Canadian Premier league

Discussion in 'Canada' started by mikehurst21, Feb 3, 2016.

  1. Kingston

    Kingston Member+

    Oct 6, 2005
    People in non-MLS markets will certainly support their own. I disagree that no one outside those markets support MLS. Rather, I suspect a lot of soccer fans follow one of the MLS teams just for fun even if they would more actively support a local CPL team. They can be fans of both. (One poster on this site literally has the user name atlanticTFCfan.)
     
    When Saturday Comes repped this.
  2. Robert Borden

    Robert Borden Member+

    Chelsea
    Canada
    Apr 19, 2017
    Toronto, Ontario
    Nat'l Team:
    Canada
  3. Robert Borden

    Robert Borden Member+

    Chelsea
    Canada
    Apr 19, 2017
    Toronto, Ontario
    Nat'l Team:
    Canada
    Maybe not "no one" but those TV numbers don't lie, its very "niche" outside the 3 cities
     
  4. Kingston

    Kingston Member+

    Oct 6, 2005
    That would be great. I hope at least one of them would be for 2020 so that we can have an even number of teams.
     
  5. Robert Borden

    Robert Borden Member+

    Chelsea
    Canada
    Apr 19, 2017
    Toronto, Ontario
    Nat'l Team:
    Canada
    The Ottawa saga might come to an end. Major announcement tomorrow on the club's future.
    Rumors are saying they would take a hiatus in 2020 to join CPL in 2021. We'll see.
     
  6. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    That seems... Odd.. Why the hiatus?
     
  7. Robert Borden

    Robert Borden Member+

    Chelsea
    Canada
    Apr 19, 2017
    Toronto, Ontario
    Nat'l Team:
    Canada
    Sources are confirming that CONCACAF and the CSA wouldn't sanction them.
    Also being reported by CBC French
     
  8. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    So the Fury are going under then, not on hiatus? The hiatus makes more sense if we're talking about the Fury going under and a new Ottawa ownership group starting up a new team. But if we're talking about the Fury being forced into the CPL, I wouldn't think a hiatus is necessary.
     
  9. Robert Borden

    Robert Borden Member+

    Chelsea
    Canada
    Apr 19, 2017
    Toronto, Ontario
    Nat'l Team:
    Canada
    They are going under because the CSA & CONCACAF denied them USL sanction for 2020. It wouldn't need to go this far if they were going on hiatus to join CPL later.

    It's looking that they still wouldn't joined CPL, this CSA & CONCACAF pulling the plug on them.

    CPL now holds all the cards in Ottawa and they are under no obligation to prioritize OSEG over a much more enthusiastic new ownership group.

    The Fury did this to themselves.

    This further demonstrates that at the end of the day, cross-border leagues are happening until the confederation and Association dont want it anymore and there's not really recourse against such a decision
     
  10. Robert Borden

    Robert Borden Member+

    Chelsea
    Canada
    Apr 19, 2017
    Toronto, Ontario
    Nat'l Team:
    Canada
  11. Chastaen

    Chastaen Member+

    Alavés
    Jul 9, 2004
    Winnipeg
    Club:
    Aston Villa FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Outside the 3 cities there is no "real" market. We open a quarter of our 33 thousand seat stadium and we fill less than half of that, We averaged 5k a game this year.
     
  12. Robert Borden

    Robert Borden Member+

    Chelsea
    Canada
    Apr 19, 2017
    Toronto, Ontario
    Nat'l Team:
    Canada
    It's year 1, takes time
     
  13. Chastaen

    Chastaen Member+

    Alavés
    Jul 9, 2004
    Winnipeg
    Club:
    Aston Villa FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    You've gone from rivaling the CFL and NHL to "Its year 1".

    Unrealistic optimism ends up in dead leagues. People get high expectations and then become disenfranchised when the league is average or below average, which almost always leads in a further drop in support.

    Be realistic, let people's expectations grow with the league. I cant tell you how many franchises I've seen start strong with pumped up fans only to become a wikipedia stub of failure. Enthusiasm is great, but we are better of with some realism too.
     
  14. Robert Borden

    Robert Borden Member+

    Chelsea
    Canada
    Apr 19, 2017
    Toronto, Ontario
    Nat'l Team:
    Canada
    "Potential" long term....not year one or short term. CPL has to do it right but they can build up to that. Starting the league 7 years before a 2026 World Cup in Canada isn't a coincidence

    That's not what sanked the CSL. CPL is doing the opposite of them and they are succeeding

    Again, long term, potential...not short term nor immediately. Dont forget the timing with the world cup. Look what it did for the US. CPL can build organically and reap the rewards post 2026. Data proves that its doable BUT, the league has to do it right and it's on them to make it happen
     
  15. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Are you actually responding to my comment? I'm not questioning why Ottawa is going under. I was just saying the rumor you included in your original post about them taking a year off and then joining CPL in 2021 doesn't make sense. Now that reporting is that they are going under, it makes sense if you eliminate the Fury from the 2021 equation.
     
