Even more pointed and relevant: What legitimate feat has Guppy ever accomplished that Wilt hasn't or what has Guppy ever done better than Wilt? If you can answer those questions, then you have a half decent case for "devil's advocacy". Until then, you're pissing into the wind.
Really sorry if I ruffled a few feathers. Perhaps I'm a little out of line with my previous rant but I'm passionate about my club - well my stateside club that is - AND a little sauced thanks to my friend Jack. This on a whole is negative for MLS and proves so by true supporters of other clubs throughout MLS posting here with their shock and surprise. I want the MLS to go forward. I WANT the sport to grow on a professional level in this country. Something like this happening stalls any hopes of that. BTW thank you (no REALLY) fellow MLS supporters for voicing you opinion on this hurting the league/chicago. When it comes down to it I want to see the whole league continue far from the 1st 10 years.
I'm still trying to get the vibe of how this meeting went. Can anyone give a quick rundown of what was said there, and what people came out of it thinking?
Loonixxx: As a pompey fan, wouldn't you say that this is a lot like the mess that went down at fratton park last december? what a tailspin portsmouth has been in ever since.. now fighting to avoid relegation the sports world never learns from the mistakes that others make
Milan bringing in Zajec was the last straw for Judas and caused the spark for him to leave and then join the scum. Redknapp and Milan were always at odds (just look back to previous season) all this was swept under the rug by Pompey's last gasp run and securing top flight status for another year. It resurfaced REAL UGLY in 04/05 campaign with Harry leaving then joining Pompey's most hated rival. I'll NEVER question Judas with his managing ability what he did for Portsmouth is really remarkable to get them where they are. But you know this business with mess that you recall from December and what the Fire fans are going through does stink of somehting of the Harry fallout (with Pompey) and I was thinking the same thing earlier tonight. Call me the unlucky supporter of 2 clubs (1 England/1 USA) to go through managment/GM problems. Maybe that's why the PW issue and what could and might happen hits SO hard with me.
Well, the last sentence (being "interested in turning a cold hard profit") is neither surprising nor, really, wrong of them, given the miillions and millions of dollars Anschutz and Company have poured into MLS and lost. I can't criticize them for wanting to do whatever they can to finally make some money off MLS. What I can criticize them for is the idiotic reasoning that led them to think that replacing Wilt with Guppy will bring them closer to that goal. Absurd.
The meeting went mostly poorly. Basically everything leading up to and including today is/was negative. We as fans now need to find the right way forward. PWilt does not want to leave the Fire. The Fire do not want Guppy. Fans do want PWilt and do not want Guppy. Guppy is an AEG prick that has very little interest in soccer. He's being handed a situation that is a guaranteed immediate money maker for AEG since Bridgeview is paying all of the up front costs. He can't fail from AEG's perspective. My gut instincts on the subject are worse than what I've just stated.
The Revolution Will Be Televised All true. Also true is that some good ideas were discussed and people have been galvanized into action. We don't have much time but the people active in the supporters groups are working together to put things together. Luckily, the internet is our friend in creating a rapid response.
I'll give it a try, sorry it's late, I had to take the train. I'd say there were about 40-50 people at the globe. The front room was packed, and it was good to see everyone there. Basically, Peter showed up and gave a very nice speech for about ten minutes explaining what his thoughts were. As Karl reported (from me), he urged all the fans to support the Fire (the "badge" as he said) with the same traditions and passion that have made us great. He said it would be a shame to lose that, and that the badge is more important than anything else. It was obvious that PW was devastated by all this, but he still had the class to put the club first. The issue between AEG and PW seems to be this "sales" thing. Whereas numbers for the Fire are as good as they've ever been (or the best they've ever been in some areas), apparently AEG wanted to shake things up in light of our move. Guppy is apparently good at dealing with corporate sales (everyone here knows he's sh!te with fans). Peter Wilt, obviously, was a fan's GM, but I think it's obvoius that that's something the high-ups at AEG don't understand. Blackmun has never even been to a game. They don't understand what Section 8 (and ESC, etc.) do for the game and for their sales. That's leverage that we have, obviously. After PW spoke, we had a discussion/debate on what we'd do. Some people were for the cautious approach, while others were not. In the end, it was decided to start with the plan to wear black on Saturday. This shows our mourning and disappointment over Peter's departure, but allows us to be in the stands and show our support for the team. Silences, march-outs, banners, t-shirts, chants, etc. are still possibilities and will be discussed in the following days. Also, it is very important to let the media, and everyone at the game, know WHY we are doing what we're doing. Hopefully everyone (not just us internet nuts) will know what's going on before too long. That's about it for the meeting. Keep checking here, www.section8chicago.com, and you email for news about further plans and developments. Don't quote me on any of this, because I just made it all up.
Glad to see such a rapid response from the fans. If San Jose fans can keep their team from moving, Fire fans can most definitley oust this Metro prick. Or, more feasibly, get AEG to not fire Peter. You've got an entire season. Good luck.
