[ohk4]

Originally Posted by Bruiser

European cups ofc.

Use your head, do you really think any team in the English Championship could make their way to the group stages of the CL or the Uefa cup? I sincerely doubt that, no matter what your comparisons say.

2nd Bundesliga side Aachen made it through the group stage of last year's UEFA cup and barely lost to Alkmaar after that.
http://fussballdaten.de/vereine/alem...n/2005/spiele/

[Bruiser]

Originally Posted by ohk4

2nd Bundesliga side Aachen made it through the group stage of last year's UEFA cup and barely lost to Alkmaar after that.
http://fussballdaten.de/vereine/alem...n/2005/spiele/

I'd call that an exeption from the rule.

[voros]

Originally Posted by Bruiser

European cups ofc.

Use your head, do you really think any team in the English Championship could make their way to the group stages of the CL or the Uefa cup?

A team from Bundesliga 2 did last year. A team that didn't even win promotion. They not only made the group stage but advanced into the knockout round and then lost by a goal to the second place dutch team.

Besides the fact that I didn't use my head, I used a computer and that's what I came up with. There appears to be overlap in almost all pro/rel leagues between the bottom of one league and the top of the next league on down. So the bottom of the Prem is not likely much better than the top of CCC.

Here's the ranks of English teams as of May 22, 2005 (based on three years worth of data with more recent results counting more):

  1. Chelsea - Premiership
  2. Arsenal - Premiership
  3. Man Utd - Premiership
  4. Liverpool - Premiership
  5. Newcastle - Premiership
  6. Man City - Premiership
  7. Middlesbrough - Premiership
  8. Everton - Premiership
  9. Bolton - Premiership
 10. Aston Villa - Premiership
 11. Fulham - Premiership
 12. Birmingham - Premiership
 13. Wigan - Coca Cola Championship
 14. Blackburn - Premiership
 15. Tottenham - Premiership
 16. Portsmouth - Premiership
 17. Southampton - Premiership
 18. Charlton - Premiership
 19. Sunderland - Coca Cola Championship
 20. Leicester - Coca Cola Championship
 21. Crystal Palace - Premiership
 22. West Ham - Coca Cola Championship
 23. Wolves - Coca Cola Championship
 24. West Bromwich - Premiership
 25. Norwich - Premiership
 26. Sheff Utd - Coca Cola Championship
 27. Ipswich - Coca Cola Championship
 28. Leeds - Coca Cola Championship
 29. Reading - Coca Cola Championship
 30. Cardiff - Coca Cola Championship
 31. Millwall - Coca Cola Championship
 32. Preston - Coca Cola Championship
 33. QPR - Coca Cola Championship
 34. Luton Town - League One
 35. Bristol City - League One
 36. Coventry - Coca Cola Championship
 37. Plymouth - Coca Cola Championship
 38. Notts Forest - Coca Cola Championship
 39. Derby - Coca Cola Championship
 40. Stoke - Coca Cola Championship
 41. Crewe - Coca Cola Championship
 42. Watford - Coca Cola Championship
 43. Burnley - Coca Cola Championship
 44. Hull City - League One
 45. Tranmere - League One
 46. Doncaster - League One
 47. Hartlepool - League One
 48. Colchester Utd - League One
 49. Gillingham - Coca Cola Championship
 50. Sheffield Wed - League One
 51. Brighton - Coca Cola Championship
 52. Yeovil Town - League Two
 53. Bournemouth - League One
 54. Scunthorpe Utd - League Two
 55. Rotherham - Coca Cola Championship
 56. Swindon Town - League One
 57. Oldham Athletic - League One
 58. Walsall - League One
 59. Lincoln City - League Two
 60. Huddersfield - League One
 61. Barnsley - League One
 62. Blackpool - League One
 63. Milton Keynes - League One
 64. Brentford - League One
 65. Bradford - League One
 66. Wrexham - League One
 67. Swansea City - League Two
 68. Port Vale - League One
 69. Southend United - League Two
 70. Peterborough - League One
 71. Northampton - League Two
 72. Hereford United - Conference
 73. Torquay United - League One
 74. Oxford United - League Two
 75. Rochdale - League Two
 76. Darlington - League Two
 77. Bury - League Two
 78. Mansfield Town - League Two
 79. Boston - League Two
 80. Macclesfield - League Two
 81. Wycombe - League Two
 82. Grimsby Town - League Two
 83. Chesterfield - League One
 84. Cheltenham - League Two
 85. Bristol Rovers - League Two
 86. Notts Co - League Two
 87. Exeter City - Conference
 88. Barnet - Conference
 89. Carlisle United - Conference
 90. Stockport - League One
 91. Rushden - League Two
 92. Leyton Orient - League Two
 93. Chester City - League Two
 94. Shrewsbury - League Two
 95. Morecambe - Conference
 96. Cambridge Utd - League Two
 97. Aldershot Town - Conference
 98. Stevenage - Conference
 99. Scarborough - Conference
100. Accrington - Conference
101. Dag & Red - Conference
102. Kidderminster - League Two
103. Woking - Conference
104. Halifax Town - Conference
105. Crawley Town - Conference
106. Gravesend - Conference
107. York City - Conference
108. Tamworth - Conference
109. Burton Albion - Conference
110. Canvey Island - Conference
111. Northwich - Conference
112. Forest Green - Conference
113. Farnborough - Conference
114. Leigh R.M.I. - Conference

