Opening the new thread for information gathering while the other wraps up. Timeline is roughly August to August, I will go over it on more detail soon.
Just a little bit about the timeline this season to set the stage initially. In South America these are the major competitions that are part of this season. All Countries: 1969 Copa Libertadores, 1968 Intercontinental Cup, the 1968 Intercontinental Supercup, all international matches between September 1 1968 and August 31 1969. I am pushing back the end date a little bit to get the complete 1970 South American World Cup Qualifying in this season. Unlike Europe the whole qualifying takes place in two months, July and August of 69, so I did not want to split the competition into multiple seasons. Brazil: The 1968 TRGP, and the 1969 State Leagues. Argentina: 1968 Nacional and the 1969 Metropolitano. Uruguay: 1968 Uruguay Primera Chile and Peru: The second half of the 1968 seasons and first half of the 1969 seasons. In Europe: All countries: All continental competitions for 68/69 (EC, CWC, FC), the 1968 Intercontinental Cup, all European domestic competitions played on the 1968/69 schedule, the first half of the 69 season and second half of the 68 season for Hungary and USSR, and all international matches between August 1st 1968 and August 1st 1969.
@msioux75 Do you have any information on who the star players were in Preu's qualifying campaign? I know a few names but not many details. @PuckVanHeel Same question for Belguim, as unlike most other European qualifying groups they have already wrapped up qualification during the 68/69 season. Again I know a few names from looking at the big goalscorers or more famous names like Van Himst and Van Moer but do not have a strong idea.
The SA world cup qualification matches practically started in the 69/70 season. The first match was end July 69.
July 6th is the start. I also like having them in a different season than the World Cup, otherwise they will get totally overlooked.
Perhaps you should clarify this. I see Argentina starting on July 27. Do you want to consider all the 69 qualification matches for the 68/69 season??
With consistent metrics, I post my preliminary list. Top Representatives 68-69 EC1 Finalists AC Milan-Rivera+Prati None of the Milan players were top rated by DBS. The team came close 3rd in the Series. Rivera rates higher than Prati at the BdO but this order is uncertain to me. Prati scored many important goals. Cudicini, Schnellinger, Anquiletti, Malatrasi, Trapatoni and Sormani had a strong season aswell. Ajax-Cruijff Cruijff is my #1 for the podium. None of the Milan players transcended in their league. But perhaps I am biased towards Amsterdam? So I’ll leave it for others to comment. EC1 Semifinalists Manchester United-Best (ex-Law) Law made EC1 topscorer but Best is considered namewise. Spartak Trnava-Kuna Kuna made player of the year 1969. I suppose he would be an 8 and not a 6 for the team of the year? EC1 Quarterfinalists Celtic-Murdoch Murdoch made player of the year. In my research on Tommy Callaghan, Murdoch also gets mentions. Would Murdoch fit as a 6? Benfica-Eusebio Eusebio doesn´t produce in Europe but wins the treble. AEK Athens-Papaioannou Papaioannou, Greek player of the century, had 8 selections for the NT, which is more than any other season. He must have been peaking around this time. SK Rapid Vienna-Bjerregaard Bjerregaard was player of the year 68 and 70. He scored a decisive screamer vs Madrid. He also scored 5 goals in Rapid’s 6 Copa de Oro matches. EC1 2nd Round close call Real Madrid-Amancio Amancio wins Pichichi. Pirri might still edge him here. What does Marca say? EC2 Finalists Slovan Bratislava-Jokl https://www.bigsoccer.com/threads/bi...-season-1967-68.2102838/page-10#post-37680641 FC Barcelona-Gallego Barcelona has a great defensive record. Gallego scored some decisive goals. He didn't feature in the lost final. I´m curious about his Marca ratings and Sadurní's aswell. EC2 Semifinalists Dunfermline Athletic-Tommy Callaghan https://gameofthepeople.com/2017/11...unfermline-athletic-1967-69-heroes-from-fife/ https://www.worldfootball.net/repor...unde-dunfermline-athletic-olympiakos-piraeus/ FC Köln-Overath 1968 World Class [12/68] [#2 Midfielder] 1969 Internat. Cl. [07/69] [#2 Midfielder] EC2 Quarterfinal close calls WBA- Doug Fraser Had a strong season according to Worldsoccer, as mentioned by Ariaga. SFK Lyn-Karl Johan Johannessen There are 3 standout players IMO; - Ola Dybwad-Olsen, striker, set a still unbeaten club record of scoring 25 goals in 18 league games, and