Just to add to that Iran has 3-4 players that play in the Russian premier league, and used to the weather
Yeah but European teams still won it though. 2014: Germany won in South America. Netherlands 3rd place. France, and Belgium made quarterfinals. 2010: Spain vs Netherlands final. Germany third place. Yes UEFA teams didn't do as well, but they still won the whole thing though. Also let me tell you 2002 was probably even worse for European teams, although there was a lot of match fixing.
I don't necessarily intend to put my team at the same level as Germany, Argentina, and Brazil. The fact is especially with Brazil and Argentina, I have no idea where they are right now. Brazil got smashed in the world cup, and then did terrible in the past 2 coppa americas. But now they appear to have a better coach and were first team to seal qualification for 2018 world cup after Russia. Other than this year though, Brazil have really been an atrocious team, in fact I wouldn't even rate them if it wasn't for their new coach. However they do have world class players and their new coach seems to be doing great things so they are a top team. Argentina has a similar scenario. They did do much better than Brazil in the past 2 Coppa America's but at the same time, I am not sure how good their opponents really were. In 2015, Uruguay were without Suarez. Paraguay were horrible. Colombia, again I really have no idea where they are at the moment, but they needed penalties to beat Colombia. And then they lost to Chile. In 2016 their path was so easy other than Chile. They did beat Chile in the group stage which is something but that was one game, and speaking of that they couldn't repeat in the final. Panama, Bolivia, and Venezuela are rubbish teams. USA I don't rate high either and they aren't getting any better. And also they are in extreme crisis in World Cup Qualification at the moment. However they did do good in the last world cup, and they just hired Sampaoli who is a good manager, and I expect he might be the best coach Argentina has had in years. This is why I put them at the top. And of course their attack force has best talent in the world with Messi, Di Maria, Dybala, Benaga, Higuain, Aguero, and Icardi. Germany I have an idea where they are but am not 100% sure. Since Klose retired after 2014 World Cup, they seemed to lack a bit in the final third. However I think since the beginning of the year they have found someone to take that position, and also some german strikers that have been overlooked in the past have had a great season this year. I am also a little worried about their full backs as well. Since Lahm is gone, they have had trouble finding suitable replacements. Although Hector, Ginter, and Can do work hard and can probably do well to replace Lahm. They are not as good as they were in 2014, but I think they are improving, and Coach Low has finally found the rythemn. They are showing it in qualification for world cup. Italy I'd say are probably a step below Germany. Although I put them all together without thinking who is first and second. Doesn't necessarily mean they are the same level, but I just listed the first 5 in any random order. But don't forget that they have won 4 world cups and are third most successful national team in the world. 2010 I have no idea what happened but we played horribly. 2014 what happened was that Prandelli was a stupid coach and was tinkering around. Bonucci even admitted that they didn't spend enough time training on the ground, and many players were a bunch of individuals that played for themselves. However since Conte took over the team is so much different. Now Italy are a serious team that plays for each other and really know what it means to represent the country. I have seen massive changes to their game approaches, and even how they behave on the field. And Conte has dropped almost all players that did not respect the team. Italy were one of the most impressive teams in Euro 2016. They made quarterfinals, and I must say they dominated Belgium and Spain so well. We did lose to Germany, but Germany were former world champions, and half our team was injured. And also let me tell you that after Germany, and Switzerland, we, Spain, and Poland have the most points in World Cup Qualification. Ventura has only made it better by investing in youth talent and aiming to really attack as a team and score a number of goals. It has been so long since we have actually dominated teams like this and bagged in a bunch of goals. Let me point out that we have already scored more goals in this qualifying campaign than we managed total in Euro 2016 qualifying group. Italy is a real growing team.
I agree with all of this. It really gets me how you put Spain and Belgium above Italy, when Italy dominated them both in Euro 2016. Colombia I didn't mention because I have no idea where they really are. They did make quarterfinals last world cup, but they had one of the easiest groups, and in Round of 16 Uruguay were without Suarez. They have been average in World Cup Qualification, and did ok in the last Coppa America's. I would say they are maybe 4th best in south america after Brazil, Argentina, and Chile. On par with Uruguay at their best.
Forget about what I said with Asian teams regarding the weather. Did not think this through very well. Asian teams probably won't suffer. However African teams might.
Turkey, Croatia, Iceland, Ukraine- all of them have chance to finish top at the group. Any combination for the first 2 spots is possible. Croatia may not qualify
Any of them can still win that group, but its highly unlikely that Croatia won't finish first or second. They have home matches against Kosovo and Finland coming up. Even if they lose their other 2 matches, just the six points from the 2 home games would give them a total of 19 points. I don't think its even mathematically possible for two other teams to reach 20 points. So if Croatia fails to qualify it'll be through the playoff.
