I would say Netz and Moukoko are obvious choices who don’t have to fear competition from veterans/foreign youngsters and can directly start for Hertha and Dortmund There are some other examples of coz . But those two are way too obvious If we have more talents like Netz, Moukoko or Gedikli, then they don’t have to fear about competition from anyone 10 years ago , we produced better talents. Stuttgart wouldn’t buy a foreign CM because they knew Khedira was starting n he won’t be replaced from youth to pro, so anyone joins will only be his backup; Werder Bremen won’t buy another playmaker because they had Oezil , n Oezil is better than any playmaker in the market even other options were older n more experienced. Because they were so special
maybe because Makanda is eligible for another season in U19 and not the 1st or last player who had a bad 1st U19 season. If you learn from it and improve, I dont think clubs care about.......you remember this player had a bad 2018-2019 season, they'll care about 2019-2020 season and there is no II, some mass injuries and who'll be up for 1st team? They still have 3 competitions to play. Although I wouldn't be surprised if he gets loaned out instead in 2020. I saw Otto press a lot in all 3 games this season. That is the whole point young striker=lots to work on and improve. You criticize them and they'll work on their issues. It's not oh he can never improve on his game ever. every and all Bayern players are in a bad position until the club get a new coach and real plan. I think it's more complicated than what you make it out to be. Even if a player is great if the club only starts 1 up top or the players joins from U19 to be initially between 3rd and 5th striker. Or if they play 2 uptpp and your 4th-5h, They could still easily get delayed or loaned out regardless of elite or top talent status. you make it seem like every coach in 1BL would start Elite strikers when that is not the case as every team focuses on players with pro experience and young players with no pro experience=integration, not they will jump directly in XI. Arp/Werner were playing for relegation fodder teams where everyone sucked. Those are the clubs where its a lot easier. Bayer play a lot of games with only 1 uptop, you really expect Gedikli to jump as starter? Unlikely for a club with Europe ambitions. Even the Winger 00-Paulinho who people rate highly is still at the integration/mostly sub player.
back then the league was different, now I see way too many coaches who seem to be scared to use youth players with 0 pro experience. It really is almost like they expect to lose matches if they do. Why waste time integrating when you can just buy someone with experience and everything is quicker and easier for them.
can't expect to have a shit ton of Elite strikers, those don't get mass produced by any country. What's most important is to dev as many strikers as possible that reach 1BL. should see much more improvement all around when dfb update training for strikers.
It’s not the point Arp n Werner could outplay veteran to start , as I said yes his teammates were not good, but still Werner and Arp were elite talents to start with so it makes it so much easier for them to breakthrough early. Imagine if HSV n Stuttgart were shit, but Arp n Werner became Cagatay Kader n Christian Stark. They wouldn’t outplay nothing Moukoko will be starting for Dortmund at some point, it’s pretty much guaranteed; And yes I think Gedikli will start firm bench and will eventually getting starting appearance before the age of 20. And think, Dortmund didn’t buy many young strikers because they knew whoever they bought in will be a sub of Moukoko anyway. So Moukoko won the competition against any foreign striker talent Oezil was so special and anyone in Werder Bremen knew. So they only found his backup instead of finding his replacement If we keep producing elites like Sane, Havertz, Arp, Moukoko, Netz and Gedikli ... competition is not a concern They will make it n most likely within their own clubs . If u can produce a Havertz or Moukoko , then teams won’t buy any player at same position from England or France. And even if they’re brought in, Havertz, Netz n Moukoko those will make them stick to the bench . No worries Now, talents need to show they are special and elite... very early. Earlier than before. They need to show the coaches as many specialities as possible. Elite talents will make it But if we are not producing good talents , of coz we are afraid of competitions and clubs need to buy elsewhere.
what I'm interested to see is Bayern, RB Leipzig, Dortmund and Bayer all made UEFA Youth League. good chance to see Moukoko, Gedikli (they should use him even if U17 currently), Borkowski and whoever is striker at Bayern U19 play vs other leagues.
