FA Academy Premier League 2011/12

Discussion in 'England' started by Garibaldi11, Jul 20, 2011.

  1. mo0.

    mo0. Member

    Apr 2, 2011
    Club:
    Swindon Town FC
    Re: FA Academy Pemier League 2011/12

    i think Bada and McConnell are just on trial at United.
     
  2. DeanoArsenal

    DeanoArsenal Member

    Jul 21, 2011
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Re: FA Academy Pemier League 2011/12

    I completely agree with your comments regarding the influx of foreign talent. I would like to see 2/3 foreign players at the most in our under 18 teams and I would only want the very very best players coming in. At the moment it seems as though we sign foreign players for the sake of it.

    As for the point about having athletes rather then footballers. I understand your point as we do have some very big players in our youth system but if you look at the philosophy of the club and Wenger in particular he has always preferred the smaller, technical players so I wouldn’t jump to conclusions about a change in philosophy just yet. If you look at the next batch of schoolboys, Akpom, Jebb, Brandon Ottewille, Lipman, they are actually very technical players so we’ll just have to wait and see.

    About your point about the players having bad attitudes, I have noticed for a couple of the players in the younger age groups on facebook/twitter they seem to have this arrogance about them which is worrying at such a young age. We can only hope that this gets drummed out of them by the club.

    I would really love it if the club replaced Brady with someone with fresh ideas who is willing to take the academy ‘forward’ but at arsenal it seems that the board are happy to settle for mediocrity and are too loyal to people who are not fulfilling their roles to the best of their ability!
     
  3. northern ireland fan

    Aug 10, 2001
    belfast
  4. The Guardian

    The Guardian Member+

    Jul 31, 2010
    Club:
    --other--
    Re: FA Academy Pemier League 2011/12

    Chelsea reserves beat Arsenal today 4-0 with Chalobah scoring the first with a back-heel shot, he set up the second with a surging run down the middle and a good pass, and scored the third with an up and over free kick.
     
  5. revelationx

    revelationx Member+

    Jun 5, 2006
    London
    Re: FA Academy Pemier League 2011/12

    What are your thoughts on Rory Donnelly?
     
  6. northern ireland fan

    Aug 10, 2001
    belfast
    Re: FA Academy Pemier League 2011/12

    Player with great potential (he only made his senior debut in september), he can score with both feet, both inside and outside the box, is great in the air and though a bit skinny now, he has the body frame to muscle out - for 100K he is an absolute steal - some of his goals on youtube are tasty as well.

    Looks like he's joining swansea, as he's over there now discussing terms - but liverpool have made a late bid from kenny dalglish personally (brendan rodgers being from N.I will probably swing it for swansea though) and everton have also had a bid accepted.

    I would say Donnelly has the potential to be at least as good as kevin doyle/seamus coleman, players who went more or less straight from eircom league to the premiership - people who have seen him a lot more than me, who have know their football, say he's the best player they have seen in the irish league in a long while.

    i would expect him to make as least a big
     
  7. revelationx

    revelationx Member+

    Jun 5, 2006
    London
    Re: FA Academy Pemier League 2011/12

    OK thanks. He was in Swansea today but will be in Liverpool on Tuesday. I assume he will meet with Everton too. After that he will have to weigh up any offers he gets and make a choice.
     
  8. silva is gold

    silva is gold Member

    Jul 25, 2011
    Club:
    Manchester City FC
    Re: FA Academy Pemier League 2011/12

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=43PenoJ7lg8"]City 6-1 Wolves at Platt Lane[/ame]

    Highlights of the great win over Wolves, with a hat trick from Cole.
     
  9. SirWellingtonSilva

    May 30, 2011
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Re: FA Academy Pemier League 2011/12

    so Zele Ismail wants to represent serbia?
     
  10. BarryfromEastenders

    Staff Member

    Jul 6, 2008
    Re: FA Academy Pemier League 2011/12

    No. All these commentators just guess.
     
  11. blackman

    blackman Member

    Apr 12, 2011
    norf london
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Re: FA Academy Pemier League 2011/12

    I strongly disagree with you juni........Once again black players are judged by the colour of their skin and not by their technical level.......YOU CAN'T SAY PLAYERS LIKE ANEKE,HAYDEN OR NEITA ARE MORE ATHLETES THAN FOOTBALLER!!!!! That's so false than i wonder if you ever saw them play accurately ??? Aneke is one of the best central midfielder of his generation (as wenger and stevenage's coach said...) he got the potential to dominate the midifield almost alone (technically and physically)......just like a certain pat vieira did 10 years ago (don't tell me that vieira was more an athlete than a footballer.....) Hayden can play CB-HM-CM just like chelsea's chalobah and loftus-cheek.......are they more athletes than footballers too? Neita ain't the most prolific forward but he got a lovely left foot.
    You seem to focus too much on the colour of their skin mate , i wonder what you will think when you'll see the "arsenal genius" play ......he is a blakc kid.....
     
