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09 Nov 2009, 01:28 PM
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#1
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BigSoccer Member
Join Date: Jul 2009
Supporter: --other--
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AR issues.
U16B Division 3. I am CR.
AR1 is a Grade 8 who is very involved with the local league (Soccer Club board member, wife also a ref and board member). His children also ref and play for the league.
He has a reputation for having personality conflicts with coaches and players and often starts games he centers by telling the players something like:
# 22 I know the way you play. If you so much as sneeze wrong I am sending you off with a red.
So the game is going very smoothly. Both teams have skill and are playing a fairly even match but the visiting side goes up 2-1 in the first half.
Play continues and this AR suddenly starts absolutely screaming at the visiting coach (who is incredibly mild-mannered and has not caused any issues to this point). Problem was that one of the visiting players had moved a tote-bag too close to the touch line (about 1 foot away from the line) and this set off the AR. I come running over and the AR is already walking away but I hear the tail end of his diatribe "I don't like your attitude and just for that we are changing it".
I don't fully understand what he means but the visitors have a throw in and they throw in and play continues.
2nd half now.
Game is going smoothly, and I have mostly forgotten about the AR/Coach altercation as it has not seemed to have affected anything.
Now the fun begins. The home team is playing an offside trap, but generally the visiting team is well disciplined and seems to beat it. The entire first half, with many challenges into the home-team's half, not a single offside is flagged by AR2.
I am positioned very much to the center of the pitch following play (both teams are wicked fast) and rely completely on the ARs for offside calls.
The next 5 times the visiting team starts an attack AR1 flags up for offside. Each successive offside call is closer and closer to the half-way line. I suspect after about the third that the AR has made it his mission to punish the visiting coach and this is his revenge. I start to position myself much more closely to the back line in order to see the play myself but this causes me to almost miss some challenges close to the penalty area, so I again move back closer to play. On the next through ball, I see the ball is played to a player that is on-side when he receives the ball, but the AR flags up and screams loudly, he was off and came back on side. I did not see the player in question's position prior to the kick so I honor the flag.
At this point I am seriously questioning the AR's integrity and am again positioned well back from where I normally am so as to call offside myself if necessary. The next time the flag goes up, I notice that the player has not been involved in active play, only moved toward the ball and it seems he was only slightly, if at all offside. I yell at AR, "he has to touch the ball to be sanctioned". AR yells back, "no he only has to move to the ball". I wait until the player touches the ball and whistle the stoppage. Ball is just outside the penalty area for the restart. AR is screaming it should be just over the half-way line. I wave him down and restart.
The AR notices my new positioning closer to the back line and subsequent attacks all go unflagged. But, the damage was already done. Most of the visiting players are fuming and I am working with the captains and the coach to settle them down - fortunately nothing comes from it except hard feelings.
I am pretty sure that most of those calls would not have been made by a more impartial AR.
After the game, AR1 storms off the field and refuses to participate in the customary hand-shake with players/coaches. Point: In this league this is almost unheard of and considered incredibly rude behaviour.
My question is what to do about such an AR?
Remember he is an experienced ref who sits on the board and his wife also sits on the board. Any disciplinary hearings would be slanted in his favor if not completely futile. I will likely have to work with him again.
I have thought about the various options open to me during the game and none seem too satisfying. I did think about switching the ARs in the middle of the half but once he stopped flagging I let it go.
I did chat with him after the game and told him he needed to brush up on Law 11. He tried to argue with me but I was able to cite the ATR and he said he would read up on it. From what I could gather, he had never heard of the ATR  .
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09 Nov 2009, 01:49 PM
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#2
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BigSoccer Member
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: USA
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Re: AR issues.
I would have relieved this AR of his duties during the match.
I suggest you speak with your SYRA and SRA and ask them how they would like you to proceed. Before that conversation, review the following:
See USSF Policy 531-10, which can be found in the Referee Administrative Handbook. It covers grievances against a referee for unethical conduct, misuse or abuse of authority or conflicts of interest.
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09 Nov 2009, 01:56 PM
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#3
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BigSoccer Member+
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Manassas, VA
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Re: AR issues.
I can't offer any advice, but I'm going to throw out another situation for comment. Saturday my son's team (U14 travel, fairly high level) was victimized by a poor referee. Turns out the guy is not only the club president, but also the referee assignor! Other parents were asking me (sort of an authority on reffing) who we could complain to, and of course I have no idea given that he is the assignor. I wondered if maybe he was being especially hard on the home team to avoid the appearance of partiality, but I think he basically was just being a dick. Any suggestions would be welcome.
Ah, I see there was an intervening post - I'll check out those documents.
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09 Nov 2009, 01:56 PM
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#4
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BigSoccer Moderator
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: IOWA
Supporter: Des Moines Menace, Kansas City Wizards
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Re: AR issues.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SR_Ref
...
