2009 MLS SuperDraft Thread

i liked the way kyle hall played last year with the canadian u-23's. him and tossaint ricketts were looking quite good. in fact, hall scored a goal against guatemala in a 5-0 win. overall he seems athletic but is a little soft. reminds me a little of hemming.

 

Unless he does very well in training camp he is probably just a plan B option at this point if O'Brien White fails to sign a deal given the rumoured European interest. I suspect he will wind up being a casualty of the scrapping of reserve teams.

 

How many of these superdraft players commonly remain, and play, as regulars in MLS? I keep reading here, and elsewhere, that given their advanced age (22, 23 etc) they tend to make the fast track to europe if they are any good. Has anybody compiled a statistical survey of this? My ill-informed about all things MLS opinion, is that this superdraft is not helping MLS to shed its reputation. I recall in BS last year, all the talk about this Obrien White being the next one for TFC, and now, just like others before him, he is either too hurt to make a difference, or too good to stay in MLS. What is the point of it all?

 

An interesting exercise in that regard is to go to the roster page on the TFC website and select "all players" then list them in descending years of MLS experience:-

http://toronto.fc.mlsnet.com/players/roster.jsp?club=mls&sort=exp&order=dsc

After 3 seasons not many are left so the Superdraft is mainly a way to get inexpensive depth to fill out the roster and meet the salary cap in most cases. Having three first rounders should have boosted the chances of getting worthwhile players considerably as third and fourth rounders usually don't make it in the long run.

 

It should be pointed out that O'Brian White signed a deal with MLS last night. He isn't going anywhere for a bit.

On the RPB forums it was mentioned that Mo has said he's keeping Cronin because TFC will be losing Robbo and Amado to international commitments this Summer. Apparently Mo has also said he felt that Cronin was the best player available in the Draft.

Frei is an interesting pick. A lot of pre-draft speculation had somebody moving into the Top-3 to get him. He's considered good enought to start at the MLS level from Day 1. There is also the fact that there is a lot of interest in him from European team and it is expect that within a few years he'll be sold on for Maurice Edu type money.


Drafting White #4 may seem a bit of a stretch, but he wasn't going to be available at #13. Both RSL and DCU wanted him. Frei falling into our laps at #13 was a shock seeing as Chivas apparently had a raging hard-on for him. Essentially Mo took the best player available at each pick, which is always a good strategy.

I love the Grella pick too. If he doesn't work out in Denmark he'll be a great pick-up for TFC. A lot of people thought he could go #1 overall if he wasn't so determined to go to Europe.

 

Always good to see the url for something like that given some of the rumours that float around the boards. Anyone seen the official confirmation on that? This National Post story seemed to leave the European thing open:-

http://www.nationalpost.com/sports/story.html?id=1181829

White, 23, is a native of Jamaica but spent his high school years in Scarborough and has Canadian residency. The University of Connecticut forward had been on the team's radar even before he won the 2007 Hermann Trophy as the NCAA most valuable player. However, there had been speculation that White would opt to play in Europe.

"He's delighted that we've selected him," TFC head coach John Carver said. "I think it's great for the city and for Canada that a local guy who's a good player wants to come home to play."

"Wants to come home" is different from saying "is coming home."

 

http://www.goal.com/en-us/news/1110...009/01/14/1061037/obrian-white-signs-mls-deal

 

Thanks. That made it less of a gamble to take him #4. Now my plan B argument revolves around his recovery where the ACL is concerned.

Here's another story with lots of quotes from him:-

http://www.thestar.com/Sports/article/571657

 

I have no idea. Comments like the previous one, where a superdraft player will try his luck in Denmark first irks me. Is EVERY European league better than MLS, in terms of salaries, quality of play, entertainment for the fans, etc? I know MLS is beneath the top euro leagues, but if it cannot even compete with places like Denmark, Hungary, Bolivia, Romania, etc, etc....than why bother holding these drafts, and just make it a free market for any club, to sign any player, for any cost....isn't that what these competing leagues do? And, doesn't that shortchange MLS? I suppose it is futile, and in order to enjoy tfc, and MLS, you just have to get used to its bewildering acceptance of mediocrity.......besides, who can blame these guys when they read that clubs like Man City are offering 150 million dollars to Kaka to leave Milan, just for the transfer fee!...what will his salary be, 20mill per season with endorsements and the like???