Media and sponsorships also play major role Elite talents like Moukoko for example, already have huge media coverage and huge contract form various sponsors. Dortmund will be aware of that too. Heard Netz’s situation is pretty similar even he isn’t as famous as Moukoko internationally , but everyone in Germany knows he’s a top prospect in years If u aren’t Havertz, Netz or Moukoko . Not much media attention n all those money behind, of coz it’s another story Key is to be special n make noise early. Of coz u need a huge degree of talent.
just imagine the embarrassment from Dortmund and sponsors if he ends up as a fraud. Same to dfb if he's used in competitive games. is he 100% a 2004 born player that is the real question mark on Moukoko.
I might be wrong but I think there are some elite talents coming through from 2003/2004 after. 2002 maybe getting slightly better. (Malik Tillman played CF for Bayern U17 n this season with Bayern U19 also as striker?). Don’t think Maximilian Beier is elite but he is playing more like a modern forward but he needs some improvements in his games too. Think he’s on the right track 2003 onwards: Netz and Gedikli are world’s elites. Maybe 2-3 others are among top 20 talents in Europe 2004 there are many too.
02-Beier actually played in Hoff 1st team friendlies this Summer. One of the few Academy players that played with Hoff 1st team. And just came from U17 too. Rhein is Elite, everyone wants him but will Bayern do anything with him.......People always seem to rate Gunther, Musiala, maybe Wirtz if he can just stay fit. I'm curious about the dev of a lot of 03s and 04s. Both seem like good age groups. Let's see how 03s do in Germany U17 next season and if we can actually call up for once best possible squad. meanwhile. ✍️🆕 Neuzugang Nummer ✌️ heute:Richmond Tachie kommt vom @VfL_Wolfsburg II zur Viktoria nach Höhenberg! ☺️Der 20- Jährige wird ab sofort die Offensive der Viktoria verstärken! 💪☺️Hätzlich Willkumme, Richi! #Vussball pic.twitter.com/bXSq5UqlTO— FC Viktoria Köln 1904 (@viktoria1904) August 13, 2019
If I look at strikers like Borkowski, Max Beier, Gedikli, Adeyemi, Wollschlager, Sieb, Moukoko, Mekoma, Keke Topp and Kojic . I think they are very close to the standard of modern strikers Woltemade is very technical even for his size Before we had some bigger strikers or “false 9”. But their game isn’t entirely fitted for modern football Big ones are targetman, even complete strikers can’t press n interchange much, technical game in tight space were weak for some of them; False 9s lack physicality and finishing was an issue with most of them. Take Gedikli, Sieb and Mekoma for example, things are way better. Can drop deep, can interchange with wingers, can press, can play tough n can finish
did 04-Kojic bust his head? photo from the Schalke U17 match were he scored a double vs rivals Bochum. Actually played a role in all 3 goals.
all I'm seeing from Germany is that 98-onwards gets a lot better for the country in terms of strikers. Even if some players might require a few years in 2BL or leave to another league to breakthrough faster. Between elite strikers, guys who get 1st team integration in 1BL (not every 1st team integration will = elite, it's all about individual clubs rating a player) and guys needing 1-3 years in 2BL. It does seem to be better, finger crossed...................outside of 01. serious question why Moukoko in U18, just play him in U19 and let him save the 01 age group. I hope Makanda performs in U19 to increase options since Glatzel is out for awhile.