My question is what to do about such an AR?
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If the assignor is someone you know fairly well, I'd start there. It sounds like he did NOT listen to you. The assignor at least needs to know there are issues with him.
If he ever worked with me again, he'd be AR2. Let him deal with parents. You need someone experienced on that side, too!
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09 Nov 2009, 02:11 PM
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#5
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BigSoccer Member
Join Date: Jul 2009
Supporter: --other--
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Re: AR issues.
Elizondo:
I appreciate your response. I will follow up with the SRA.
The problem I have is that all the calls were borderline and I was not in any position to be able to tell for sure that the calls were wrong.
It was just that my experience and player reactions (BOTH teams) was telling me that the calls felt wrong. I simply don't know if I have enough to proceed with a formal complaint.
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09 Nov 2009, 02:17 PM
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#6
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BigSoccer Member
Join Date: Jul 2009
Supporter: --other--
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Re: AR issues.
IASocFan:
Omitted this from the first post. AR1 and assignor are friends. Assignor was in attendance. His son plays for the home team. Assignor is a Director of Referees and board member as well as an active ref. During halftime, AR1 did not join me for a full debriefing, instead spent the halftime chatting with the assignor about another game he had centered earlier in the day.
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09 Nov 2009, 02:35 PM
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#7
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BigSoccer Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Southern NH
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Re: AR issues.
Elizondo told you how to proceed, however I'd like to point out a couple of things:
- the play you argued on, first off arguing between officials: very bad. Second, he may have been right on the restart. You WERE right on waiting,however the restart should go back to where the offside player was when the ball was originally played, not where he was when he touched it. I bring this up for two reasons: 1) So you know. 2) If you proceed with any kind of hearing do not use this to show his lack of knowlege.
- You say the plays where close, very close. Not trying to be trouble here, but maybe the AR in the first half was getting them wrong? If they are that close a more/less experienced AR may get the calls different. If the plays where so close that you couldn't tell, then you really have no firm position on any complaint in this regard.
- What did your pre-game include about dealing with the coaches? The bag issue sounds terrible, it happens, just move the bag. If it happens repeatedly then its an issue.
My main point is that your concern seems to be rooted in claims that he may have been showing favoritism on close calls. May have, but you aren't sure.
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09 Nov 2009, 03:11 PM
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#8
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BigSoccer Member
Join Date: Jul 2009
Supporter: --other--
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Re: AR issues.
NHRef:
You are quite correct. Thanks for the point on the restart.
As I pointed out in a previous post, I am not able to claim with certainty that there was misconduct. Just that it walked, talked and smelled like it.
The two plays I observed were close - One, the player judged to have gone over and back was a good 3 yards on-side and standing still when he received the ball. Ball was played as a hard shot from about 10 yards away. Hard to believe he ran 3 yds and came to a complete stop while the ball traveled 10 yards. The second, the player was close but I was at a slight angle to the play. I think if I was square with the defenders, it would not have been close and the player would have been on-side. Again, I was simply not sure.
The other plays, I was completely out of position to make the call. When the defensive players are snickering and the visiting team are all claiming they were a good foot or two onside (but they always say that, right) and so it seemed but again, I am not certain. It is hard to believe his calls were correct. Especially 5 successive attacks. This is what caused me to move further back in the first place. Also, once I moved back, all the challenges were again deemed on-side.
AR2 is also an experienced ref whom I have worked with in the past and know to be very good.
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09 Nov 2009, 03:34 PM
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#9
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BigSoccer Member
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Re: AR issues.
It seems to me that "I don't like your attitude and just for that we are changing it" is a threat to the coach. If a member of my crew threatens a player or bench personnel, they are, in no uncertain terms, being dismissed immediately from my field, and the coach is getting a verbal apology and a promise that the whole situation will be reported. Then I write a supplemental match report and submit it to my SRA. That's how I have handled this situation in the past.
My only other question is that, considering that this whole situations happened in the first half, why didn't you discuss this with the AR during half time? If you did, what did he have to say about it? Halftime is not just a time for the players to take a break and get a drink. It is also a time for the referee crew to review the first half and iron out any issues that have come up. This seems like it needed a little ironing out. JMO
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09 Nov 2009, 03:37 PM
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#10
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BigSoccer Member
Join Date: Jul 2009
Supporter: --other--
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Re: AR issues.
Refmedic:
See my prior post on where AR1 was during halftime - busy chatting it up with the assignor.
I allowed this AR's position/standing with the league unduly influence my handling of the situation. I should have insisted he join me at the half and we should have gone over the altercation - no doubt. This will certainly be filed under "learning experience" and will alter my approach to working with him and similar senior ARs in the future.
This was a new experience for me. I have had coaches trying to intimidate ARs and have plenty of experience handling those situations.
This was a first - never before have I had an AR try to intimidate a coach or unduly influence the game.
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