Israel Unleashes Barrage in Gaza City

Discussion in 'Politics & Current Events' started by verybdog, Sep 28, 2005.

  1. yasik19

    yasik19 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Chelsea
    Ukraine
    Oct 21, 2004
    Daly City
    I think one thing is certain - Iran invented verybdog.
     
  2. Shurik

    Shurik New Member

    Nov 2, 1999
    Baltimore, MD
    Yes, they certainly do have a very peculiar biological structure. But seeing as their bodies aren't only continuously being fired over the Israeli border from rocket launchers but also have an unfortunate tendency to explode and kill, wouldn't it make sense for Jews to at least substitute their own gefilte-stuffed flesh for something compatible?
     
  3. Anthony

    Anthony Member+

    Chelsea
    United States
    Aug 20, 1999
    Chicago
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    According to the 1949 Cease Fire Agreement with Jordan, Jews were to be given free access to the Holy Places on the other side of the cease fire line. The Jordanians reneged on the agreement and Jews were not permitted to visit the West Wall or the other Jewish Holy Places.

    Pope John Paul II visited the West Wall, was that "provocative" too?

    The Intifada has nothing to do with Sharon's visit but everything to do with Arafat's lack of vision and his lack of courage.
     
  4. #10 Jersey

    #10 Jersey Member

    May 2, 1999
    You have given out too much Reputation in the last 24 hours, try again later.
     
  5. verybdog

    verybdog New Member

    Jun 29, 2001
    Houyhnhnms
    That they were not mad at Pope John Paul was just that - He doesn't involve in the conflict.

    Arafat probably had nothing to do with the suicide bombings since 2000. Hamas is not under his control.

    And why did you mention Jordan?
     
  6. verybdog

    verybdog New Member

    Jun 29, 2001
    Houyhnhnms
    Shrink or stop expanding the settlements in WB probably is a good start.
     
  7. yasik19

    yasik19 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Chelsea
    Ukraine
    Oct 21, 2004
    Daly City
    How do you walk around without hurting yourself?
     
  8. Anthony

    Anthony Member+

    Chelsea
    United States
    Aug 20, 1999
    Chicago
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Well, the Arab extremists seem mad at everyone.

    I think I just spit soda all over my computer screen.

    Currently, nothing is under Arafat's control as he is dead. And you are right that Hamas was Arafat's rival. Which is why I believe that Arafat kept the crisis going and refused to make peace, so that Hamas and IJ would expend their energies attacking Israel instead of attacking him.

    In any event, a sizeable portion of the suicide attacks are done under the banner of the al-Asqa Martyrs Brigade, which is a part of Fatah. The Pope continuus claims he no power over the Christian suicide bomers --- OK maybe he has no control over the the Methodists, but you cannot tell me he cannot do anything about the Jesuit bombers.

    To note that under the cease fire arrangment, Jews were to be allowed access to the their Holy Places. How a Jew going to a Jewish Holy Place (a place where the Romans recorded Jews visiting after the destruction of Jerusalem in 135) is seen as a provocation is beyond me.
     
  9. verybdog

    verybdog New Member

    Jun 29, 2001
    Houyhnhnms
    There are several facts to consider:

    - Arafat condemned the tour as a "dangerous action" against Muslim holy sites
    - Temple Mount known to Muslims as Haram al Sharif, or the Noble Sanctuary, contains Al Aksa Mosque and the Dome of the Rock, sacred shrines of Islam
    - Ordinary Israelis can visit the Temple Mount like any other tourists; but Sharon, who has a provocative reputation among Palestinians, is no ordinary Israeli
    - Sharon used his visit to criticize what he called concessions on Jerusalem by Prime Minister Ehud Barak, the tour seemed no less an attempt to upstage Benjamin Netanyahu, the former prime minister who could challenge Mr. Sharon in coming primaries for the leadership of the Likud Party
    - Sharon's tour was meant to assert Israeli sovereignty over the Temple Mount
    - Sharon entered as a police helicopter clattered overheard and a thousand armed policemen were positioned in and around the Temple Mount
    - Temple Mount was captured along with the rest of East Jerusalem in the 1967 Arab-Israeli war; it didn't belong to Israel before
    - Palestinians thought Sharon's visit was "a direct attempt to derail the peace process and an attempt to inflame the whole region"
     
  10. BenReilly

    BenReilly New Member

    Apr 8, 2002
    Yes it did.
     
