji over Son was better for our Olympic performance. We were talking about their skill set and their potential as individual footballers.
Shouldn't you have this cause vs. correlation distinction nailed down by now? At the time, I believed JDW looked as if he could be the better prospect. Why? Causative factor at the time: (i) relatively same technical skills; (2) similar physical qualities; and (3) JDW's ability to digest tactics better than SHM. Correlation/evidence to support my argument: HMB selected JDW over SHM. Fine, my assessment was wrong. But so what? You're making a twisted argument now based on my previous analysis. Btw, go back to what I said about HMB over the winter training camp. I had great hopes and optimism for him once my Gunes was ignored by the KFA. But by the winter camp before WC14, I was pointing out the alarm bells ringing over his inflexibility. You're argument that I blindly put him on a pedestal like a golden calf simply isn't true.
shouldn't you have "your" and "you"re" nailed down by now? You can give me this causative and correlation crap all you want, but you're just twisting this to save face. I was pretty much writing what you had written. Could even be verbatim if I feel like searching for that post/thread. You were one of the biggest HMB advocates around and probably even the most outspoken HMB supporter when he was hired. I love how you are trying to save face by downplaying it. It's alright man, we all make bad analysis and arguments.
Why are you picking a fight with me over a straw man argument? I've been wrong plenty of times. HMB is still one of my childhood heroes. And JDW was one of the players I was extremely excited about when he was coming through the ranks. I made a nuanced and reasoned argument at the time in those threads. If you want to remember otherwise and claim that I'm saving face, have it your way. But again, what's your point in this thread? Again, did I ever deny being a huge advocate of HMB's hiring? Given the cycle we had just had, and given a domestic manager was going to be chosen, weren't you excited by HMB's hiring as well? I know sky was against it b/c he feared for HMB's career; several others were as well. But I was overly optimistic that he was ready even with the short time period that he had. He had just won the bronze medal and come off a stint at Anzhi under Hiddink. Again, I thought he was ready. And then I started getting worried in the winter. And then even HMB failed. So what am I trying to downplay? How am I trying to save face? STY is a poor man's HMB. Did I do something wrong to argue that this is a repeat of the same mistake four years ago but potentially worse?
Not picking a fight. If you scroll up, I was giving a flip side to your argument on STY. And then it went from there. Your debating style is the style that incites fights and arguments. Maybe you should look into how you make your points instead of accusing me of picking a fight.
I would still take HMB over Shin TY To be honest. Bring back Hiddink and put HMB as assistant for Russia. How sweet would that be? If STY wasn't so full of piss and vinegar he could be onboard as coach but STY is a snake for the KFA establishment at this point. THere's no winning, growing with the KFA corruptions at the helm. This is the biggest problem at the moment.
Apparently the KFA technical committee is having a meeting early next week to discuss Hiddink's possible role as well as possibly selecting two coaches (one for Asian Games 2018 and the other for Olympics 2020)