Then in the Europe wide one (counting 1st divisions) it was:

 94. Rosenborg
155. Valerenga
159. Lillestrom
166. West Bromwich
169. Norwich
175. Viking
187. Molde
190. Odd
194. Ham-Kam
206. Lyn
210. Tromso
212. Bodo/Glimt
215. Brann
219. Stabaek
229. Fredrikstad
241. Sogndal

So from that I conclude that the median of the Norwegian league (bewteen Ham-Kam and Lyn) was the same as about Nottingham Forest and Derby, where the best League One teams are above and the worst CCC teams are below.

Now all of that may be wrong, but they are based solely on results and nothing else.

[Ceres]

I have been working much lately and not had the time to post highlights, but but better late than never ...

Superliga, October 1;

FC Nordsjælland - Silkeborg IF 2-2 (2-0)
1-0 Tommy Olsen (8.)
2-0 Mads Junker (40.)
2-1 Peter Degn (pen.) (68.)
2-2 Bajram Fetai (79.)
Attendance: 3,047

http://www.netsuperligaen.dk/kampref.php?ID=1972

It looked to be a "walk in the park" for a well playing home team, but due to a penalty and a brilliant free kick goal by the 20-yo former Glasgow Rangers talent Bajram Fetai, Silkeborg showed how strong they are at set pieces and got away with a draw. Mads Junker scored his 9th goal for FCN this season and is now shared Superliga topscorer along with AGF's Morten "Duncan"

Highlights :
http://www.dr.dk/extention/playWindo...eder&trace=off
or
http://www.dr.dk/player/Player.asp?s...name=&video=&#
----

Superliga, October 2;

AaB Ålborg - FC Midtjylland 2-2 (1-0)
----

Highlights from FCM's 1-3 defeat in the EC against the UEFA cup holders CSKA Moscow (FCM in Black shirts as usual). FCM attacked like crazy to get the 2-0 win needed and also had plenty of opportunities to win this match, but perhaps as expected lost in the end by some poor defending/good CSKA counterattacking..

http://www.dr.dk/extention/playWindo...eder&trace=off
or
http://www.dr.dk/player/Player.asp?s...name=&video=&#
---

Brøndby IF - AC Horsens 4-1 (3-1)

Highlights :
http://www.dr.dk/extention/playWindo...eder&trace=off
or
http://www.dr.dk/player/Player.asp?s...name=&video=&#
---
Highlights from the FC Zürich vs Brøndby match in the UEFA cup :

http://www.dr.dk/extention/playWindo...eder&trace=off
or
http://www.dr.dk/player/Player.asp?s...name=&video=&#
---

FC København - OB Odense 1-1 (1-0)
1-0 Álvaro Santos (45.)
1-1 Chris Sørensen (pen.) (67.)

