Sporting preseason 2019

Discussion in 'Sporting Kansas City' started by Buzz Killington, Jan 15, 2019.

  1. Inca Roads

    Inca Roads Member+

    Nov 22, 2012
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Really? I thought Kuzain was the really undervalued one. Busio definitely gets the spotlight, but I thought JL was a quiet second there.

    Anyways. I expect that as he matures as a player, he will be better at defense and overlapping runs than Zusi. Zusi is very anomalous in fullbacks, or at least MLS fullbacks, in his propensity to roll into the midfield instead of pushing down the wings. I am hoping Lindsey picks that up off him but I'm expecting him to turn into a more Yedlin-esque RB.

    I'm not terribly worried about his minutes. He got six starts last season plus a sub appearance, in his rookie year. And he handled himself very well. I expect the Wallace experiment at LB won't last too many games, so with Seth the only actual left back on the roster, Lindsey seems first depth for both.
     
  2. Buzz Killington

    Buzz Killington Member+

    Oct 6, 2002
    Lee's Summit
    Club:
    Kansas City Wizards
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Kuzain is the one people don’t really talk about, Lindsey and Busio should both miss time this year on youth national team duty, Kuzain not so much.
     
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  3. mschofield

    mschofield Member+

    May 16, 2000
    Berlin
    Club:
    Union Berlin
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    I wasn't trying to suggest Zusi isn't fantastic right now. I wasn't trying to suggest Lindsey is a better option right now.
    I'm just saying Zusi turns 33 this year and is as good as he is because he plays that position over 110 yards of ground for 90 minutes. If he does this as a 34 year old that will be amazing, but he is amazing. Can he do it again next year as he's turning 35? This, right now, is the age at which Roberto Carlos hit the wall. I use Carlos because he played a long time and he's the best attacking outside back in the Zusi mold that i've seen. Granted, he had a season left in him at Fehnerbace and then another one or two at Corinthians, and those are quite decent clubs. But the level of his game was dropping and that's why he wasn't with RMad past the age Zusi is at right now.
    Also, have we seen this sentimental side of PV in keeping players around? Zusi has been important (for two of my kids, he's an all-time favorite player), and he has a special attachment to the club and PV. But so has Besler, so has Roger, so had Benny etc. We can't keep everyone to be the next KZ, and I think it's clear that role is destined for Besler.
     
  4. Inca Roads

    Inca Roads Member+

    Nov 22, 2012
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    We're neither arguing nor disagreeing, haha. I'm just spouting opinions because I want it to be the weekend already very badly.

    I wasn't really saying keep Zusi for sentimental reasons. If he can sign Brad Evans as defense/midfield depth plus leadership and experience, surely he can keep a guy like Graham for the same. Right?

    I really see Lindsey getting double digit starts even without injuries to our starters this year. Bigger question is if we hold up at LB until Jimmy is back, and how he plays when he returns. One notable injury spell for Zusi or Sinovic and I think Lindsey is breaking 20 games this year. Unless of course he's gone for any of that bullshit U-nat nonsense when we really need him.
     
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  5. mschofield

    mschofield Member+

    May 16, 2000
    Berlin
    Club:
    Union Berlin
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    Good point on Evans. Only quibble: We paid him $200k or $300k. Granted, per game, Zusi is a much better deal and would be until we reached about $6.8m or $10.2m. But do we actually offer Zusi that sort of contract? He might want it. he might also have a shot at one last, bigger, payday elsewhere, someone who would need the PR bump from brining him in.
    I think that Wallace will get more time than you do. Not against Toluca, maybe, but there are a lot of weekends in MLS when he will be an asset back there.
     
  6. Inca Roads

    Inca Roads Member+

    Nov 22, 2012
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Absolutely figuring out if Graham will restructure his contract and stay here is a big question. I have no idea if he would or not. I wouldn't think less of him to want to go somewhere else to maintain his level of pay and minutes, should it come to that. But he's also proven to be very happy to play here under Vermes. He may be very invested in our team beyond the field. No idea. Impossible to guess from here. Something to watch...

    It's not that I don't think Wallace will get minutes at fullback, it's just that I'm fairly afraid we'll very quickly regret every time he gets minutes there.
     
  7. Blando13

    Blando13 Member+

    Dec 4, 2013
    Lee's Summit, MO
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Lindsay getting 10 MLS starts, 10 USL starts and 10 U20 starts would be ideal! Some of the "MLS starts" will be US Open Cup starts ... and he likely wouldn't get 10 starts for the U20's ... probably closer to 6. But 30 starts across all comps would be a good thing ... and then hand him the starting role in 2020 with Zusi as a backup.
     