  12. Juni

    Juni Member+

    Nov 26, 2010
    Club:
    Chelsea FC
    Re: FA Academy Pemier League 2011/12

    Not only have I seen them play 'accurately' but Ive seen them live in person too. I've never rated Aneke and I never will, but I'll respond in much more detail tomorrow when I'm more awake and on my PC, not my phone.
     
  13. b-El

    b-El Member

    May 6, 2010
    London
    Club:
    Chelsea FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    Re: FA Academy Pemier League 2011/12

    Steady on there mate. The CFC players Juni compared the Arsenal lot to are also black. His point being they've gone for the bigger lot than CFC.
     
  14. blackman

    blackman Member

    Apr 12, 2011
    norf london
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Re: FA Academy Pemier League 2011/12

    @ b-el , don't know about chelsea but arsenal still focus on technique more than other aspect of the game (physique,tactic etc.....) and you can see it in the players who are promoted in the first team......apart frimpong........they all have a very high technical level and aneke is recognized to be one of the most gifted ( one of the two "technically perfect" kid........said wenger some years ago) the problem with chucks is mental......
    He still want to play only as a AM but arsenal would like to develop him more as a CM.....but i'm waiting for juni's tomorrow explanations.
     
  15. SirWellingtonSilva

    May 30, 2011
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Re: FA Academy Pemier League 2011/12

    On this topic why is there very few great black players that play as creative midfielders? think clarence seedorf, but cant think of many others at the moment
     
  16. SirWellingtonSilva

    May 30, 2011
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
  17. Alvin Row

    Alvin Row Member

    May 19, 2011
    Re: FA Academy Pemier League 2011/12

    Not only a bizarre thing to say, but a presumptuous one too.
     
  18. blackman

    blackman Member

    Apr 12, 2011
    norf london
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Re: FA Academy Pemier League 2011/12

    Jay jay okocha,ruud gullit, russell latapy, abedi pele,kalusha bwalya, kanu,john barnes, laurie cunningham......plus the south american djalminha,marcelinho carioca, candido filho valdo, ronaldinho (i think is mixed)....etc
     
  19. SirWellingtonSilva

    May 30, 2011
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Re: FA Academy Pemier League 2011/12

    Only a couple of those are great players, others just very very talented players that didnt play at the highest level, some of them werent even midfielders either... im suprised you didnt mention pele (brazil)
     
  20. Juni

    Juni Member+

    Nov 26, 2010
    Club:
    Chelsea FC
    Re: FA Academy Pemier League 2011/12

    Let me preface my response with something first. When you're dealing with players at Premier Academy League level, we're dealing with players who are technically proficient, at least 90% of them anyway. If I refer to a physical approach it doesn't mean that I think the player has two left feet and can't trap a ball to save his life, it's that I think his physical attributes make things easy for him/make him complacent. A lot of the time it's also to his detriment, as I'll get to with Aneke.

    RE: 'the best central midfielder of his generation' - you're mis-paraphrasing there aren't you? The quote you're after is 'technically perfect', which was never officially attributed to a player. Instead, Arsenal fans have labelled anyone from Aneke to Afobe to Ansah to Bunjaku to Kyle Young to Jordan Brown to any 12 year-old prodigies depending on how it suits their argument.

    In any event it's one opinion, and one I disagree with, but I'll get to Aneke with Alvin's post below. As was pointed out to you, I wasn't saying black = big, physical players with no technical ability because the Chelsea players I rattled off are black. I remarked that given the choice, Arsenal have opted to build youth teams around bigger players - doesn't matter that they're black; but the proportion of black teenagers at London football academies is huge and so unfortunately people can be led towards presumptions.

    Neita has never struck me as anything other than a bullish, athletic forward with limited technical prowess. Hayden is similar to Aneke, so we'll go to him later. Needless to say I wouldn't be so churlish as to suggest that Arsenal's players can't play football, we know they're educated well. What I noted is that the sort of players they've started to favour are bigger and stronger than before and their approach (whether as an indirect result or as a directive) has become more direct.

    It's presumptuous based on me having watched him and seen nothing that says to me that he'll have a top pro career. The guy is cumbersome beyond belief, lacking agility, balance, fluidity in his movements and any dynamic whatsoever. I wouldn't expect the world of a man his size and I certainly wouldn't expect it as a teenager but he's had it easy so far in his career as a man-sized midfielder against boys. Doesn't surprise me a jot that he's starred at 18s and reserve levels; so did Jay Emmanuel-Thomas.