Highlights :
http://www.dr.dk/extention/playWindo...eder&trace=off
or
http://www.dr.dk/player/Player.asp?s...name=&video=&#
----

AGF Aarhus - Esbjerg fB 2-2 (0-1)

Highlights :
http://www.dr.dk/extention/playWindo...eder&trace=off
or
http://www.dr.dk/player/Player.asp?s...name=&video=&#
----

Viborg FF - SønderjyskE 1-1 (0-0)

Highlights :
http://www.dr.dk/extention/playWindo...eder&trace=off
or
http://www.dr.dk/player/Player.asp?s...name=&video=&#
----



fixtures :
http://www.netsuperligaen.dk/resultater.php#13

Danish Superliga 2005/06 (12 of 33 rounds):
   Club             G   W D L   Gf-Ga   P
1  FC København     12  9 3 0   23- 7  30
2  Brøndby          12  8 2 2   25-13  26
3  Viborg           12  7 3 2   26-13  24 
4  OB Odense        12  5 4 3   18-14  19 
5  FC Nordsjælland  12  4 5 3   20-14  17
6  FC Midtjylland   12  4 4 4   19-21  16
7  AaB Ålborg       12  3 5 4   16-17  14 
8  AC Horsens       12  2 5 5    7-18  11
9  AGF Aarhus       12  2 4 6   17-24  10
10 Silkeborg        12  2 4 6   11-21  10     
-----------------------------------------
11 Esbjerg          12  2 3 7   14-23   9
12 SønderjyskE      12  2 2 8   15-26   8

Goalscorers top 13 (12 of 33 games):

1. Morten "Duncan" Rasmussen,AGF.. 9
-. Mads Junker,FCN....................... 9
3. Morten Skoubo,Brøndby.............. 7
-. Mwape Miti,OB.......................... 7
-. Steffen Højer,Viborg....................7
6. Jose Roberto Mota,Viborg............ 6
7. Álvaro Santos,FCK..................... 5
-. David Nielsen,FCM...................... 5
-. Johan Elmander,Brøndby.............. 5
-. Marcus Allbäck,FCK.................... 5
-. Simon Bræmer,AaB..................... 5
-. Thomas Frandsen,Viborg............. 5
-. Tommy Olsen,FCN..................... 5

Originally Posted by mellowjohnny

How good is the Danish league? I've never seen any of their games, so is it comparable to a place like Belgium? Just trying to get a handle on the quality/type of play Heath goes up against. Thanks in advance

I've added some highlights from the Danish Europa cup games, to give you an impression of the level ...

@voros

I think that ranking the leagues by looking at EC results is hopeless, both because some countries/teams have more luck/better seeding in the draw, but also because the EC ranking especially favors leagues with a few very good teams that participate every season. The Scottish league is a good example of a very poor league with two good teams having gained almost all the points and kept the Scottish league fairly high in the ranking. You also have to consider the different styles of play and the fact that it is cup games and therefore seem to be an advantage to play very defencive in the EC. You often see good offensive minded teams getting eliminated, while much less talented but very solid defencive minded teams manage to scrape by.. This fact also seem to favor more defencive minded leagues/teams in the ranking in compare with the very offensive minded.

.

[sidefootsitter]

Both FCN goals seemed to have come from their left flank. Was that our boy Pierce with an assist on the 2nd (Junker) goal?

[Ceres]

Originally Posted by sidefootsitter

Both FCN goals seemed to have come from their left flank. Was that our boy Pierce with an assist on the 2nd (Junker) goal?

No, both assists were made by the 23-yo winger Anders Due. He also made 3 assists in the 5-0 win against AC Horsens not long ago...