  8. Inca Roads

    Inca Roads Member+

    Nov 22, 2012
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    For sure. Though MLS starts are the most valuable out of all of those, so the more he can appear in the league relative to the others, the better for his development. Right?
     
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  9. mschofield

    mschofield Member+

    May 16, 2000
    Berlin
    Club:
    Union Berlin
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    Ranking those, in terms of importance: SKC, SPR and then U20s. I said this a lot when EPB was off to play kiddie cup games, and I still believe it: U nats are useless for players who are already playing professionally. The level of competition is lower and slower and they have thenormal nats problem of not really being on a team. I totally agree with
    nonsense indeed.
     
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  10. Blando13

    Blando13 Member+

    Dec 4, 2013
    Lee's Summit, MO
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I agree for the most part, but for the ACTUAL U20 World Cup (or U17 WC or Olympics) I think its a chance that players can increase their value by playing in front of a lot more scouts than USL games for sure and once upon a time ago, MLS. But I think MLS has enough eyes watching now that you're correct. USL likely doesn't. I think Lindsay and Busio need to be viewed as "potential sale assets" and having them play in UXX World Cup's can boost stock IMO. Unless we win MLS Cup this year (and maybe next) there's a good chance those players are more valuable to our Cup win for the money the bring in a sale vs the minutes they put on the field. If EPB would have been sold, that would have been the case for him ... and I think it very well could be the case for those 2 players.
     
  11. Inca Roads

    Inca Roads Member+

    Nov 22, 2012
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    I think you're overthinking this. They don't need eyes on them at this point. They're on the senior roster of one of the best MLS sides. I think they're beyond the point where youth international success stops really benefiting them, because what they really need now is to actually play and succeed at a senior, professional level. Youth international is a great feather in their cap, but if they hardly ever crack the first team in a league that is weaker than the places they want to end up, it does them no benefit.

    All these kids need to show that they belong on an MLS first team before they belong on a La Liga first team or whatever. I think the muted career of EPB abroad tells enough of a story to bigger European teams that just U-20 success doesn't really translate into notable success on a team.
     
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  12. Blando13

    Blando13 Member+

    Dec 4, 2013
    Lee's Summit, MO
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    You may have changed my opinion on this ... you're probably much more correct than I am. I still may not get too worked up about them representing the US but I do hope it never hurts SKC in the process. I also think that those U20 games are more useful than Swope Park games, so if that's what they miss by being at a Youth National World Cup then I'm fine with that. We're deep enough now that their spot in the 18 isn't a given and hope they play SPR or U20 games if not in the 18 (which is what PV basically said is his goal).
     
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  13. Inca Roads

    Inca Roads Member+

    Nov 22, 2012
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    For sure. Getting minutes is the first priority. The more games they can get under their belts this year, the better. Some games will be more beneficial than others, of course.

    Despite being the brightest talent of the four, I think Busio is going to have the toughest time getting minutes overall this year.
     
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  14. Blando13

    Blando13 Member+

    Dec 4, 2013
    Lee's Summit, MO
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I agree ... midfield depth is strong at the moment. Especially if Rowe really takes off.
     
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  15. mschofield

    mschofield Member+

    May 16, 2000
    Berlin
    Club:
    Union Berlin
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    I don't disagree, but I wonder if an organization like SKC doesn't actually produce the game film and attract the scouting that makes the Us less important, and this includes SPR. We heard Vermes talk about the problems of projecting college to MLS. There's the same sort of issue with a Cup competition. To use an overused example, Adu was spectacular in the U tourneys. Professional soccer is simply more difficult, and clubs know this. They may identify someone in a tourney, but they know a ton more about them before they sign. the next step for Busio, Lindsey, Kuzain is dominate with SPR, and get minutes with SKC.
     
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  16. Blando13

    Blando13 Member+

    Dec 4, 2013
    Lee's Summit, MO
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  17. KC96

    KC96 Member

    Mar 2, 2013
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    The Guardian newspaper (UK): 3 of 5 columnists pick SKC to win 2019 MLS Cup

    Your MLS Cup champions will be …


    "Sporting Kansas City. I struggle to see a more balanced roster in MLS this season. Atlanta United will likely be a force again, but it’s difficult to truly know how they will react to the loss of Tata Martino and Miguel Almiron despite de Boer and Pity Martinez coming in. Sporting KC have, on the other hand, kept the same group of players together. If they have one weakness it is in the lack of a true No9."