  11. #10 Jersey

    #10 Jersey Member

    May 2, 1999
    No, it's too easy just to throw something out and say its a good start. Give me a complete package of what should be done so that the Pal's get their state and Israel is secure.

    We're talking about human life here, what is your complete solution?
     
  12. odessit19

    odessit19 Member+

    Dec 19, 2004
    My gun safe
    Club:
    AC Milan
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    Ukraine
    What about the good Palestinians, what should they do? Peace process has been a one-way process with Israel moving towards peace while Palestinians have been doing less than nothing.
     
  13. verybdog

    verybdog New Member

    Jun 29, 2001
    Houyhnhnms
    Temple Mount had never been physically under Israelis' control for thousand of years until 1967.

    The same area is known to Arabs as the Haram-al Sharif, or Noble Sanctuary, and is deeply revered.

    That's why it's correct to say it's Sharon who started this current mess.
     
  14. verybdog

    verybdog New Member

    Jun 29, 2001
    Houyhnhnms
    How about taking baby steps first? Like scaling back settlements in WB? Open talk to whoever who are relevant? Respect Palestinians as a people and as a culture without sorting to brutal military action? How about stop US' unconditional support of Israel?

    It's easy to talk about the complete package while Israelis are unwilling to do the little baby steps that could alleviate the tension between them and Palestinians.
     
  15. odessit19

    odessit19 Member+

    Dec 19, 2004
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    How about the goo, kind, innocent Palestinians - what should they do?
     
  16. verybdog

    verybdog New Member

    Jun 29, 2001
    Houyhnhnms
    They probably can't do anything. What can they do? It's not like that they can stop Hamas' suicide bombings or IDF's offenses if they are lucky and haven't been shot dead in it. Life is hell and they are totally humiliated and stuck in the checkpointed semi-concentration camps. So what should they do?
     
  17. JPhurst

    JPhurst New Member

    Jul 30, 2001
    Jersey City, NJ
    Israel took significantly more than a baby step by leaving Gaza. Let's see what steps, if any, the Palestinians take.

    How about banning racist organizations such as Hamas and Islamic Jihad, like the Israelis banned the Kahane party?
     
  18. verybdog

    verybdog New Member

    Jun 29, 2001
    Houyhnhnms
    Leaving Gaza is a very good start.

    Currently who has the power in Palestine in banning Hamas?

    Like the Kahane party, Hamas has lots of support from the populace due to the Israelis' publicized brutality. So reducing Israeli brutality could be a good start because I think Hamas' suicide bombings were reaction to that.
     
  19. odessit19

    odessit19 Member+

    Dec 19, 2004
    My gun safe
    Club:
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    So they should just do nothing and keep murdering as they do innocent Jews. Good suggestion, dumb********
     
  20. verybdog

    verybdog New Member

    Jun 29, 2001
    Houyhnhnms
    All I said was their options are very limited under the current circumstances. Do you have good suggestions?
     
  21. Scarecrow

    Scarecrow Red Card

    Feb 13, 2004
    Chicago
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    So long as groups like hamas exist there will not be peace. They do not want peace. They want the killing to go on. It is their stated mission.
     
  22. DoyleG

    DoyleG Member+

    CanPL
    Canada
    Jan 11, 2002
    YEG-->YYJ-->YWG-->YYB
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    The Palestinians have no historical claim to a homeland. They are nothing more than a proxy for Arab nationalists who have the fear of an Isreali democracy on their borders. A Palestinian blowing himself up means the Arab states can kill Isreali's without putting their own people at risk. They've been pasted three times in battle and another loss would finish them off.
     
  23. verybdog

    verybdog New Member

    Jun 29, 2001
    Houyhnhnms
    I don't think you can blame every trouble in ME on Hamas. It's only one side of the story.
     
  24. #10 Jersey

    #10 Jersey Member

    May 2, 1999
    Israel did not have Gaza and the West bank prior to '67. They were held by Jordan and Egypt. Can you explain to me why Israeli's should feel safer by giving them to the Pal's if the Pal's and their arab brethren attacked them at every turn prior to '67?

    Why would Israel do anything without getting something in return? At what point would you have them stop if they don't see reciprocal action from the Pal's.?

    If the Pal's can't stop Hamas now (according to you), what would it take to get the PA to stop them?
     
  25. BenReilly

    BenReilly New Member

    Apr 8, 2002
    I appreciate the qualification.
     

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