Well, they used to pay about $0.90/gal. Now? Right around 65 cents. Or, about 65 cents a gallon. We're such idiots. The only way we'd actually, in the post 9/11 world, remain in such a foolish energy position is if we were dumb enough to put the energy lobby in direct control of the government or something...
Being jealous of people that live in a quasi-despotic monarchy because they pay less for gas does not fill up your tank.
That's true. Less than relevant, but true nonetheless. Not true in the sense of any jealousy; I rarely use a car, and when I do someone else pays for the gas. But true in that the state of someone being jealous of people who have cheaper gas is not the process by which one's gas tank is filled up. Again, not wholly relevant here, but undeniably true, imv. Now, back to examining the dual realities laid bare by the initial post: one, that there's no good reason to even be in this position, and two, that far from being advantaged by ceding government over to the energy lobby, citizens have been clearly harmed. Unless some here think that Saudi gas prices are a loss leader of some sort, but I don't think so. Bottom line: citizens in a democracy ought to ask some tough questions of their leadership when their leadership spring from this economic sector, offer no real solutions or alternatives to thecurrent energy typification/consumption model, and THEN cannot even do that well. Pathetic.
One, there is a very good reason why we are in this position. We are addicted to an energy source because it has been historically cheap and relativly easy to come by. As those circumstances have changed, people must change their habits and the most effective way is through the medium of price. As the price goes up, we are more likely to employ cheaper and more regional methods of energy. Two, the people have chose to cede their control to these people. Don't pretend they haven't. IMO, what the Saudi king is doing is puting blinders on his own people as to how the rest of the world works with this move.
I'd say the way you have to live in order to get $0.65/gallon gasoline is totally relevant. I've never been to Saudi but I know several people who have, both pre- and post-9/11/01, and they say that it is far from free. One guy I used to work with had a disposable camera confiscated at the airport.
Well, they have to do something. I don't think the old Soviet trick of keeping unrest down by making low priced vodka will work there.
We could all move to Venezuela where the price is about $0.12 per gallon. http://money.cnn.com/pf/features/lists/global_gasprices/
It's amazing how badly you want to change the topic from oil dependency to "where would you rather live". It's disingenuous.
$.12/gallon and/or $.60/gallon oil prices have nothing to do with dependency either. The measure of dependency is shown in the market rate for which either of these nations is adhering to. Gonna call both Mel and NSA out for being disingenuous too?
Not that you need it, but you hereby have my permission to turn this thread into a celebration of the Venezuelan female form. Indeed, you have my OK to turn any of my threads into such celebratory activity.
No, no no...the issue is that if the Saudis can offer gas to their own people at a rate such as 65 cents a gallon, that means that that rate retains a margin, correct? So, my challenge, again, in mentioning that, is twofold; one, these guys, the ENERGY lobby, cannot produce a better deal for us then the one we're currently getting, when we can LOOK and see that 65 cents a gallon still produces a profit at the source. So they suck at being the energy lobby for most citizens. Two, they suck in terms of the future, because they cannot articulate an alternative to the current model, which ,as submitted above, observedly sucks. Not to mention the digging in the ass i coudl offer up from a sustainability perspective, and the econmics surrounding that...but there's nothing disingenuous about my submission at all. Again, "..We're such idiots. The only way we'd actually, in the post 9/11 world, remain in such a foolish energy position is if we were dumb enough to put the energy lobby in direct control of the government or something..."
Matt-hatter, The link in my post contributed far more substance than all of your accusatory crap. Are you taking up the KK banner and simply insulting everyone with whom you disagree? I haven't seen anyone indicate jealousy of a foreign country. Certainly not me. You're the one who posted about jealousy. Look in your mirror.
If I am accusing anyone of anything it is dictatorships of price fixing while you all just eat it up.
No I think that's exactly correct. I guess my argument is, in electing the energy lobby to take over government, we ought o have known that either alternative energy source commitment, or energy lifestyle change advocacy, was off the table with this group. But what's also off the table with this group is any advocacy in the current model, probably because their biggest constitutents are all making loot hand over fist in the current environment. Bottom line, have no expectations of this group, not even in terms of offering some expertise in their area of ocupation, providing any democratic results. maybe a gas rebate around election time, but that's about it. They'll find some person for whom the gas rebate came "just in time" to save him and his homestead from total collapse, and that'll be our democratic outcome for this cycle... They. Don't. Represent. Most. People.
The rate does not contain such a margin. The Kingdom is suplementing the price to far far more of a degree than our nation does.
Therefore what? That is, what is supposed to be your argument if, right now, no government represents mosto f its people mosto f the time while keeping track of the most vulnerable? If I were to answer you " Noone," what, then, would your argument be, exactly?
To be fair, though . . . I live in Southern California and can get super cheap produce almost year round. Orange Juice practically comes out of the tap. Have you ever tried to buy real orange juice in Northern Europe? It's impossible. . .
The part that Mel admires is that the Saudi government owns the oil, the refineries and the gas stations. They can set the price wherever they want, internally anyway. This is the kind of governmental power that the socialists dream of. And if they owned the car companies, too, they'd be able to make a buttload of shabby autos like the USSR used to do and you'd only have to wait 10 or 15 years to get your rattletrap.