 

I know the question is probably rhetorical but I would hazard a guess that MLS is better than the Montenegrin league:-

http://www.groundhopping.de/petrovac.htm







As for Denmark I suspect there is a mistaken belief among many young North American players that they are more likely to be noticed there by top European teams because they don't realize that "Europe" can mean a wide range of different things and that the smaller leagues are largely ignored elsewhere.

 

Good draft! Look at it this way- TFC have been lining themselves up to have a shot at O'Brien White since his freshman year at UConn- eventually trading for the #2 pick in his draft year to have a reasonable shot at him. He has some injury troubles so falls in the ranking and the club and the city are able to take him with #4. If he heals well we have what projects to be one of the best homegrown strikers to play in MLS in years, playing in front of family and the best fanbase in the league, being fed by El Lobo and another homeboy, DeRo.

In addition, we get a highly touted d-mid with class, essentially to replace Edu. Cronin is not the same sort of mid-fielder as Lobo or DeRo, so it is not correct to say we were stacked in his position. He probably passes Harmse on the depth chart from the get-go, putting him behind only Robinson.

Frei was the top-rated GK in the draft and really sizzled in the combines. Management must have been shocked to see him still available when pick13 came up and decided to go with the best player available.

We will be looking for a big name striker internationally. Via MLS trade, we have some pieces to put together in a package for a central defender- that looks to be our biggest need.

 

Frei is GA ( http://web.mlsnet.com/news/mls_news.jsp?ymd=20090107&content_id=210926&vkey=pr_mls&fext=.jsp) and will not take a Senior International slot - and I looked it up and was wrong, there is no distinction anymore - my bad... ( http://web.mlsnet.com/about/league.jsp?section=regulations&content=overview).

Having Frei and trading Edwards would free up an additional SI slot. Cronin was a senior and therefore would take an SI slot (which is why we should trade him IMHO - while an American SI isn't as bad as a kiwi, it is still a bit crazy to use one of our SI slots on someone who hasn't played a game in the league and will not start if our first choicers are available).

 

Oh I would rather be a Kiwi than a Yank (repeat)

 

According to certain sources Mo is putting the finishing touches on signing a Veteran South American striker and a commanding Centre Back for TFC. The striker negotiations are much further along and it has been suggested that the only thing left to finalize the deal is for both sides to sign their names. (the source claimed 90% finalized).

No names for either player have been mentioned though.

 

Denmark is a decent league and because of proximity a lot of scouts for German teams spend a lot of time there.

The biggest team in Denmark (FC Kobenhavn --read Copenhagen) is actually one of the richest in Europe. The last thorough study about football finances in Europe I read had FCK generating well over $100M annually and was ranked as something like the 30th richest club in all of Europe.

 

That's what the Voyageurs board types tend to say when they are hyping up Canadian players who play there. It's worth bearing in mind that Marco Reda played regularly at a high level in Denmark for Aalborg at one point but was a complete disaster when playing in MLS. The key drawbacks would be that playing standards are probably about League One level in England and the top clubs often get knocked out of European competition very early, which is the key opportunity for a player to show what they can do at a higher level of competition. There appears to be a stigma about lower divisions in big countries when moves by Canadian players are discussed but I suspect a lot more Premiership managers are aware of who Simeon Jackson is than Olivier Occean.

 

Is that why most of us V's keep saying that Hutchinson should get out of FCK and go to a club in a stronger league? Or that some of us (not myself however) have argued with a poster named Ceres who keeps overhyping the Danish Superliga. Most V's understand that Denmark is only slightly stronger than MLS, with a much more pronounced gap in wages than level of play.

It's also worth bearing in mind that Reda had some injury woes after Aalborg and ended up in the Norwegian 2nd Division before coming to TFC. He was not Danish Superliga calibre when he arrived here.

Probably because he plays in England and Occean doesn't? I'm sure Martin O'Neill knows him after that FA Cup goal he scored...

 

Have you watched a lot of Danish soccer? How do you know that it is slightly better than MLS and that Reda was a better player a few seasons ago? What killed him more than anything else was a lack of pace. I'm skeptical that injury woes caused that. I suspect USL-D1 has always been his level in North American terms. He was always hyped up on the V-board even when not getting selected regularly to the national team but maybe the coaches involved actually knew what they were doing? Given he is of Italian heritage wouldn't he have been in serie B or something like that if he were any good?

You kind of confirmed my main underlying point on the last bit. There seems to be an attitude that any and all European top divisions are a step up from MLS because it's "playing in Europe". I posted the pictures from Montenegro's top league to remind people that "playing in Europe" can mean a lot of very different things. If a player dreams of playing in the Premiership one day I don't think playing in Tromso rather than Toronto makes a big difference.