    "Peter Vermes has built a roster loaded with attacking talent and deep enough to survive a full MLS schedule and Champions League campaign."

    "Sporting Kansas City. Unlucky to lose in conference finals last year, and Peter Vermes won’t let that happen again."

    https://www.theguardian.com/football/2019/feb/27/mls-2019-predictions-soccer-zlatan-ibrahimovic
     
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  18. mschofield

    mschofield Member+

    May 16, 2000
    Berlin
    Club:
    Union Berlin
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    While the general sentiments of all predictions this winter have been positive, the "lack of a true 9" theme is essentially cut and paste into most of them. Yet PV seems really happy with Nemeth, and what we saw in game one v Toluca indicates he may well have a point. I think there's a lot of folks waiting on SKC to stumble because of a lack of a big money 9, and will need a lot more than one match or month to dismiss. But I wonder what's the over/under on when the momentum shifts?
     
  19. Inca Roads

    Inca Roads Member+

    Nov 22, 2012
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    I think smarter money is worrying less about the 9 and focusing more on how this team ages. No one is particularly old yet, but a lot of core players have now crossed 30. How does Vermes replace these guys once they've lost their ability to constantly start in 2, 4, 6 years, whatever it is? Strikers come and go but the very core of the team, one that's been really uncommonly stable for a number of years, is at some indeterminate point going to start quickly shifting. That's what I'm curious about.

    Of course, that likely doesn't factor this year, especially since none of these guys even understand the concept of "slowing down," haha.

    Wondering about the 9 is an easy out, and it is for a lot of teams. You could pretty much pick up any EPL team and muse if they will sort out their striker problems in the next offseason.
     
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  20. mschofield

    mschofield Member+

    May 16, 2000
    Berlin
    Club:
    Union Berlin
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    to give credit where due, that was one of the points raised in the MLS assessment, in a kind of "is this a last hurrah" kind of way, and the answer was pretty good. I think it was Doyle who said that we may be seeing the last year at the top of the game for Zusi and Roger and Besler, but that SKC looks to have a succession plan in place. IMO, they are still at their peak. I would think that they might be able to hold at this level for two more years. I don't include Nemeth because he should 3 year left, and really, who counts on more than three years from any player.
    Still, if our aged 3 vanished, along with Seth, right now, it would take us half a season or so to get their replacements up to speed. It would lead to a season of struggle, I'd think. But if they were to vanish a year from now, it would less of a shock to the SKC system. Two years from now? I think it would be more surprising if they were all still with the club than if one or all of them were gone.
    OTOH, the other north of 30 player on our roster is indispensable. If Melia vanished, we'd be screwed. But the hope is that, as is the case with many keepers, his prime will last to or beyond 35.
     
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  21. Blando13

    Blando13 Member+

    Dec 4, 2013
    Lee's Summit, MO
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    It may be a shock to the system, but plug in Rowe for Roger, Lindsay for Zusi and we have to hope the Hungarian in for Besler and you're not completely inept. The issue comes when these players age quick but are still significant cap hits. If you give me our squad minus those players WITH all of that cap space ... I think you figure out a way to keep in the playoffs ... if you say they age and their cap space isn't available to invest in other players ... yeah, it's a struggle.
     
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  22. Inca Roads

    Inca Roads Member+

    Nov 22, 2012
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    I've said it a bunch, but I think Besler will play for a long time yet. The dude is just low impact, always been based off cleverness and anticipation above physical attributes. That kind of center back can play for a long time. I expect Matt and Tim too to continue playing for years to come.

    Seth looks better than he ever has. I don't know how he does it. I expect Roger or maybe Graham to be the first to start to really wear down, and only if there isn't a good rotation plan in place this year. The only concern I really have is if injuries start to pile up on one or two of these guys. It can happen.

    Melia will be the hardest to replace, though fullbacks are a prime commodity.
     
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  23. kcfooty

    kcfooty Member

    Feb 16, 2011
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    It wasn't that many years ago that injuries and call-ups had us to our 5th or 6th choice for CB on a 3 man back line. I'm thinking of EPB's debut in 2014 in Chicago. I didn't go look it up, so maybe I'm not accurately remembering how far down the bench we went - but it felt really deep.
     

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