[Greyhnd00]

During our fall rules meeting for NFHS a publication was handed out in which AL Klenietis(butchered the name) was quoted as saying that "the hand signals make sense in the HS game"
Hard to believe that he would advocate something so different then what we are doing in youth USSF.......or is this on the way?

[deep-throat]

Originally posted by Greyhnd00
During our fall rules meeting for NFHS a publication was handed out in which AL Klenietis(butchered the name) was quoted as saying that "the hand signals make sense in the HS game"
Hard to believe that he would advocate something so different then what we are doing in youth USSF.......or is this on the way?

No, it is not. His point is that in HS soccer around the country you have a huge variance in skill and knowledge level of players, coaches, spectators. The excessive hand-signals that are used may be helpful in those situations. However, under USSF there (generally) is more understanding of the game and therefore they are not needed and should not be used.

[Claymore]

Have fun, guys.

[jc508]

What I object to is REQUIRING those signals (which must have been thought of by some anti-soccer person) for ALL fouls. I would prefer that the referee had the discretion to give a signal or not to do so. When I gave HS signals years ago when they were required, most of the players still asked what that signal meant.

In USSF, there is nothing that forbids signals. When there is a call that may be off the ball or may have been difficult to see by the other players and spectators, it is good to answer polite questions and quizzical looks with a subdued or modest signal. What USSF does not want is undue attention brought to the referee because of his/her overly demonstrative signals (i.e. HS signals).

I was privileged to have worked a game with Mr. Kleinaitis, and he often used subtle signals to tell the players what he called, and this communication, I believe, helped his overall control of the match. If it helps, why shouldn't we use them too.

[deep-throat]

Originally posted by jc508
In USSF, there is nothing that forbids signals. When there is a call that may be off the ball or may have been difficult to see by the other players and spectators, it is good to answer polite questions and quizzical looks with a subdued or modest signal. What USSF does not want is undue attention brought to the referee because of his/her overly demonstrative signals (i.e. HS signals).

That is correct - a nice summary of USSF stance on this issue.

[whipple]

In practice, I do not see the re-introduced signals as having that much impact on the NF game or how we officiate it. They were never a big deal back in the days when they were previously required, no one paid that much attention or even noticed when the rules we revised, and they were dropped, and it should not be that big a deal now that they are back.

Yes, they can make us look a little silly, and frankly we probalby don't need any help in that area, but when one condsiders that in NF coaches do have status and had always had the right to ask us what a call was, and when a player is cautioned or sent-off we are required to provide a reason to both coaches, these signals could actually come in handy.

Here is the linke to a PDF file of the new signals:

http://www.nfhs.org/PDF/Soccer/soccersignals.pdf

When you look at these, you will probably realize that even though the selection is quite extensive, and there are certain signals we will probably never need, there are others whcih are missing.

[Jeff L]

Without knowing what they are, I agree with some earlier made comment, about being "made up" by someone who doesn't know anything about football (soccer).
The game is simple to play, and simple laws. (rules).
It's probably got a lot to do with the fact that in most other American sports hand signals are used often, and someone is trying to "Americanise" soccer.
Remember the days of the 35 yard "shoot out" in the old NASL.?!!
I recall the late great England captain Bobby Moore who played in the NASL stating, "We want the soccerisation of America, not the Americanisation of soccer".
(Even to the point of requesting 4 quarters and not 2 halves in the World Cup 2002).
Whether it is because it is the world game which America did not have a hand in inventing, and are now trying to put their 10 cents worth in, I know not.
There's not a great deal wrong with the game, and there are enough changes brought about and requested by FIFA without adding to, or trying to make more complicated.
If it's to let coaches know what is happening then perhaps they should try to understand the game more.
As I referee regularly in the USA I am surprised as to how many coaches I have met who haven't even played the game.
The best signal to give and let people see is "play on" with the outstretched arms.

[Jeff L]

A quick history lesson here, although no prizes awarded.
Does anyone know the reason why and where the use of the raised arm came into being to distinguish between the direct and indirect free kick?
I will post the answer this coming Wednesday if no one comes up with it beforehand.

[Alberto]

Jeff, I am posting this here in the event you do not know how to retrieve private mail. This marks the 3 or 4th redundant thread that I have had to merge. I had previously asked you via PM to exercise care when opening threads that were a duplication of a previous thread. If you do not check this thread on a daily basis, I would suggest you review the previous X number of days posts since you last visited, since all posts older than 24 hours are not displayed in the forum. However, just because they are not displayed does not mean they have disappeared into the ether. It means you must take the time to review and read the threads to avoid unecessary duplication and additional work for the moderators of this board. Your anticipated cooperation is greatly appreciated.

Al

[Greyhnd00]

Originally posted by deep-throat


No, it is not. His point is that in HS soccer around the country you have a huge variance in skill and knowledge level of players, coaches, spectators. The excessive hand-signals that are used may be helpful in those situations. However, under USSF there (generally) is more understanding of the game and therefore they are not needed and should not be used.

Not buying this justification........Some USSF players are just as clueless as NFHS are...As a matter of fact many times it is the same players with different uniforms. Communication woth the players can be accomplished without these hand signals, communication with the fans is not and should not be a goal of a soccer official.