I asked this exact question myself at the meeting. The reply? "He has a British accent" Be on the lookout for a direct S8C comment and direction on Saturday's game for all fans very soon. Most important, do not FAIL to come Saturday. it's hard, but the only way we will have our voice heard is by being there. We are there, first and foremost, to support our club. Not a business entity owned by AEG or decisions made by Kevin Payne or Scott "never been to a Fire game" Blackmun. It's the tradition, the badge, and the colors which is not owned by anyone. All the supporters' groups are working hard to fill the sections and beyond for this game, as well as notifying media and working with sympathetic parties from all over the Chicago area and larger Fire community; even the original Ultras are coming out of hibernation for this. Wear black, bring an extra black shirt, and come with fully rested voices.
Does anyone know for sure that he has an accent? He's been here since 91 (I think). That's double the time it took Fridel to lose his American accent.
I think that's sort of beside the point at this juncture. I need to sleep. Long day ahead, tommorrow.
I've been following this for over 12 hours now and it just doesn't make any sense. This really sucks for Chicago fans, but Peter Wilt was well liked and respected even by fans of Chicago's rivals. This is bad for the whole league. Hopefully there will be a way of supporters throughout the league to show solidarity with Fire fans. PS - Just a question, but I've seen several posters refer to AEG decisions as coming from Kevin Payne. I know he was in charge of AEG operations for a while, but I was under the impression that when he came back to DC he had left his higher up role at AEG. Am I mistaken?
I posted a very long thread in MLS General that in part addresses Payne. I put a link there where he says he moved back to DC to wrap up a stadium and transfer to new ownership. I don't think he wanted to be DC GM for life (on the player personnel side of things). I'm guessing he either owns DC or moves back to AEG after the sale. Either way I think he's still an important and influental member of the AEG inner circle. I don't think it's like he was demoted from AEG to DC but rather had a personal desire to steer DC towards ensured stability and remains tied in to running MLS & other soccer operations in this country.
It doesn't make too much sense to me either. See, it's the whole thing with possibly emulating LA's new set up that scares me. I would absolutely love to be able to go to games, especially after the new stadium is finished. My main concern is ticket prices. I have to take out huge loans to cover my tuition and living expenses. If ticket prices do go up, I won't be at games near as much which would be hugely disappointing. I still don't see the point in fixing something that wasn't broken. Maybe I'm missing something really key to understand this (whether I just overlooked it or no one knows). I like the Fire b/c it's so fan oriented. Peter Wilt is a big part of that. Ah well. I'll still be there in August to give it a go.
At halftime of the game this Saturday, those of us that have had season tickets for the past eight years will be allowed on the field for some kind of recognition thing. I think this would be a good occasion for saluting Peter! My family and I will definately be wearing black! What a total joke! Does fan base mean anything to this organization (aig, not Fire). The Fire badge was something to be proud of, not just some corporate tool.
The irony is the league brings in Chivas to attract a more passionate crowd and AEG brings in Guppy to kill it. AEG has done much for keeping MLS alive, and for that I thank them. However, (and God, I hope I'm wrong) their vision of soccer and our vision of soccer do not appear to be the same. Ours is stadiums full of fans heavily involved in the game - part of the show - like those in Chicago and DC. Theirs is 10-12K soccer moms quietly watching the 'product', spending a lot of money, then just going home and "We'll let you know when we need you again.". Until each team has its own I/O.....
Couple of thoughts that I'll keep brief as I don't want to impede on your thread. I'm absolutely dismayed about this. 1. For those speaking about how bad it would be to emulate the HDC set up with Hamilton. Remember that Peter has spoke effusively in the past of what a great GM he thought Hamilton was. 2. With something happening this quickly it’s natural for the thought process to go towards some kind of impropriety. This whole deal doesn’t add up to me either. 3. However, AEG might be taking lesson from the Replacing Johnny Moore Handbook. This might have been in the works for a while but kept from Wilt because they were worried about fan reaction and how it was going to effect ticket sales. It strikes me as curious in that a week and half into the season when most hardcores have already bought season ticket is when they make this change. EDIT: I'm curious today if anyone, or any media member at the presser will have the balls to ask about the 'speculation,' surrounding his dismisal. It would seem to me that a Higher Up saying, 'No, absolutely nothing of the sort,' might go a long way.
BINGO!!! So to keep the hardcore fans still holding tickets...Wilt is bumped into a temp role until his contract is up.. ~~Worm~~
Actually, you guys own those things. All of you, along with Peter Wilt, either created or defined those things through your support of the club. AEG has title to the team but the legacy of the team belongs to the fans. You have your time, energy, and experience wrapped up in the Fire and that belongs to all of you, not to AEG. (Those are the same reasons we started Soccer Silicon Valley, BTW. We wanted to make sure that our investment in the club was demonstrated to AEG and decided to act on our own behalf by manning the front lines in the stadium effort. Our mission has expanded since then but the thought behind it -- that the Quakes are OUR TEAM -- is very much the same.)