The All-Encompassing Pro/Rel Thread on Soccer in the USA

Discussion in 'Soccer in the USA' started by bigredfutbol, Mar 12, 2016.

  1. M

    M Member+

    Feb 18, 2000
    Via Ventisette
    Most of those that have posted "pro" pro/rel views on this thread have given up posting here. Can't say I blame them.
     
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  2. HailtotheKing

    HailtotheKing Member+

    San Antonio FC
    United States
    Dec 1, 2008
    TEXAS
    Club:
    San Antonio Scorpions FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Can't say hardly any of them have actually gone past the first exchange of the debate because "feelings"
     
  3. bigredfutbol

    bigredfutbol Moderator
    Staff Member

    Sep 5, 2000
    Woodbridge, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    You're just as able to search forums as anybody else. You're just as free to search Member profiles as anybody else. And the exchange between he and I was, and remains, on my public profile.

    As for the Mods Forum--there was, as noted by me, nothing there. Thus my assertion that I don't believe he was banned. Is saying "Nothing was done behind closed doors" disclosure of...anything?

    No "dirty laundry". Just public behavior. He chose to be abusive, confrontational, and dishonest on a public message forum. We discussed that. Publicly.
     
  4. bigredfutbol

    bigredfutbol Moderator
    Staff Member

    Sep 5, 2000
    Woodbridge, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Actually, quite a few people have posted in favor of some kind of pro/rel over the years. It's just the two or three who were hostile and belligerent about it who mysteriously found this forum unwelcome.
     
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  5. Elninho

    Elninho Member+

    Sacramento Republic FC
    United States
    Oct 30, 2000
    Sacramento, CA
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    But have they claimed they were banned?
     
  6. M

    M Member+

    Feb 18, 2000
    Via Ventisette
    Yes, quite a few have posted in favour... and quite a few of those - actually most of those - no longer post here.
     
  7. barroldinho

    barroldinho Member+

    Man Utd and LA Galaxy
    England
    Aug 13, 2007
    US/UK dual citizen in HB, CA
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    I'd say that's because those strongly in favour tend to run out of steam.

    For all the polls we've had linked here that indicate US fans favour the system, whenever a poll asks the follow up question "will it work in the US now", a similar majority say no.

    Those raging against the status quo also seem to get easily bent out of shape.

    Even on their preferred medium Twitter, those prominent in the "pro" crowd are serial blockers.

    Frankly, they probably aren't here because the don't care to have their ideas questioned.
     
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  8. HailtotheKing

    HailtotheKing Member+

    San Antonio FC
    United States
    Dec 1, 2008
    TEXAS
    Club:
    San Antonio Scorpions FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Which is easily evidenced by going back and looking at the discussions over the years.
     
  9. bigredfutbol

    bigredfutbol Moderator
    Staff Member

    Sep 5, 2000
    Woodbridge, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The give-and-take here is no more robust than most other forums on the site. It's pretty tame by social media/message board standards. If those people felt unwelcome or persecuted (and I doubt you have any evidence that that's the case), they likely had unrealistic expectations.
     
  10. bigredfutbol

    bigredfutbol Moderator
    Staff Member

    Sep 5, 2000
    Woodbridge, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Hell, I've said over and over again that I LIKE pro/rel and in a perfect world I'd prefer it. I'm a soccer-first guy--I WISH it was big enough.

    I just worry that it's currently a solution in search of a problem. And I've little patience with those who present it as some sort of moral crusade.
     
  11. barroldinho

    barroldinho Member+

    Man Utd and LA Galaxy
    England
    Aug 13, 2007
    US/UK dual citizen in HB, CA
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    I'm of a similar onion. My position has never been "anti-".

    I said very recently that if MLS makes a hard stop at 28 teams as stated, when there are 12 serious prospects for 6 remaining slots, they've created a problem that pro/rel is a solution to.

    Now I prefer continued expansion for as long as it's workable but I also see the league stopping at 32 at the most, in line with other US leagues.

    A rival D1 is also an option, of course.
     
  12. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Same here.
     
  13. M

    M Member+

    Feb 18, 2000
    Via Ventisette
    When a thread - like this one - morphs into an echo chamber, it becomes rather pointless. I suspect there are a variety of reasons for this having happened, but as you know I would include its moderation.
     
  14. bigredfutbol

    bigredfutbol Moderator
    Staff Member

    Sep 5, 2000
    Woodbridge, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I'm pretty open to reasonable criticism. You've never convinced me that my experience over the past 7-8 years should lead me to any other conclusion.
     
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  15. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    You've, again, described pretty much every long running thread on this forum and the echo chamber you are complaining about is in effect for all sides of this argument.
     
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  16. barroldinho

    barroldinho Member+

    Man Utd and LA Galaxy
    England
    Aug 13, 2007
    US/UK dual citizen in HB, CA
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    I just noticed that I put "onion" instead of "opinion".

    I'm glad we're of the same bulb vegetable.
     
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  17. HailtotheKing

    HailtotheKing Member+

    San Antonio FC
    United States
    Dec 1, 2008
    TEXAS
    Club:
    San Antonio Scorpions FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Night Howlers are where it's at.
     
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  18. KCbus

    KCbus Moderator
    Staff Member

    United States
    Nov 26, 2000
    Reynoldsburg, OH
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Sorry I've been gone for a bit... I was off taking a leek.
     
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  19. Tears came in my eyes when I read that post. I wondered what emotion caused it, but now I know the true reason:cry:
     
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  20. bigredfutbol

    bigredfutbol Moderator
    Staff Member

    Sep 5, 2000
    Woodbridge, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  21. barroldinho

    barroldinho Member+

    Man Utd and LA Galaxy
    England
    Aug 13, 2007
    US/UK dual citizen in HB, CA
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    From Nipun Chopra's interview with the current NASL, via Chris Kessell's #ProRelfor USA blog:

    http://prorelforusa.blogspot.com/2017/03/nasl-commisioner-confirms-that-co-d1-is.html

    While Chris quite appropriately brings this up in the context of forming a future pro/rel league, this forever puts to bed the notion that MLS is squatting on the D1 sanction. It also puts a sizeable dent in the theory that via their D1 designation, MLS is somehow silo'ed from competition.
     
  22. 4four4

    4four4 Member+

    Nov 13, 2013
    Land of 10,000 Lakes
    It's a badge of honor to some of these kooks.
     
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  23. M

    M Member+

    Feb 18, 2000
    Via Ventisette
    The "false shortage" created by established closed major leagues strikes again... Oakland Raiders move to Las Vegas approved:

    "The league owners liked the certainty of a huge amount of tax dollars for a stadium versus the uncertain prospects for the team in Oakland, where Mayor Libby Schaaf said often that her city could not afford to pay for the construction of a new stadium, but could provide the land and infrastructure improvements."

    https://www.nytimes.com/2017/03/27/...column-region&region=top-news&WT.nav=top-news
     
  24. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    "False shortage" isn't a problem MLS has at the moment.
     
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  25. barroldinho

    barroldinho Member+

    Man Utd and LA Galaxy
    England
    Aug 13, 2007
    US/UK dual citizen in HB, CA
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    As long as fans subscribe to the "I'm alright, Jack!" philosophy, where they whine about a team leaving but gleefully accept one being relocated to their neighbourhood, I have little sympathy.

    Los Angeles NFL fans vilified Georgia Frontiere for moving the Rams yet didn't bat an eyelid at the Raiders or the Chargers moving here.
     
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