.

[NSG-1]

Originally Posted by voros

So by that, Pearce is playing generally on a level somewhere above the A-league, but maybe a touch below MLS level.

I'm surprised that this has not been addressed already.... I am an American that fully backs MLS. However, I am quite familiar with the Danish Superliga too. The quality of soccer played there is far more impressive tactically than MLS. The ball moves quicker and the rhythm of the match is more impressive too. Midfield play overall is quite impressive, in fact. It is FAR higher than A-League and there is an argument to be made that it is in fact better than MLS.

You don't have as much individual efforts in Denmark as in MLS. You do however see the first league sides with a much better understanding of how to effectively attack as a team and defend as a team for 90 minutes. So in comparison, if you want to compare athleticism and individual technical ability [admittedly an important part of the game], then perhaps MLS is on par, but in terms of true soccer, the Danish league is far better. IF teams from both leagues met it would likely be evenly matched for odds of winning - just because a club is better tactically doesn't mean it always wins [e.g. Spanish National Team in WC 2002... or any world cup for that matter] and if a team is better technically or physically it doesn't always win [e.g. Argentina in WC 2002]. Where does this get us? Nowhere for the purposes of this comparison other than to determine that comparing rankings is foolish, especially when you render the answer to be that Denmark's top division is equivalent to the USL first division.

Ultimately, a player that is coming out of the Danish Superliga as a star is likely able to make an impact at a rather high level of club play if they choose to leave Denmark and pursue other options. No need to compare to MLS. Heath Pearce has begun a very strong professional career and as US fans it is exciting to see how he develops. He is certainly performing at a high level right now already.

[Ceres]

Originally Posted by NSG-1

I'm surprised that this has not been addressed already.... I am an American that fully backs MLS. However, I am quite familiar with the Danish Superliga too. The quality of soccer played there is far more impressive tactically than MLS. The ball moves quicker and the rhythm of the match is more impressive too. Midfield play overall is quite impressive, in fact. It is FAR higher than A-League and there is an argument to be made that it is in fact better than MLS.

Ultimately, a player that is coming out of the Danish Superliga as a star is likely able to make an impact at a rather high level of club play if they choose to leave Denmark and pursue other options. No need to compare to MLS. Heath Pearce has begun a very strong professional career and as US fans it is exciting to see how he develops. He is certainly performing at a high level right now already.

I agree...and I belive I have addressed this before... Your quite right that the big difference between the MLS and the Superliga is the tactical level and pace.. The tactical level in the Superliga is also higher in compare with the German Bundesliga (as it was very easy to see in the very close UEFA cup matches between FC Kopenhagen and Hamburger SV) while the Bundesliga due to the higher wages ofcause got some bigger Stars with better individual skills.

So its difficult to compare the level directly, since different leagues got different styles of play and may be stronger in some areas while weaker in other areas... However, I think the reason you see more individual efforts in the MLS, is because you got more time to handle the ball due to the lower pace and because you tactically are allowed more space by the opponents ...

If I'm forced to compare, then I would say that the best Danish Superliga teams are at Bundesliga level, while the rest are of 2nd Bundesliga level and ther is no doubt that if your a young talent like Heath Pearce, you learn much more in the Danish league than if you join a German Bundesliga club, as I also think it's very easy to see if you look at the level of the Danish U21 NT :

http://www.uefa.com/Competitions/Und...ngs/index.html

Denmark is a very small country with a population of only 5.5 million, still very often (on regular basis) Denmark qualify for the big tournaments and also beat teams like France, England and Germany on regular basis... The reason for this I think is obvious. Youth development. Danish NT players are generally very complete. Perhaps not showing the same terrific dribbling skills as you see from Portugal or Turkey, but over all with very good passing technique, showing some excellent quick attacking minded short passing and showing their excellent tactical skills... Or in other words, the better youth development and more complete players you got, the more often you also qualify for the big tournaments...

.