    Both have good footwork and individual skill, and can make things happen, but they lack something which sets them apart off the ball, and that's huge. I'm not even getting into mental issues (which I find is an issue with both but that's just a view from afar so mere conjecture on my part) but Emmanuel-Thomas received similar hype from Arsenal fans before they realised he wasn't going to cut it at their level (and I doubt he'll ever make it at the top flight). Aneke may get that chance, he may not; that clip above shows nothing new to me - he dominated his man physically and then had time and space to play a cross. Fine against youngsters and league one standard players, but try it against bigger, better men and see where it gets you.

    Don't want this to turn into a CFC vs AFC sort of angle at all because it's not intended that way, just observations I'm totally open to debating. We're all interested in the same thing and have different viewpoints on it, and that's a great thing to have on this forum.
     
  21. blackman

    blackman Member

    Apr 12, 2011
    norf london
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Re: FA Academy Pemier League 2011/12

    OK that's your opinion juni and i respect that....but i still strongly disagree because you still puting completely opposite kind of players in the same basket....for example, hayden and fagan are very different same goes for aneke and wynter, just like chalobah and mills pappoe, loftus-cheek and ince etc....in my opinion you can not say that those pairs are "physicals players" when is so obvious they are not the same kind of players.......i'm not saying you are a racist at all, but it seems like your judgement is based more on the colour of the skin rather than their " football qualities".
    There is one thing that i don't understand about your "aneke analysis", you say he was so dominant in the youth league due to his man size body......but now that is starting to do the same thing with men you say is because is a league one standard player........sorry mate but that's sound ridiculous.
     
  22. Juni

    Juni Member+

    Nov 26, 2010
    Club:
    Chelsea FC
    Re: FA Academy Pemier League 2011/12

    Well physical dominance translates to any level, but against players of his own age he's more likely to appear on the scoresheet/make goals because it's that much easier. He'll still get him some against adults, but as the quality of the adult goes up, he'll find it harder to compete with strength alone.

    With the likes of Wynter, it's the same sort of argument, they're not necessarily tall but they have big frames and are very quick, and these attributes stand out ahead of their technical ones. Just look at Wynter compared to someone like Bobby Devyne physically, he absolutely dwarves him despite them being the same age (roughly) and position.

    With Ince and Pappoe, their lack of mobility has been reason number one why I've never considered them prospects. I'm far from saying that Arsenal are the only club that produces big lads of this nature but they're more prevalent within the club's system right now, at least in my findings.

    I look at Chelsea's intake for next summer, there's about 17 of them, and Loftus-Cheek is the biggest guy at what, 6'1" and a fairly lithe frame? I'm not entirely up on Arsenal's intake but if I look at RLC's England U16 teammates Brown and Iwobi, they're gigantic for U15s, especially in their physiques. I'm not beginning to suggest that neither can play, because they can, but it's hard to deny that they're exceptional physical specimens at the same time.
     
  23. BlueRebelZ

    BlueRebelZ Member+

    Aug 2, 2011
    Club:
    Chelsea FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Singapore
    Re: FA Academy Pemier League 2011/12

    Actually it's more opposite, in a sense that given a choice between one young, technically gifted, skillful yet with a small stature & less physical frame; and a relatively moderate player with a bigger physical frame that is capable of dominating an opponent across all youth level but possesses less technical finesse & agility in some cases, current Arsenal choice would the the latter. Few years ago it used be the exact opposite as we have seen in Arsenal graduates.

    Don't know if it's due to Arsenal being regarded as the more weaker in "men against children" labeled games vs physical opponent in PL for a certain period in the past. Whether that has played in the Arsenal philosophy or not, current Arsenal boys across age groups are more physical specimens & athletes than ballers, something Juni also noted last season during the FAYC clash. Quick footed & faster Lalkovic simply outpaced the less agile Arsenal defender in a 30 yards area ball chase & he started the chase for about 5-6 yards behind the defender. [FONT=&quot]It's a stark contrast given PL itself is now showcase for smaller skillful technically gifted players, something Arsenal itself has produced through it's graduates.


    Nothing with the color of skin. Reasons are already explained well. It just happened due to mass African origin in London & the qualities now cherished by Arsenal are more prominent in them. If there is one with Phil Jones frame & matches current Arsenal philosophy & strategy, I believe they will take him happily.
    [/FONT] [FONT=&quot][/FONT]
     
  24. cr7torossi

    cr7torossi Member+

    May 10, 2007
    Re: FA Academy Pemier League 2011/12

    Interesting stuff juni. So essentially in your opinion, Arsenal's philosophy is now moving towards City's at the academy level.
     
  25. The Guardian

    The Guardian Member+

    Jul 31, 2010
    Club:
    --other--
    Re: FA Academy Pemier League 2011/12

    Perhaps it's one of those questions that should never be asked?

    Unless you're looking to get banned. :D
     

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