Its possible, but I am quite confident Croatia and Iceland have got top 2. I believe Croatia will win the group with Iceland going to the playoffs, although it could be the other way around. I might be a huge minority saying this, but I am really confident that Turkey and Ukraine won't surpass either Croatia or Iceland. They are really too inconsistent in my eyes. I believe next match they will draw each other, which will not be good for either of them. Iceland should beat Ukraine at home. Turkey away will be tough, but if Iceland haven't already sealed qualification which would be highly unlikely, I think they should take at least a point from Turkey there if not total 3 points. Croatia I am confident will beat one of Ukraine or Turkey away at least if not both. Remember they had a number of players suspended last game. They were without Srna and Rakitic. Also a few usual starting players started out as subs. I have no idea why but I am guessing Cacic either underestimated Iceland or wanted to experiment a little bit.
I just hope Greece memes their way to the World Cup with the last top seed being an Ireland/Iceland. I believe both opponents are in our strengths and they haven't been tested against any very defensive side in their Current Groups. Croatia is a decent team up front with Pjaca, Perisic , Mandzukic , and playmakers like Rakitic and Modric, but their backline seems weak. This is why I can't accept Croatia as the top 5 contender. Momentum can get you up to a limit but won't win you the cup. Same goes for Portugal. Ronaldo on fire, best European player in the world, for many best Player in the world(the messi-ronaldo issue is not the point of my thread so don't bother mentioning it in your quotes), but I find their defensive side pretty week. Key players like Pepe, Quaresma, Fonte, Bruno Alves all over 33, and we still got a year to go. Calling Portugal as a favorite to win a World Cup is too risky, due to the many changes the team has/will endure after the Euro. There are obviously many good addition, who look more skilled , like Bernardo Silva, Andre Silva. Also, weather or Andre Gomes,Gueirreiro and Renato Sanchez are in form is also a question, due to their minimum playtime. With the 2nd probably not evne being called.So my final point is that its too early and too risky to call portugal anything close to a top contender due ot the many changes since the Euro win. Same goes for Croatia, as the team has a group of 7-8 top elite players but no depth at all. I believe the top contenders rosterwise are no more than France, Brazil. Spain,Argentina, Uruguay,Portugal,Croatia Italy, Belgium , Germany,Portugal all fall behind when it comes to Roster. Coaching: Nothing can be said about coaching and tactics and gameplay from any team. They currently meet like 3 days before an upcomming match against another National Team, about 6 times per year? You can't build a team like that. The team starts fitting in the Pre WC tours. They train together everyday, they play many matches together, they learn each other. So generally I am not a fan of talking about dark horses and favorites 1 year before the WC. Noone expected Portugal to even make it to the Semis. Noone expected Wales to do so either. For all we know, even Poland can win the damn thing. They fall shorter in nothing, and probably since they ve been invisible for almost ever as a NT, their thirst is bigger. So, My current Favorites :Brazil,France Teams with huge chances to even win it:Spain(its always Spain),Argentina,Italy, Germany Teams that will have a good run: Colombia,Portugal, Poland, Croatia, Uruguay,Belgium, England (only because their choking has to stop sometime) Every other team, either my beloved Greece(IF we even qualify) or decent teams like Ecuador-Switzerland, is just filler so the 32 slots are filled.I don't expect any team not mentioned to reach the Quarter finals, unless 2 irrelevnat teams end up being drawn together in the R16.