It’s interesting that I’ve talked to a few 2003 players. Bright , Bent Anderson n Moritz Reuther . They named a few best talents (always Netz first, Gunther n Sieb always among top 5) they never named Torben Rhein. It does make me wonder if Rhein really is a top prospect in this age group? I have no idea but when I watched Rhein, he was impressive Netz n Gedikli imo are top 5 talents in Europe at this age. I have no worries about them competing against anyone in Europe at least from 2002-2004 If they can’t make it in their clubs for whatever reasons. They will start early in 1BL Beier plays like a modern forward: can press, can do 1v1, can hold up , play back -to-goal, build up, can score reasonable amounts. Not elite by any means. But I think he will make his way around 21
I think the situation is better post 02 Elite talents is not how the club rate them. Not even the media You can tell from tourneys and how a player got his coverage n sponsors at young age If Dortmund are sponsored by Nike in 3 years, I’d bet Moukoko will start games by then. N Moukoko’s situation is actually not unique. But he is almost guarantee to start for Dortmund at some point, 18 latest In Germany, Havertz, Arp and Werner were highly rated and of coz they started their career early Arp n Werner couldn’t make it in HSV or Stuttgart even they’re struggling teams. Imagine if they were Phil Hofmann or Cagatay Kader, coaches wouldn’t have used them or trust them anyway Elite talents have advantage to first team n sometimes if u look back ... they don’t have to fear competitions from veterans or foreign talents. Clubs will make way for u if u are Oezil, Havertz or Moukoko If at 16-18 u aren’t showing u are somewhat special , teams will buy elsewhere. So key is to show that u are elite or special at young age and that stopped teams from buying too And even if teams bought foreign talents we need to make sure that our kids will stick their arses on the bench I seriously don’t think 1998-2001 have any change within DFB. 2002 slightly better but 2003 is a turning point I have to see some 2005ers to make a conclusion
J.Eggestein headed for midfield..... "I said to him in a one-on-one interview: Jojo, I want to continue on this path with you," explains Werder head coach Florian Kohfeldt, "but I want you to see yourself as an attacking midfielder who thinks like a striker." As a result, he could get in the squad a "unique selling proposition". Concretely, Kohfeldt says, "If I want to limit it to one position, I can play eights, tens and outside midfielders, if we play it a little closer, he's not the classic winger for me, that's three positions he plays and that I also feel very positive. " But now Kohfeldt sees his protégé just a little more defensive, which Eggestein himself also "completely agree," as the coach says. "It's also the development he wants to go." Good for Kohfeldt, who says he will not impose a new position on a player: "You can not do that against a player's will, so understanding is important." If it is an example of situations in which Kohfeldt Eggestein wants to see in the future, then you just have to look at the test match against SD Eibar (4: 0) - more precisely, the last goal of the encounter: "Since Jojo comes from the Eighth position, but has just this nose, to know: When I go deep and how do I conclude? This can really make him a very important player for us and there I see him. " For a place in the Stammelf it is currently enough, but probably not yet. In the aft positions are his brother Maximilian Eggestein and Davy Klaassen set before Yuya Osako currently makes the Max Kruse replacement. He is also an integral part of Bremen's first team. However, Johannes Eggestein can always be prepared for joker inserts at the start of the season. https://www.ligainsider.de/johannes-eggestein_6752/kohfeldt-sieht-eggestein-im-mittelfeld-274984/
Ive been saying that too Moukoko for 2001 makes more sense. Especially Glatzel seems injured for so long Moukoko, Jastremski and Seb Muller/Serkan Dursun? Will do
Rhein usually impresses even for Germany. Beier making at 21, isn't too bad, you don't need to be Elite to make 1BL but it just fastforwards the process. I thought Bent Anderson who I knew barely anything about played very well for Germany U16 vs France in his 1st and only Germany cap.
a bit more What the new plans for Johannes Eggestein actually mean in the field, Kohfeldt outlines: "If we want to limit it to one position, for me eighth, ten and outside midfielder can play, if we play it a little closer. He is not the classic winger for me. These are three positions he can play and which I find very positive. "If his team plays in the famous Werder rhombus, he could also picture the young Eggestein" as one of two peaks in the storm, "says Kohfeldt "I'd rather see him on the other positions in midfield." so basically J.Eggestein is not see as someone (for now) who can play sole CF and W isn't going to cut it as he's better centrally. And Bremen wanted a new midfielder and now they'll settle for Eggestein. Once again what was the point of loaning out Mbom? Or when Mbom comes back? better playing time than nothing but not a big fan of playing him in 8. Striker dev and club wants to play a striker as a CM........10/AM isn't too bad because it will help in build up play and not far off from SS. Can eventually move back to CF, in a few years.
Now Moukoko is about to return. BVB manager Michael Zorc: "If Youssoufa has expressed a desire to play for Germany in the long term, I welcome that, of course." Meikel Schönweitz (39), head of the U-national teams: "I believe that this step is very important for his development."
lol not what I had in mind when I said strikers should consider leaving Germany.... 99-Vujinovic joins Luxembourg 1st division club. https://www.instagram.com/p/B0oO6EZlJ5K/?igshid=1q5iegkkn8w0h nothing beats 00-Tokac playing in Japanese 1st division.
