Building a generation around Maradona is problematic, especially compared to the last generation there is an almost comical lack of depth. I feel like I must be missing some import players for this group but have not found any. The Maradona/Ruggeri generation is from 1959 to 1966 Finisher Ramón Díaz Creator Diego Maradona Claudio Borghi Néstor Gorosito Alberto Márcico Controller Jorge Burruchaga Juan Barbas Sergio Batista Gerardo Martino José Basualdo Leonardo Rodríguez Defender Oscar Ruggeri Nestor Sensini Goalkeeper Sergio Goycochea Diaz is the lone finisher who shone brightly for a very short amount of time. Maradona has some decent players behind him and overall makes a strong creative group. The controllers are the best group of the generation with good depth and solid players. The defenders are not deep but Ruggeri is one of Argentina's best. Goycochea is a good goalkeeper.
Should Valdano be in this generation? I thought he was 29 at WC86, he would have had to be at the least 31 instead to be included here.
The final generation I will do for Argentina is the promising group of players from the late 90s. The Batistuta/Redondo generation is from 1969 to 1976. Finisher Gabriel Batistuta Hernan Crespo Claudio Lopez Martín Palermo Creator Juan Sebastian Veron Ariel Ortega Marcelo Gallardo Kily Gonzalez Mauro Camoranesi Marcelo Delgado Controller Fernando Redondo Javier Zanetti Diego Simeone Matías Almeyda Leo Astrada Sergio Berti Defender Roberto Ayala Juan Pablo Sorín José Chamot Nelson Vivas Goalkeeper Carlos Roa The finishers are strong with two solid players behind the excellent Batistuta and Crespo. The creators are also solid lead by Veron, but he is the only great player of the group in my opinion. The controllers are very good with depth and quality. The defenders are somewhat weak behind the two excellent players in Ayala and Sorin. there is only one decent goalkeeper.
I would add Gabriel Calderon to the controller group and Luis Islas to the goalkeeper group. But it's true it's an incredibly thin generation, which Maradona led to a WC win and another final while playing every minute of both tournaments. #GreatestEver!!!
Ok, then it's my mistake. He was easily the oldest player who featured regularly in the WC86 campaign on what was an otherwise young side.
Ranking Finisher 1) Orsi/Monti 2) Sivori/Perfumo 3) Sivori/Corbatta 4) Moreno/Pontoni 5) Passarella/Kempes 6) Ferreyra/Sastre 7) Di Stefano/Carrizo 8) Batistuta/Redondo 9) Sastre/Moreno 10) Maradona/Ruggeri Creator 1) Moreno/Pontoni 2) Sastre/Moreno 3) Sivori/Perfumo 4) Passarella/Kempes 5) Orsi/Monti 6) Sivori/Corbatta 7) Ferreyra/Sastre 8) Maradona/Ruggeri 9) Di Stefano/Carrizo 10) Batistuta/Redondo Controller 1) Moreno/Pontoni 2) Batistuta/Redondo 3) Di Stefano/Carrizo 4) Orsi/Monti 5) Sastre/Moreno 6) Maradona/Ruggeri 7) Passarella/Kempes 8) Sivori/Perfumo 9) Sivori/Corbatta 10) Ferreyra/Sastre Defender 1) Sivori/Perfumo 2) Passarella/Kempes 3) Sastre/Moreno 4) Sivori/Corbatta 5) Moreno/Pontoni 6) Di Stefano/Carrizo 7) Batistuta/Redondo 8) Maradona/Ruggeri 9) Ferreyra/Sastre 10) Orsi/Monti Goalkeeper 1) Di Stefano/Carrizo 2) Sivori/Corbatta 3) Passarella/Kempes 4) Sastre/Moreno 5) Ferreyra/Sastre 6) Moreno/Pontoni 7) Sivori/Perfumo 8) Maradona/Ruggeri 9) Orsi/Monti 10) Batistuta/Redondo Overall 1) Moreno/Pontoni 2) Sivori/Perfumo 3) Passarella/Kempes 4) Sastre/Moreno 5) Sivori/Corbatta 6) Di Stefano/Carrizo 7) Orsi/Monti 8) Batistuta/Redondo 9) Ferreyra/Sastre 10) Maradona/Ruggeri
Tarasconi is overated in this group. In contrast J.Evaristo and Paternoster are underated, imho. Some sugestions. Creators: Juan Arrillaga Goalkeeper: Octavio Díaz Some sugestions: Goalkeeper: Juan Estrada (18 caps) Defender: Oscar Montañez (15 caps) Controller: Celestino Martinez (14 caps)
Some suggestions: Goalkeeper: Juan Estrada Defender: Oscar Montañez, Ricardo Vaghi, Juan Carlos Sobrero (16 caps) Controllers: Celestino Martinez, Bruno Rodolfi Creators: Vicente Zito, Emilio Baldonedo Some suggestions: Goalkeepers: Miguel Rugilo, Obdulio Diano, Gabriel Ogando Defenders: R.Vaghi, JC.Sobrero, Eduardo "Zurdo" Rodríguez, José García-Pérez Controllers: Bruno Rodolfi, León Strembel Creators: Antonio Báez, Llamil "Turco" Simes Finishers: Manuel Pelegrina, Juan José Ferraro Some suggestions: Defenders: E.Rodríguez, J.García-Pérez, Juan Carlos Giménez, Alfredo Pérez Controller: Ernesto Gutiérrez Creators: A.Báez, LL.Simes, Roberto Coll Finishers: JJ. Ferraro, Santiago Vernazza, Ricardo Infante
Some sugestions: Goalkeeper: Edgardo Madinabeytia Controller: Vladislao Cap Creator: Miguel Angel Montuori, Francisco Loaicono M.Rodriguez, Raffo, Savoy, Sarnari, Solari, Bilardo and Togneri are debatable choices, imho. Some sugestions: Controller: Omar Pastoriza Creator: Francisco Loaicono, Alberto González "Gonzalito" Finisher: Nestor Combin
Pastoriza was a pretty big miss by me. I am on the fence as to whether or not Combin is Argentine or French, I am leaning towards French as he was in Lyon's youth system by the age of 10, so to me he was "produced" by France.