You have great points regarding Croatia and Portugal, however you completely lost me when you put France up there with the top. Brazil is definitely one of the top, but I don't think France is better than Argentina, Italy, Germany, or Spain. Definitely switch France and Germany from your list. I'd say the rank is something like this: (Assuming all key players are fit for every national team) 1. Germany 2. Argentina 3. Brazil 4. Italy 5. Chile 6. Portugal 7. Croatia 8. Spain 9. France 10. Belgium 11. Colombia 12. Uruguay 13. Poland You might ask why Croatia and Portugal before Spain and France: Well this might change later, as I am really not sure. But as of now I have watched all teams play in Euro 2016, and throughout the world cup qualifiers. Spain has a midfield that is aging and if they are pressed by good players, Iniesta and Busquets really tend to struggle to find passes. I feel like the aging midfield can get pressed a little too easily. In attack I don't see many good linkups as a team. Costa seems to be an individual player, and Nolito and Silva don't seem to linkup too impressively. The defense also is not always moving together and is often disorganized and shaky, especially when it comes to the full backs and center backs communicating. France as well does not have a good defense. Griezmann is the only world class player in their attack with Benzema now banned. Giroud is alright but he is not world class. He even is not always a starting player for Arsenal. Payet had a great season last year, but I think that was one impressive season. At the moment he isn't standing out or doing too well. Mbappe might add a lot to the team, but I need to see him for at least another season before I can conclude that Mbappe is a world class player. And the other thing is the whole team is shaky and disorganized. Many times I see the team all over the place, and often not keeping shape. They need a better coach honestly if you ask me. I do see your point on what you mention about Croatia and how they lack depth. However I do think their defense is improving with Vida and Vrsaljko now in the team. Something they also lack though is pace which can be a problem, but many teams lack that. I feel however that this might be the most talented Croatian team out there that we have right now. Even stronger than 1998. Also one thing that Croatia is good at and I see lacking in both Spain and France is their strength as a team, and willingness to play and sacrifice for each other. They basically play a pressing/crossing type of game, with all players very familiar on how the style and tactics work. Portugal has also improved under Santos. Ronaldo is arguably the best player in the world, and is always dangerous when he gets into good positions. However I have noticed that Santos has brought some tactics into the team and organized the team to play somewhat defensively. They have a good midfield and Renato Sanches is really promising. Their defense is also good to. Another thing that I have noticed is especially in the knockouts of Euro 2016, they really defended well as a team, and were moving well together as a unit. I really feel that the team has really learned each others skills and how to read other players and figure out what positions they will be in. The whole team's game IQ especially of each other is excellent. They also have figured out how to spot Ronaldo in good positions and how he makes his runs. I feel that Portugal are one of the most organized and tactically disciplined teams in Europe, maybe just behind Italy. It has been proven time and time again that tactical discipline and sacrificing as a team is much more important that individual talent on paper. Just look at Italy 2016, Portugal 2016, Wales 2016, Iceland 2016, Netherlands 2014, Costa Rica 2014, etc. Also the way Italy dominated Belgium and Spain was really impressive. Not like they were lucky, they were outplaying them so badly. Especially vs Spain it could have been 4-0 if it wasn't for De Gea. Other than Italy's defense and De Rossi, most of their players were mediocre at best and half of those were not even starters for their clubs. Netherlands 2014 was similar although they were very lucky in the knockouts. However how they beat Spain 5-1 tactically was impressive. Also it is proven well in clubs. Just look at Monaco this season, and how Dortmund was able to hold Real Madrid to two draws in the group stage.
My friend No. No And again No. Portugal won becuase of a very defensive wised coach the Euro 2016. Their defence sucks. Everyone knows that offence might win you a few games but defence will win you the tournaments. What did 2006 Italy , 2010 spain, 2014 Germany have? A complete roster (the CF role is debateable). Portugal, Croatia, Chile,Poland have big names like ronaldo, Mandzukic, Rakitic , Modric, Sanchez,Lewandowski but when you check their backlines , from Defensive mids and backwards, you ll most likely be disappointed. Netherlands has been like that from 2010. That's why they do good runs but never win the damn thing. Mediocre defence (and the teams I mentioned don't even have a mediocre defence -things are far worse) can't get you far.
lol if you actually knew anything about Italy is that we are the exact opposite... we play up to good teams and suffer against crappy opposition (especially ones who park the bus). We also have a horrendous record in friendlies over the past decade as well.
Not only at friendlies. At the WC too, 2010 and 2014, the 2 WC's from this last decade, Italy has been total crap.
Yes we have been crap in the past few world cups. But we have also had a few decent showings in the euros and especially with the next World Cup being held in Europe... it would be foolish to say a top European nation would be if no importance to you.