helped Lyn win The Double by scoring in his second consecutive cup final (3-0 win against Mjøndalen). He scored unimportant goals for the NT, failed to really produce in EC2. Has a good record of 11 goals in 24 NT games. - Harald Berg, midfielder, produced in EC2, played several games at the NT, all losses. He later turned professional and had a decent career in the Netherlands. - Karl Johan Johannessen, right winger, EC2 topscorer for Lyn, scored 2 away goals vs Barcelona, setting up Lyn for the semifinal (Gallego scored a brace after). He only played 1 NT game, which was Norway´s only win during the season, away vs France. After the season, Karl Johan Johannessen left Lyn and moved back to his home town, practically ending his amateur career. Lyn went into straight decline. EC3 Finalists Newcastle-Moncur Thanks to Moncur, Newcastle beat Újpesti Dózsa, who had an impressive campaign. Moncur was also captain. Robson might be favored here. Újpesti Dózsa-Bene Bene made player of the year, although he didn’t feature at the NT. Copa Libertadores Finalists Nacional-Ignacio Prieto https://historiadeportiva.wordpress.com/category/ignacio-prieto/ http://www.rsssf.com/sacups/copa69.html Estudiantes didn’t do much this season. In 68/69 Nacional won the Uruguayan league. Nacional’s Prieto seems to stand out more than any Estudiantes member. He mentions that he was voted best midfielder. Prieto, a libero who played as central midfielder (volante) for Nacional, scored 6 goals in the Libertadores, of which 3 were decisive. Argentina-Omar Wehbe Wehbe, topscorer for the 68/69 season, won the Nacional in 68 with Vélez Sarsfield. No lock. Brazil-Pelé Straight @ManiacButcher Was Pelé the best? Since I like to include every position atleast once, I'm looking at Terry Cooper. Perhaps he wasn't the "Leeding" player of the League winning team but he did have a good season.
Uruguay - Ecuador is July 6th. As I said earlier I think the whole of South American Qualifying should be part of this season. It is a very important competition is South America and caps off the season as its climax. It is played in the same time frame as a South American Championship would be, not spread out over multiple years like in Europe. At this time in South America one group of players is taken to the qualifying tournament and the whole things is played out in one month, so it does not make sense to split it.
I would say Best is clearly the top player of the big three at this point. Charlton and Law are both slowing down. Law scored seven of his goals vs Irish minnows in the first round as well.
Then as I said earlier, I think it would be good to clarify that the NT matches under consideration aren't running from august till august, as in post-#2, but till september.
Ok, considering the SA qualifications, Alberto Rendo seems like a decent candidate for Argentina. https://www.elgrafico.com.ar/articu...peor-recuerdo-de-la-seleccion-en-la-bombonera Also for left back, Nicolas Fuentes could be considered. In the link above, it is mentioned that stars Chumpitaz and Cubillas weren't playing well vs Argentina. Fuentes was at about his peak. He was also champion with Universitario.
I have always heard that Challe was the star of qualification for Peru, but I definitely want more information.
I have heard the same. @msioux75 might have specifics. IMO Challe was a very technical midfielder but too slow for top flight football.
This is my initial shortlist, or first draft (leaving gaps to signify broad groupings according to my initial idea: podium candidates, top 5 contenders, feasible inclusions, borderline/possibles respectively): George Best Johan Cruyff Pele Gianni Rivera Dragan Dzajic Tostao Georgi Asparuhov Ferenc Bene Franz Beckenbauer Hector Chumpitaz Kazimierz Deyna Jimmy Greaves Jairzinho Wlodzimierz Lubanski Julio Melendez Bobby Moore Gerd Muller Gunter Netzer Luigi Riva Wim van Hanegem Amancio Amaro Gordon Banks Hristo Bonev Jimmy Johnstone Bobby Murdoch Odilon Polleunis Pierino Prati Rob Rensenbrink Josip Skoblar Dino Zoff So maybe I'd just be trimming that down from that 30, with a concise honourable mentions list this time, but it's early stages and for sure I'll want to be seeing what @peterhrt has for Eastern European votes, what @Titanlux says about Spanish ratings/reports, the info of @msioux75 about Peruvian players and all the info @schwuppe gathers for example, and I might pay particular attention to Hungarian ratings if he has those for 1969 (I know, like with any Eastern European vote that'd be calendar year based but still useful definitely).