  16. Chastaen

    Chastaen Member+

    Alavés
    Jul 9, 2004
    Winnipeg
    Club:
    Aston Villa FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    If succeeding is successfully finished year 1, great. CSL had a successful year 1 too. Even added the Supra. There are challenges CPL will not have to face, and probably some CSL didn't have to face.

    EVERY league has long term potential. No league starts with the idea that they are done in 3-4 years. CSL made Canada stronger, but the net result was a loss. The idea that CPL is going to succeed longer is not a guarantee.Unrealistic expectations can kill this league. Let's enjoy it growing at its pace.
     
  17. Robert Borden

    Robert Borden Member+

    Chelsea
    Canada
    Apr 19, 2017
    Toronto, Ontario
    Nat'l Team:
    Canada
    Yes, as more info comes out, looks like they are done indefinitely. Doubtful that CPL would want to do business with them unless there's a massive shift in their attitude and major changes
     
  18. Robert Borden

    Robert Borden Member+

    Chelsea
    Canada
    Apr 19, 2017
    Toronto, Ontario
    Nat'l Team:
    Canada
    The media deal with MediaPro guarantees a long term presence of the league...at least 10 years. It's night and day between those 2 leagues.

    Their business plans are night and day, completely different on all aspects, I recommend looking into it
     
  19. Chastaen

    Chastaen Member+

    Alavés
    Jul 9, 2004
    Winnipeg
    Club:
    Aston Villa FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I cant begin to tell you how many times these comment have been made by someone over selling a league that went dormant within a few years. But I admire your willingness to keep shovelling. Hopefully you are right.

    Edit: And yes, Im guilty of having been than fanboi a time or two. But again...maybe this time it will be different.
     
  20. Potowmack

    Potowmack Member+

    Apr 2, 2010
    Washington, DC
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    It’s one thing to bully a moderately wealthy ownership group like Ottawa. It’s quite another to bully Maple Leaf Sports & Entertainment, and MLS.
     
    When Saturday Comes repped this.
  21. Robert Borden

    Robert Borden Member+

    Chelsea
    Canada
    Apr 19, 2017
    Toronto, Ontario
    Nat'l Team:
    Canada
    Bully or having everyone to abide by existing rules they agreed on when they got their initial sanction?

    If that day ever comes, there's no recourse
     
  22. Potowmack

    Potowmack Member+

    Apr 2, 2010
    Washington, DC
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I take it you’re not a lawyer.

    Toronto FC, for example, is a $300 million asset. What do you think a multi billion dollar company would be willing to do to protect such an asset? Could CPL and CONCACAF afford to fight a multi-year, multi-million dollar legal fight in Canada and the US?

    You keep saying no “recourse”, but I bet there are $1000 per hour lawyers in Toronto and New York that would prove you very wrong.
     
  23. Robert Borden

    Robert Borden Member+

    Chelsea
    Canada
    Apr 19, 2017
    Toronto, Ontario
    Nat'l Team:
    Canada
    #3423 Robert Borden, Nov 7, 2019
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2019
    You clearly aren't one either :)... Where are the Fury lawyers?;)

    Toronto FC agreed to FIFA rules when they got their sanction and signed on it as did the other 2 teams. They knew all along that sanctioning isn't "guaranteed" nor "eternal".

    Of course!!!!!!!!!!!!
    If it came to that, due to the single entity nature of MLS, they'd have to sell their franchise back to the league or to another group...

    They got in for $10M. Selling it back for $300M wouldn't make them cry one bit. They'd be laughing to the bank and start over in CPL...if it came to that.
     
  24. Potowmack

    Potowmack Member+

    Apr 2, 2010
    Washington, DC
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Real world, here’s what would happen if CONCACAF tried to unilaterally pull sanctioning for MLS cross-border sanctioning:

    MLS and the affected teams would file suit, most likely in Miami. They would file for an injunction to stay CONCACAF’s decision, which they would win. The parties would then proceed towards years of motions, discovery and appeals. Because the MLS side has much deeper pockets, they would grind the Concacaf side down. They would also put the full lobbying press on to get the Federal government to again start investigating Concacaf corruption.

    How long do you think Concacaf would continue to support CPL in that situation?
     
  25. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The cost of a lawsuit to fight the Fury's inability to be sanctioned isn't worth it to their owners. It is highly likely the owners are either losing money on the Fury, or any lawsuit would wipe out what little profit their are making on the club. That isn't the case for MLS and the Canadian MLS clubs.

    A significant portion of TFC's $300 million valuation is in the club itself. If they, or any of the other Canadian MLS clubs were unable to get sanctioning, the club portion of their valuation would become instantly worthless and the only value they'd have would be the portion of SUM that they own. Now the SUM portion is worth more than $10 million, they are still likely to come after the CSA and CONCACAF for the difference.
     

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