Its true defense wins you tournaments. However I cannot say that Portugal's defense sucks, that is just rubbish. Pepe is one of the best defenders in the world. I'd say their defense is about mediocre. I see where you are coming from though. To be honest really I'd be surprised if someone else wins it other than Germany, Italy, Brazil, or Argentina. I am an Italy supporter, and I am telling you this could be our year. We reach the final every 12 years and it is time. There is also another superstition that favors the Italians. Every single time an italian referee is in charge of a world cup final, Italy win the next world cup. Rizzoli did the 2014 WC Final between Germany vs Argentina. He might have given Italy the 2018 World Cup. We will find out in a year or month. Literally though all bias aside, I am convinced Italy have a complete team now. Best defense by far. Florenzi is a very solid full back, and De Sciglio and Zappacosta are young full backs that look extremely promising. Verratti is arguably the most promising young midfielder in the world. Then we have a few box to box midfielders with experience like De Rossi and Marchisio. Then there are also a few promising young ones like Gagliardini, Benassi, Baselli, Mandragora, and Sensi. Although I doubt all of those will be going to Russia 2018. And we have the best attack we have had since the days of Del Piero, Totti, Toni, and Vieri. Insigne has great skill, and has had 2 consecutive great seasons. Belotti is a young promising striker that could be one of the best in the world in the upcoming years. Bernardeschi is a great attacking midfielder with great dribbling skills, long distance shooting, and assisting. Then Candreva works really hard and he has NT experience. There is also Berardi who is a young promising winger, and I expect him to make a huge jump next season as long as he can stay healthy. And then the backup strikers who also have talent and work really hard for the team: Immobile, Gabbiadini, and Eder.
I've never said that. Don't put words in my mouth that I've never said. And btw, the post you quoted from me, was made to complete what you posted before with the fact that not only at some friendlies, Italy has sucked, but at the WC's in the same time lapse (only last decade) you mentioned in your post, as well. I didn't even mention the Euro. . . About the next WC, to be held in Europe, we are going to be able to talk about, only once it really starts, as of now, all we can talk about are its qualifiers, which as you must know, are held at a local level, where reality refered to it, is restricted to the teams that take part in each of the qualifier groups. For the case of Italy, it is basicly its confrontation with Spain, as the other teams in their group are there basicly to add numbers to it (with no real possibility to go through), where till now, Spain has the lead; a lead acquired when they took a point from Italy in Turin.
Some truly clueless posts all over this thread. Portugal's defense sucks or is 'mediocre', even though it has players like Pepe, Raphael Guerreiro, Nelson Semedo (can't even make Portugal's XI but 50 Million Euro transfer rumours to Barcelona are common) etc. Okay. Then there's the "Croatia being a Top 5" comment. If this comment was ridiculous enough already, they got beat by Iceland a day later. ICELAND. Is that a team a Top 5 team in the world loses to? I'm gunna go with no. Don't care if you're missing Rakitic or whoever else couldn't play. If you can't at least tie Iceland with players like Modric, Kovacic, Perisic, etc. in your lineup then you ain't Top 5.
To be fair, Iceland is quite proven by now. Not saying Croatia is top 5, but Iceland is certainly good enough to beat a top 5 team at home.
And France got beaten by Sweden who at the moment is even weaker than Iceland, at least as we are aware of. Sweden did nothing in Euro 2016 and didn't even score a goal, although Ireland scored an own goal for them. Iceland at least got to the quarterfinals of Euro 2016, and did draw with Portugal, beat England and Austria, and scored in every game. In fact Iceland was the only team in the whole tournament that was able to score in every single game they played. Iceland is within the top 12 teams in Europe if you ask me, possibly top 10. And also you praise Portugal who tied with Iceland and bash Croatia who lost to Iceland, and after all it was in Iceland, and not in Croatia or in European mainland. Anyway if you cannot at least tie with Sweden with players like Pogba, Griezmann, Matuidi, Giroud, Kante, and Varane, then you are definitely not a top 5 team.
That's a ridiculous thing to say. The Top 5 can beat each other, with few teams outside of it being able to compete. Iceland is most certainly not one of those teams.
Assuming your account hasn't been hacked again, who are these 5 unbeatable teems, in your mind? Maybe we should start there. It wouldn't , I assume, include Argentina or France who both lost their most recent away competitive match to teams below Iceland.
"Certainly good enough to beat" is not the same as "can beat". Also, just because you think Sweden is below Iceland, doesn't make it objectively so. Iceland, 9 out of 10 times, (assuming normal conditions) will not beat Germany, Spain, Brazil, Italy, France or Portugal. At home, away or on the moon.
I wouldn't be so sure of that. In fact Iceland tied Portugal in France don't forget and Portugal were the eventual champions of the tournament. Iceland would have a chance at home against any of those teams I'll tell you. Well not so sure about Germany or Brazil, but the rest, I suppose they could have a chance, especially if not all key players from their opponents are fit. In fact they could probably beat a Germany or Brazil B team.
They aren’t? Well, they’re damn close then. I’ll give you some time to let the ginja wear off. Did you see Sweden at the Euros? They were terrible! Iceland were also better in qualifying for that tournament so now we're talking about a timeframe spanning years where Iceland has put up better results than Sweden. At some point it becomes objective. A statistic that comes right from the bottom of that ginjinha bottle that you’re reached the bottom of, apparently.