Feijenoord's Ove Kindvall might be worth to look into more thoroughly. Arguably the greatest forward in the history of Feijenoord maybe 1968-69 was his peak? Scored 30 goals in 33 games that season (the following season 25 goals in 27 games, the previous season 28 goals in 32 games). I am not sure if he was an out-an-out striker or more the withdrawn CF kind of player. Regarding Belgium: "Golden Shoe" poll Dec 1968 01 Polleunis 241 02 Semmeling 113 03 Dockx 50 04 Devrindt 05 Trappeniers https://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belgische_Gouden_Schoen_1968 Dec 1969 01 van Moer 152 02 Dewalque 106 03 Dockx 81 04 Jurion 52 05 Takac 30 https://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belgische_Gouden_Schoen_1969 I have the full list available if someone's interested German footballer of the Year (issued 18 August 1969) 01. Gerd Müller 417 02. Franz Beckenbauer 60 03. Berti Vogts 24 04. Willi Schulz 18 05. Helmut Haller 14 06. Karl-Heinz Schnellinger 6 07. Hermann Nuber 5 08. Horst Wolter 4 09. Klaus Fichtel 3 09. Günter Netzer 3 09. Werner Olk 3 09. Wolfgang Overath 3 09. Uwe Seeler 3 Gerd Müller's 417 votes were the highest ever at that point (poll first held in 1960). That was a share of 73 % of all votes but in relative terms it was not as good as Seeler getting 85% of all votes in 1960. https://www.historical-lineups.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/German-Footballer-of-the-Year-Wiki.pdf https://www.historical-lineups.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/04/Records-1960-to-2017.pdf
Where did you find that? The full top 5 of each year (with points totals) is in this thread: https://www.bigsoccer.com/threads/belgian-golden-shoe-soulier-dor-1954-2010.1853033/
I will take a look into this. There are some years where Van Himst is just taken for granted (Van Moer to a lesser extent, but he also came four times back from a broken leg) but have to see whether this is one of them. Most probably this is for neither of them their very best year. Generally it is believed Van Himst had the peak of his powers in the mid 1960s while some of his best achievements (with the national team, club) were reached when he became more of a midfielder. Have already looked at the crucial qualifier against Spain (there was another one against Yugoslavia). The best players there were seemingly Devrindt (scored both goals), Van Himst and Semmeling. However, Spain while seen as "in technique marginally better perhaps" had only one shot near the Belgian goal, in the 6th minute and was more or less dominated throughout. For that task Polleunis and Van Moer were seen as crucial. Devrindt also scored important goals in the away game against Spain and against Yugoslavia (euro finalist, lost after replay). I need to look further in this. This is Van Himst in the otherwise flopped World Cup (in no small part because of clashes between Polleunis and the staff) against USSR.
”Belgisch Voetbaljaarboek" by Dirk van Hemeledonck which covers a huge amount of statistical information from the 1950s to the 1990s. https://www.sportsmemories.be/Book.aspx?id=7300 This is the book for 1956-57. I have all issues from 1960-61 to 1988-89.
Eastern Europe (ADN, East Germany): Muntyan 23% Zhekov 20% Kuna 19% Dzajic 17% Adamec 13%, Vencel 8%. Bulgarian goalkeeper Simeonov received 1% of the vote in 1968, which seems partly due to his performance against England at Wembley in December 1968. Some other Footballers of the Year: USSR: Muntyan 223, Kavazashvili 170, Shesternev 76 Czechoslovakia: Kuna East Germany: Vogel England: Book and Mackay Scotland: Murdoch France: Revelli Sweden: Svensson Golden Boot: Zhekov
Adding the 1968 vote so we have it in close proximity: I'm not really sure what to make of the complete absence of the Poles! In other votes Lubanski had previously been getting more mentions, and he and Deyna do get a point each (can't both be from Poland!) in the Ballon d'Or voting for 1969. Dzajic, Yugoslav Sportsperson of 1969, is the top eastern European in that too. I'd read a bit about this season and Lubanski/Deyna in the Polish title race before I think. Red Star Belgrade did crash out early in the European Cup (Jimmy Johnstone's name appearing on my list possibly owing to what I read about that tie - Stein telling him at half-time in the home leg that he could miss the away trip if the home leg was won convincingly before Johnstone proceeded to play a great second half and score a great goal, after a long Murdoch pass, as Celtic romped to a 5-1 first leg scoreline!).
