[Grizzlierbear]

Law 5 states a referee
allows play to continue when the team against which an offence has been committed will benefit from such an advantage and penalises the original offence if the anticipated advantage does not ensue at that time.
My query can you allow advantage for offside or an illegal substitution?
Cases in point
(1) a keeper is about to get the ball and punt it but an offside will place the ball on the ground stopping the flow of play.
(2) a substitute enters the FOP and tries to chase down an attacker free in on the goal.

In either case, in the interest of keeping the game flowing and knowing the keeper would prefer to punt it or there might be a good chance to score can you apply advantage? Can or should you show the signal for advantage in either case?
If not why not?

[MPJ334]

i have very limited experience, so here's what i'd say/what i think. i will more than likely be wrong, but hey, i can try and be corrected, can't i?

a)doesn't advantage only apply to violations of Law XII? i'm thinkign this is the same as the PI thread that's going.
b)i really don't understand ur (2) scenario, so i can't really answer. sorry

[whipple]

Originally posted by Grizzlierbear
Law 5 states a referee
allows play to continue when the team against which an offence has been committed will benefit from such an advantage and penalises the original offence if the anticipated advantage does not ensue at that time.
My query can you allow advantage for offside or an illegal substitution?
Cases in point
(1) a keeper is about to get the ball and punt it but an offside will place the ball on the ground stopping the flow of play.
(2) a substitute enters the FOP and tries to chase down an attacker free in on the goal.

In either case, in the interest of keeping the game flowing and knowing the keeper would prefer to punt it or there might be a good chance to score can you apply advantage? Can or should you show the signal for advantage in either case?
If not why not?

Gtiz,

No - we are referees, not gods (minor dieties, maybe, but not gods).

Advantage is applied only to deliberate breaches of Law 12 and cannot be applied to an infaction such as offside or an outright violation such as a subtitute entering the FOP. This is because we would then be violating the laws ourself. We would be saying the Laws don't count, we are law, what we say goes. This would not only be a huge responsiblity, but we could quickly find ourselve in deep trouble.

Sherman

[Alberto]

Originally posted by whipple


Gtiz,

No - we are referees, not gods (minor dieties, maybe, but not gods).

Advantage is applied only to deliberate breaches of Law 12 and cannot be applied to an infaction such as offside or an outright violation such as a subtitute entering the FOP. This is because we would then be violating the laws ourself. We would be saying the Laws don't count, we are law, what we say goes. This would not only be a huge responsiblity, but we could quickly find ourselve in deep trouble.

Sherman

There are instances when the ball is played forward and the attacking player makes a run from on offside position that the flag is kept down or the referee waives the flag off because the goalkeeper has the ball and the forward had no chance to make a play given his distance from the ball. This is the only instance I can think of when I would allow play to continue and not signal or whistle for offside. As such I would call it playing advantage though technically it is not in the strict meaning as applied to fouls under law 12.

[IASocFan]

On the offside question, if the keeper is able to field the ball cleanly, then the offside player isn't really still in the play. If for some reason he affects the play I would whistle for offside. If the keeper plays the ball routinely upfield or to a teammate, then there is no reason to make a call.

[IASocFan]

On a sub entering the field of play and chasing down an attacker, I would probably get as close to the play as quickly as possible, and let the play progress until the attacking team loses possession. The sub has already earned a yellow, if he fouls in an OGSO, then a red.

Unfortunately, unless I'm mistaken, the restart is a drop ball.

[kevbrunton]

Griz,

As pointed out by others, when you allow the keeper to punt the ball after he has picked it up even though your AR may have flagged a player for offside, you're not applying advantage, you've simply decided that the player in the offside position didn't become involved and judged that the offside offense didn't occur.

As for your second situation, as we discussed in another thread about a substitute coming onto the field of play and affecting the play, you don't have the option of applying advantage there. If there's outside influence, you have to stop play and deal with it.

However, if the substitute coming onto the field didn't get into the play and didn't affect the attacking player going to goal, I'd just choose to have a little selective vision and not see the substitute come onto the field until the play was finished. Then I'd card him/her.

If they affect they play, then as we decided in your other thread -- two cautions, entering without permission and unsporting behavior for affecting the play.

[Alberto]

Originally posted by kevbrunton
Griz,

As for your second situation, as we discussed in another thread about a substitute coming onto the field of play and affecting the play, you don't have the option of applying advantage there. If there's outside influence, you have to stop play and deal with it.

However, if the substitute coming onto the field didn't get into the play and didn't affect the attacking player going to goal, I'd just choose to have a little selective vision and not see the substitute come onto the field until the play was finished. Then I'd card him/her.

If they affect they play, then as we decided in your other thread -- two cautions, entering without permission and unsporting behavior for affecting the play.

Agreed. That is fair to the attacking team.

[Statesman]

Advantage can be applied to ANY breach in the laws of the game, not just law 12.

As it says in Law 5: The referee "allows play to continue when the team against which an offense has been committed will benefit from such an advantage and penalizes the original offense if the anticipated advantage does not ensue at that time."

Note that it says any offense, not any foul or misconduct,

Any referee that immediately stops play when a subsititute enters to deliberately interfere with an obvious goal scoring opportunity without allowing the attacker a chance to score that goal should give himself a red card for DOGSO. You better believe advantage applies, it's for this exact reason the rule exists.

Think about another version of this situation. The attacker is on a clean break for the goal with an obvious scoring opportunity. So what does the defense do? Just have a sub step a few feet onto the field and getting the referee's attention. According to what you guys are saying, the referee MUST stop play and administer the yellow card, and restart the game with a dropped ball at wherever the attacker was. If this was the correct application of the laws, then any time an attacker is about to score a goal you would see the opponent send in a bench player illegally to stop the goal from happening.

Law 18, anyone?

[whipple]

Statesman,

From ATR m5.6:

"The advantage applies only to infringements of Law 12 (fouls and/or misconduct) and not to infringements of other Laws. For example, there can be no advantage during an offside situation, nor may advantage be applied in the case of an illegal throw-in that goes to an opponent. "

It is important to underestand that "Advantage" or "APO" is not the greneral concept of advantage (note the small "a") but rather a signal given during play, which recognizes that a foul or misconduct has been committed by a player, seen by the referee, but the referee is not going to stop play because such as stoppage might be more disandvantageous to the offended player, or advantageous to the offendee, but based upon the outcome, the referee is still reserving the optio of whislting the retart.

So, while many of the decisions you suggest might be common sense, or covered under V8, they are not covered under Advantage Play On. APO has a specific application, but let's not foget that it is not the only manner in which we manage a game.