Pernía and Sabella are debatable choices, imho. Some suggestions: Goalkeeper: Jorge D'Alessandro Defender: Enzo Trossero, Roberto Mouzo Creator: Ricardo Villa, Oscar Ortiz, Enzo Ferrero Finisher: Hector Scotta, Carlos Morete Suggestions: Goalkeeper: Luis Islas Defender: Nestor Clausen Creator: Gabriel Calderon Finisher: Abel Balbo, Alberto "Beto" Acosta Berti and Vivas are debatable choices, imho. Some suggestions. Goalkeeper: Roberto Abbondanzieri Defender: Fernando Cáceres Controller: Darío Franco Creator: Diego Latorre, Claudio Lopez Finisher: Barros Schelloto
Balbo was 66 so he is in. Caniggia is 67 so he is out at this point. I could move the generation one year younger to pick him up. Do you think it would improve on the whole by dropping Ramón Díaz and Juan Barbas (both born in 59) to pick up Caniggia?
On to Germany. This first generation is built around the players from the 1930s. They were in the shadows of the Danube School but still had some excellent players and had a good showing at the 1934 World Cup. The Szepan/Janes generation is from 1907-1914 Finisher Edmund Conen Erwin Helmchen Otto Siffling Karl Hohmann Oskar Rohr Josef Rasselnberg Creator Ernst Lehner Adolf Urban Rudolf Gellesch Stanislaus Kobierski Ernst Albrecht Controller Fritz Szepan Andreas Kupfer Ludwig Goldbrunner Albin Kitzinger Rudi Gramlich Defender Paul Janes Reinhold Munzenberg Sigmund Haringer Goalkeeper Hans Jakob Fritz Buchloh There is good depth at finishers led by Cohen, a German great. Helmchen, Siffling and Hohmann all have excellent international records and provide good depth. The creators have a strong group of wingers led by Lehner and Urban, two international level players. The controllers is clearly the strength of the group, and was the strength of Germany's team. Janes and Munzenberg are recognized some of Germany's best defenders but there is a lack of depth behind them. Jakob is a decent goalkeeper. My major dilemma with this group was whether or not to make it two years older, 1905 to 1912 instead of 1907 to 1914. Making it two years older would add Richard Hofmann, Ernst Kuzorra, and Willibald Kreß. Those are two of the signature attackers of this time for Germany. But I would lose some very good younger players in Edmund Conen, Andreas Kupfer, Adolf Urban, and Rudolf Gellesch. I decided the 1907-1914 group was slightly better overall. Any opinions to the contrary?
The next generation is based around the group of players that won the 1954 World Cup and preformed well at the 1958 edition as well. This was a difficult generation to assemble because there were very large age differences between important players from that team. Anton Turek was born in 1919 and Fritz Walter was born in 1920. Then you have far younger players in Helmut Rahn and Herbert Erhardt were born in 1929 and 1930 respectively. The Walter/Schafer generation is from 1920 to 1927. Finisher Max Morlock Ottmar Walter Alfred Kelbassa Creator Fritz Walter Hans Schafer Alfred Pfaff Bernhard Klodt Richard Kress Richard Herrmann Controller Josef Posipal Paul Mebus Defender Erich Juskowiak Werner Kohlmeyer Werner Liebrich Heinz Wewers Fritz Laband Goalkeeper Bert Trautmann Heinz Kwiatkowski The finisher group lacks depth but has two very good players in Morlock and Walter. The creators are the strength of the team lead by Walter, Schafer, and Pfaff, three great players. The controller group is relatively weak as many of the important halfbacks of the time were to young to make the generation (Karl Mai, Herbert Erhardt, Horst Eckel). Juskowiak and Kohlmeyer have excellent reputations and records at defense, but I do not believe either are seen in the same group as Paul Janes and Reinhold Munzenberg from the previous generation. Bert Trautmann is a great goalkeeper who never got to play with the national team. I could move the generation three years younger to 1923-1930 and only lose one important player in Fritz Walter. But he is the signature player of the generation and one of Germany's greatest ever. By moving three years younger I could pick up Helmut Rahn, Herbert Erhardt, Karl Mai, and Fritz Herkenrath. That is a big enough haul to make me seriously consider leaving Walter out might make a better generation overall.