 

I've caught about a dozen matches involving Superliga squads in the past few years, mostly FCK matches. I did catch 2 UEFA Cup matches with Nordsjaelland this year (with Issey and Bernier). Anyways, from what i've seen i think it's a marginally better league.

Reda sat on the bench in his last season in Denmark (after his injuries) before moving to Sogndal in Norway. After his debacle with TFC he moved back to Norways' 2nd Div. before going to Charlston, so it's safe to assume he wasn't Superliga calibre before or after his time at TFC. I have no idea what precipitated his drop in form, perhaps it was injuries, lack of confidence or maybe something else entirely. As for playing in Serie B, well i doubt he was ever good enough to play at that level even when he was in his prime.

How exactly did i confirm an attitude of top division Euro play being a step up from MLS? Simeon Jackson plays in England and the FA Cup game against Villa was on national TV, i think that gives him alot more exposure to bigger English clubs than Occean at Lillestrom. Now, if you were to ask Dutch Eredivisie managers who they'd heard of i'm sure most would have never heard of Jackson whereas atleast a few of them know of Occean (there was interest in him in Holland a couple of years ago).

 

So by the sounds of things you have watched a few Champions League and UEFA cup games involving Danish clubs. I don't think there is any way you can gauge the overall quality of a league by watching only the top teams playing cup games against the likes of Manchester United. You would have to watch a few AC Horsens vs Esbjerg type fixtures to get a proper feel for that. Never done that personally but I strongly suspect it's not too dissimilar from watching Falkirk vs Hamilton Accies, which I have done, given Scotland is similarly-sized and that's not as high a standard as MLS, in my opinion. Where Occean is concerned I suspect playing for the CMNT will do more to get him noticed outside Norway than playing for Lillestrom and I very much doubt his dream in life is to play in the eredivisie one day.

 

"by the sounds of things" = I am assuming. I watched a handful Superliga matches on P2P 2-3 years ago shortly after Hutch mover there. I have seen the likes of Silkborg and Midjtsaelland (or however you spell it) and they're nothing to write home about. The thing about Denmark though compared to MLS is there are a few less truly crappy teams. There's always a couple of punching bags that i'd compare to the non-playoff teams in MLS, but that's 2 or 3 teams compared to 4-6 in MLS. The mid-table teams in Denmark are as good as most MLS playoff teams. Nordsjaelland finished 5th or 7th in Denmark and qualified for UEFA through the fair play initiative so they are not a top team, and yet i see a skill level atleast as good as most MLS playoff teams. Also, no team in MLS in the past 3 years has been as good as FCK. Like i said, there isn't a big difference but i think there's a little more quality and less mediocrity in Denmark compared to MLS.

If we'd been comparing Norway (seen a few of those matches too thank you) and MLS, i'd say any differences are minute and not worth investigating.

Perhaps, but the man has barely ever put on the Canadian MNT uniform (and has only a few times in the past 3-4 years) so i doubt that's how Roda found out about him.

Say what you will about Holland, but it beats where he's at now.

 

Not only do N.American players go to the lesser flights of European soccer because they can get hired and earn a higher salary but also because many of the countries are culturally advanced. Denmark would be my second choice as a place to live if I ever had to leave Canada. The majority speak English very well and it is a compact country. Your team can play away and and you can be in your own home for bed.

The major capitals of the western world are only a few hours away and many flights are cheap. Quality of life and a broadening of history and life are factors which add allure to playing in Europe.

I would think that very few scouts come to see M.L.S. from Europe. You go where the prospects are best.

 

Absolutely it does. When I don't actually know something for sure I try to use wording that indicates the fact. Think you should maybe do the same sometimes. If you had written something along the lines of "I come from Odense, played second division in Denmark and OSL in the GTA and think you are talking crap" I might feel a need to be deferential but I don't see how you can expect to be taken seriously with this "slightly stronger" versus "minute difference" stuff based on watching a few internet feeds on P2P sites. The big difference between a European league and MLS is that there are no salary caps, you suck allocations for missing the playoffs, and drafts in which the worst team picks first. There isn't a huge gulf in playing standards between first and last in MLS. There can be an enormous one in Europe. That means it is more sensible to think in terms of whether the club is a step up than the league. FC Kobenhaven and Rosenborg Trondheim probably are given they usually compete in European competition as well as the domestic stuff. I am far from convinced that playing for Esbjerg and Fredrikstad would be.

http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=documentary&emb=0#q=Ross Kemp Poland&emb=0