Update on 00-Raschl and 00-Osterhage. Recovery is progressing slowly: Borussia Dortmund's plan with talent Patrick Osterhage BVB II Patrick Osterhage was suddenly stopped by an old injury. Now, for the football player who has a professional contract with BVB, there is a rough plan on how to proceed. While Tobias Raschl took his place next to Jadon Sancho and Marcel Schmelzer in this week's shoot of the Dortmund team picture, Patrick Osterhage was not seen. Raschl and Osterhage - both 19 years old, last season's crowned Under-19 champions and equipped with a professional contract - set out to join the extended circle of Lucien Favre's elite unit. Only Raschl, however, seems to have made that jump, at least currently. Osterhage is still plagued with a physical malaise. He has not been able to play for weeks, but his recovery is progressing. Old injury breaks In the final of the German U19 championship (5: 3 against VfB Stuttgart) an old injury broke again, henceforth labored Osterhage to "a persistent inflammation in the knee," as he told this editorial. Working hierarchically further upwards in the direction of Dortmund's Bundesliga team moved so far into the distance. The doctors ordered him to take a break from work. Osterhage is not allowed to train, he described his injury-related break as "naturally frustrating" in mid-June. Especially since his body does not refuse his allegiance for the first time. Already in the past season, he was often stopped, ran in only twelve competitive matches. No return forecast It is still difficult to see when the central midfielder will return to the pitch after his recent complaint. Ingo Preuß, Dortmund's U23 manager, reports that Osterhage is "going up". There is no concrete return prognosis. Thorsten Haas, Osterhage's consultant for about five years, also says he "can not and does not want to issue a water level report". Because a lot of work is still pending for this highly talented, together with the rehabilitation trainers and physiotherapists of the club, the "no pressure at all," as BVB II coach Tullberg says. Osterhage should be fit in peace. "He needs patience," adviser Haas says. This brings his protégé currently on. Match practice in the U23 When Osterhage will be able to kick again is unclear where, however, clearly outlined. First, he should start under the guidance of Tullberg in the Regionalliga team, there to collect game time. "I count him first as part of our team," says U23 squad planner Preuß. "If he is fit and ultimately too good, he will certainly play top." With Lucien Favre in the Bundesliga staff. Ibid, where Raschl is currently posted. For Haas, Osterhage's career companion, "it is completely irrelevant which team he belongs to. Importantly, Patrick is free of pain, standing on the pitch, and playing football. "Starting in U23 is" perfectly logical "and" a gift. " BVB II is looking forward to Osterhage Not many clubs could offer the opportunity to gain playing practice in a second representation at a still high level. Furthermore, according to Haas, "nobody - neither Patrick nor myself or his family - is so presumptuous to believe that he can go straight to the professionals." With the BVB II, the anticipation is great on Osterhage and his sporting skills as a strategist in the central midfield. "He can certainly help us," says football teacher Tullberg. "Patrick was not for nothing U19 captain last year." And is due to its complex qualities - when he is then finally ready for action - find his place on the lawn. By the way, Osterhage also has this on a Dortmund team picture. Although he is not seen in the pros, on the U23, however, already. https://www.ruhrnachrichten.de/loka...lan-mit-talent-patrick-osterhage-1436503.html shame that he's delaying his pro career to injuries. Although Dortmund are high on both Raschl and Osterhage.