I would say Caniggia is a greater player than Diaz and obviously Barbas. But I feel that Ramon Diaz is a player who at least for the first ten years of his career, is closely linked to Diego Maradona, so it's hard to drop him from the "Maradona" generation.
The next generation is a strong group of German players who played between Germany's two World Cup victories in 1954 and 1974. Despite not winning a World Cup it is Germany's strongest group yet in my opinion. The Seeler/Schnellinger generation is from 1934 to 1941 Finisher Uwe Seeler Heinz Strehl Lothar Emmerich Friedhelm Konietzka Rudolf Brunnenmeier Erwin Stein Jürgen Schütz Creator Helmut Haller Jürgen Noldner Aki Schmidt Heinz Vollmar Controller Horst Szymaniak Albert Brülls Werner Krämer Defender Karl-Heinz Schnellinger Willi Schulz Klaus Urbanczyk Leo Wilden Hans Nowak Friedel Lutz Goalkeeper Hans Tilkowski This group has one all time great outfield player in each role in Seeler, Haller, and Szymaniak, and Schnellinger. The depth behinf Seeler is good but i am uncertain of the quality, as Seeler monopolized the national team center forward position so heavily that the other players in the group got little international exposure. The creators are reletively weak in depth behind Haller, as are the controllers behind Szymaniak. The defenders are great with Schnellinger supported by Willi Schulz and Klaus Urbanczyk. Tilkowski was an excellent keeper.
The next generation is Germnay's signature generation that won Euro 1972 and World Cup 1974 and a number of major international club competitions. The depth is great as the split between East and West Germany created more opportunities for international exposure. The Beckenbauer/Müller generation is from 1942 to 1949 Finisher Gerd Müller Jupp Heynckes Klaus Fischer Hans-Jürgen Kreische Creator Gunter Netzer Wolfgang Overath Jurgen Grabowski Eberhard Vogel Siegfried Held Bernd Holzenbein Heinz Flohe Reinhard Libuda Manfred Burgsmuller Jürgen Sparwasser Johannes Lohr Controller Franz Beckenbauer Herbert Wimmer Bernhard Cullmann Klaus-Dieter Sieloff Defender Berti Vogts Klaus Fichtel Horst Blankenburg Wolfgang Weber Bernd Bransch Hans-Georg Schwarzenbeck Horst-Dieter Höttges Bernard Dietz Bernd Patzke Goalkeeper Sepp Maier Jürgen Croy Norbert Nigbur Bernd Franke Hans-Ulrich Grapenthin Wolfgang Kleff The finisher group is excellent with Muller supported by three very good players. The creators are surely Germany's best group ever with Netzer, Overath, and Grabowski leading a very deep group. The creators have the least total depth of talent and may be the weakest part of the generation despite Beckenbauer's presence. The defenders are very deep with players who had excellent careers. This group rivals some of the great Italian generations of defenders in depth of talent (Although Italy's best defenders of those group clearly outrank Vogts). The goalkeeper group is another all time great group with amazing depth behind an all time great in Maier.
The next three generations all overlap fairly significantly as Germany produced a solid stream of players being born between 1951 and 1967. The first generation will focus on the players most peaking in 1978 WC and Euro 1980. The the group is more of the transition team (82 and 86 WC finalists) between and Euro 80 winners and the 1990s WC and Euro winners. The first generation is the Breitner/Rummenigge generation and is from 1951 to 1958. Finisher Karl-Heinz Rummenigge Joachim Streich Horst Hrubesch Klaus Allofs Dieter Muller Dieter Hoeneß Creator Felix Magath Uli Hoeness Hansi Müller Karl Allgöwer Controller Paul Breitner Uli Stielike Manfred Kaltz Hans-Peter Briegel Rainer Bonhof Wolfgang Dremmler Defender Karl-Heinz Forster Hans-Jurgen Dorner Klaus Augenthaler Matthias Herget Ditmar Jakobs Gerd Kische Korad Weise Wilfried Hannes Goalkeeper Harald Schumacher Uli Stein Rudolf Kargus The finishers are excellent with great depth of talent behind Rummenigge. The creators lack depth and have three solid players in Magath, Hoeness, and Muller but lack an elite player. The controllers are excellent, Germany's best yet. Breitner, Stielike, Kaltz, Briegel, and Bonhof all had great careers. The defenders are very deep again but probably a step behind the 1974 generation. The goalkepeers are excellent in top talent and depth.
He was quite a bit younger than the rest of the team in 1974, he was born in 1951. To move the generation two years younger to get him I would have to sacrifice Held, Overath, Höttges, and Vogel among others.