I'd say Kindvall was a hybrid between a striker and a forward. Good comparisons would be someone like Heynckes, Riva or Shevchenko. He was never a type to construct from deep. Compare him to Albert or Cruijff as early as 1966 (against each other) and the difference is obvious to see. The Swedish comments I quoted in the other thread mentioned he was fast and a good dribbler. There are some videos of him avalaible. Here is a decent top 100 list from the century anniversary (one other from Voetbal International in 2017 had Kindvall #4): http://www.feyenoordgeschiedenis.net/top-en-flop-100.htm (I say decent because it doesn't only look at 'the name'; Ronald Koeman led as captain Feyenoord to an European semi final so has arguably a case to be placed at #35 and ofc he still scored and assisted well. Maybe someone like Gullit should be about 5 places higher since he actually got BdO votes as a Feyenoord player, was player of the year and such; has also always identified himself as a Feyenoord fan since he was young if that's part of the criteria)
I think I made a mistake when I finally came to post that, so it didn't quite reflect my intentions. I'd certainly had Carlos Alberto Torres in mind again, while for fellow Brazilian Jairzinho I'm not sure all in all. I think I knew I had 30 names and got confused! For now I'm adding Carlos Alberto but in the bottom category, and moving Amancio up (that is certainly pending Spanish info though), so I'll re-post now with those adjustments: George Best Johan Cruyff Pele Gianni Rivera Dragan Dzajic Tostao Amancio Amaro Georgi Asparuhov Ferenc Bene Franz Beckenbauer Hector Chumpitaz Kazimierz Deyna Jimmy Greaves Wlodzimierz Lubanski Julio Melendez Bobby Moore Gerd Muller Gunter Netzer Luigi Riva Wim van Hanegem Gordon Banks Hristo Bonev Carlos Alberto Jimmy Johnstone Bobby Murdoch Odilon Polleunis Pierino Prati Rob Rensenbrink Josip Skoblar Dino Zoff I think I could probably find a place for one of the goalies in the 23 - both those I notice being highly rated in their domestic league, but I'm not sure yet. I noticed Murdoch's goal against the Germans was impressive, and Johnstone is influential in another European tie - vs St Etienne, but I still feel I'm borderline in terms of putting those Scots in the 23 for sure (one or both) at the moment.
I had noticed belatedly though that Portuguese language Wikipedia does appear to credit Jairzinho with best player awards for the 1967 Carioca (despite missing a number of early games if I remember correctly) as well as the 1968 Carioca too: https://pt.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jairzinho (Both those tournaments fitted within the last season of course - 1967/68 European-ish schedule) Chumpitaz seems to have been given a Best Defender in CONMEBOL accolade for 1969 as a whole anyway (I think I did see that referenced on a Portuguese language page too maybe): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Héctor_Chumpitaz I noticed annoyedbyneedoflogin had stated him and Cubillas weren't on top form in the win vs Argentina though - there is a Cubillas video on YouTube for that game and it's true he is a bit loose in his control etc at times so I wouldn't say it was a great individual display indeed (although a great result for Peru), although he was showing a hint of being able to do something dangerous that could unsettle the Argentine defence, especially later in the game I'd say. I only saw it once but I think it'd be fair to say he was playing mainly in the attack (not as target man number 9 though of course - not that that Peru team would play to a target man anyway judging by their World Cup displays!), rather than dropping into midfield a lot or starting in a semi-midfield role (which he did later in his career). I'm guessing he comes into our thoughts more for the next season (partly because it includes the World Cup, but not only for that reason) anyway.
This report does credit Chumpitaz with a 70 yard ball before the goal in the home game for Peru against Argentina - I got confused again above lol and said 'great result for Peru' remembering about that 1-0 but of course the game annoyedbyneedoflogin refers to is the 2-2 in Argentina (still a pretty good/important one for Peru though!), and that is the one I watched the 'Cubillas vs' video for too: https://translate.google.com/transl...iminatoria-copa-jules-rimet-1969/&prev=search