Barkok out for three months,the shoulder. Poor guy, had good chances to make a lot more minutes this season than last
I am thinking teams are buying from France n England because we dont produce elite talents like we used to (with the 1988, 1989, 1995, 1996) If we have more Oezil, Boatengs, Hummels, Benders, Sane, Goretzka, Sule, Kimmich, Brandt, Timo Werner, Klostermann Teams have good enough players and they know they have some potential supertstars on their hands they wont buy anyone, maybe only backups Oezil wouldn't have competition form any other foreign talents because he was by far the best playmaking AM in Europe, so anyone joined would only be his backup; I remember Sule and Stark started for their clubs ahead of their veteran players at very early age, becaus they were too good and probably the best young CBs for their age when they were younger. So clubs wont need to buy anyone because they were CERTAIN about these elites.And even if there were players from other countries they cant put our elites on the bench Now we are not only afraid of French, Spanish, English and Portugese but also even afraid of talents from Serbia, Croatia, Denmark, Norway n US....... The bets solution is we produce elite talents in huge quantity again. I think 1995 and 1996 were our last two successful years, then 1997 n 1998 are very very weak. We need to produce elite talents who are among top 50 players in Europe, clubs know it and sponsors know it, then it will give them pressure to play them early. n no need to buy from other countries, even if they do the foreign kids will only be backups or benchwarmers. Timo Werner and Arp were highly rated already when they were 16, then teams were aware of that. Of coz they were going through some difficult situations but if Werner becomes Marius Duhnke and Arp was someone like Cagatay Kader, teams would be hestitate to play them to begin with. The biggest issue now with teams is that they arent as certain with the level of talent as they were towards the 1988 or 1996 for instance. If we can have more Moukokos or Gediklis, they are certain about the level of talents, 1) they wont have a need to buy young foreign strikers 2) even if they buy, they will not outplay our elite striker talents and will only stick with the bench So now, we should produce more elite talents as shown in 2003 n 2004, then things will be a lot better. And we dont need to fear about competitions. I m sure if we have players like Moukoko or Netz, they will start early .........in their club or somewhere else. The problem we had was 1997-2001 were not very good age groups. 1997/1997/2001 u could hardly find elite talents; 1999 n 2000 have maybe 2 per age groups, 2002 is better than 2001 but maybe similar case to 2000. 2003 is really the big turning point
you don't have to be Elite to make 1BL. I tend to find majority of 1BL players are average/mediocre anyways. Elite talents will have it faster not that only Elite can make it. And even foreign players a lot of them aren't anything special, the draw tends to come from the whole, they have pro experience from other minnow leagues. What doesn't help Germany is that clubs seem to have a higher standards for our players than foreign ones. At the end of the day it's about who each individual club rates, anyways. That Germany needs to produce more Elite Talents is a given for a country like ours. Germany is supposed to be an Elite country at football and with all the resources and population, you also have to produce Elite players. Outside of those shit years in early 2000s (there were still some Elite players in those times but not enough). We never had issues producing Elite/World class players. Just that DFB sabotaged itself and delayed the program by a bunch of years. eh teams are buying from France because their young players play 1st and 2nd division faster than in Germany. That is the issue with us, when 2BL is not a great place for young players while France have more access to top 2 leagues in their country. Also sooooooooooooooo many 1BL clubs, openly admit, they buy Frenchies because they have pro experience and are cheap cheap players. It's not a matter of Elite talent or not, it's a matter of already ready made players. Besides France are monsters at production of players, I don't think anyone in Europe beats them, they have players all over Europe , all over the top clubs and top leagues. Sometimes, I think the real issue in Germany is all the best talent go to 1BL Academies+ teams like Stuttgart/H96 who are currently in 2BL and avoid 2BL Academies (including Union Berlin and Paderborn who are currently in 1BL but lower profile Academies). Recently it feels like 2BL Academies are getting better but that type of thing doesn't help when 1BL doesn't really promote a huge amount. I also think there would be a ton more young players in 2BL if these clubs had good talents. At the end of the day, I said it before, there is no age group thing in senior NT. Its everyone together, there is no age gap between players unless your talking about between 96 and like 03-04 type, getting closer to 10 years type. Point is, I'm not too worried about senior NT, since all you need is the best players from every age group and that's more than enough to continue make the senior NT competitive. Although you still want as many German players playing 1BL and in other leagues in Europe as possible. Production of players is still important. Real annoyance will be strikers since we need more of those but they take more time. Especially since breakingthrough 1BL isn't enough to make senior NT. You also have to perform and find consistency which adds even more time. So for now, breakingthrough has to be the main focus and the senior NT will continue another 1-2 years min with less options. ugh, that's what happened last season to so many of our youngsters. They were starters or regulars, then injuries and they lost their places in the squad to the bench. I hope he comes back and establishes himself, although he might be forced to wait until Winter, maybe.