DC United U23s vs Mexico :: [R]

[Short Irish Guy]

For all of the people watching the game from home tonight - if possible - want to meet in the BigSoccerDCU AIM chat?

[Lowecifer]

I'm in there, though I don't speak spanish so I won't be much help.

Everyone should come on in, it'll be fun.

[CHICO13]

I'll check it out

[McOwen]

Anyone want to comment on Bobby's (or Alecko's) scoring "tear" in last night's Mexico game?

[Knave]

McOwen - You're trolling. I suggest you cut it out.

[Freestyle2000]

Originally posted by McOwen
Anyone want to comment on Bobby's (or Alecko's) scoring "tear" in last night's Mexico game?

He had a bad game.

So, I say we hang him. Just string him up.

RS

[McOwen]

Originally posted by Knave
McOwen - You're trolling. I suggest you cut it out.

NO... Your playing tin pot dictator.

There is no need for your note. I am simply making a point. There was a lot being made of two United players efforts in this tournament. If we can ask questions regarding Bobby Convey's MLS potential based on his performance versus a bunch of second rate soccer powers, we can surely wonder why it is that the same players looked attrocious versus a quality opponent.

I am not saying we hang EITHER kid, I am not saying he/they will not have an amazing season. I am saying that a few games against A-league level youth teams does not make a future MLS all star.

We can ALL note that.

[DCU]

McOwen, you say they looked aweful. Did you see the game? If you did and would like to discuss it, shouldn't you put that post in a thread with an [R] in the title?

Some might view the result as helpful to united given all the call ups. You take the opportunity to piss on two of our players. You're a real class fan.

[McOwen]

Re read the post. I never said anything about the players looking "aweful". I asked if anyone was going to comment on their "success" this evening. (aka as a "tear")

Besides... I am not pissing on anything. I am just choosing to not kiss their asses. There is a subtle difference.

Just for Bigsoccer fun though I will agree. I am evil and a pessimistic kill joy. --Regardless, I still think that we need to tone down some expectations or things could be a lot nastier around here if (God forbid) things do not go so well this season.

As a side note, I also find it humorous that certain players on this team are seemingly above criticism while other older names are merely lightning rods for it.

[onefineesq]

whoa whoa whoa. c'mon DCU. that's a low blow as well. let's be fair on both sides of the argument on this one. I think McOwens point is that a whole lot of people on this board have been drinking the coolade for Bobby Convey lately, and maybe ...... just maybe, it was premature. I for one CERTAINLY think it's premature and have stated so on numerous times. As a fan of our beloved United, there is nothing wrong with us being honest about our team and players. I have never subscribed to the idea that we must refrain from criticism of our own players. As long as the discussion is centered around their play, and not some extraneous personal issue, I think it's fair game. With that being said, I will repeat what i have said many many many times. Bobby Convey has not performed well with United. Period. We can talk about all this playing out of position stuff and all that. But if you line up his production alongside that of Santino Quaranta, you will find something quite startling. Sure, I have played and watched soccer all my life, and i understand that "numbers" are not everything, but .................... Anyway, let's allow Bobby to actually play well for United before he is crowned king of kings and lord of lords.

[Knave]

Originally posted by McOwen
There is no need for your note. I am simply making a point.
You're not making a point. You're being obnoxious. If you want to make a point then do so in an appropriate manner. As far as I'm concerned you're just taking a poor performance as an opportunity to (in DCU's language) take a piss on a DC United player. That's trolling, pure and simple. No question about it.
If we can ask questions regarding Bobby Convey's MLS potential based on his performance versus a bunch of second rate soccer powers, we can surely wonder why it is that the same players looked attrocious versus a quality opponent.
If want to raise the question then raise the question. Ask politely, in a thoughtful manner what this performance means to us. Ask it in such a way that folks won't immediately doubt your sincerity. But there's nothing to indicate sincerity or genuine concern about Convey and DC United in your potshot post above.

[Knave]

The comment above about the [R] is right. I've split everything out about the Mexico match from the "Will Convey's recent scoring tear translate to MLS?" thread and moved it here.

[jason1551]

Well, for those that don't know: the US lost 4-0.

I certainly can't find anything on US Matchtracker that would indicate Bobby had a bad game and according to AP reports Eski had the best US opportunity of the game. I certainly don't think that the game was indicative of their talent, but it does show that they still have a lot to improve on. However, I'm not willing to villify them over one performance. Convey is in better form now than he was six months ago and I believe that is a huge benefit to this team. Eski being able to score a hat-trick gives him a confidence boost heading into training camp. The tournament showed that they have the potential to do well this season. Now they have to prove it out on the field against professional players.

[JoeW]

Well...there isn't much of an upside to this loss except that it means that all of our Olympians will be home this July and August.

And I guess that means Lanky is right--there is no-way Friedel, Howard or Keller will get called up to the Olympic team. ; )

[GrillMaster]

Originally posted by JoeW
Well...there isn't much of an upside to this loss except that it means that all of our Olympians will be home this July and August.
[snip] I consider this a huge upside. I'd rather our players be here than in Athens or training for Athens. I remember that Ben Olsen's concentration on MLS was adversely affected (IMO) with the Olympic distraction back in 2000. I think it would adversely affect our players, especially Bobby. Now he must prove himself productive in MLS.

As upset as I was at the horrifying result, my first thought was "at least we'll have our players for League play". Unless it's in the world cup, it's club over country for me.

GM

[IntheNet]

Bobby C. and Alecko E. were tearing through goals the week before then they get south of the border and nothing...nada? This stinks! I can't believe the Mexicans are that good... defense problem? offense problem? coaching problem? Tequila problem? Heck...Convey made more goals last week than all last season for DCU, then gets to the mexican pitch and does... nothing?

Can't figure this out... ghosts of former DCU Hudson on the sidelines maybe interferrng with this men's team! In any event... they stink. Bad loss!

IntheNet

[Bill Archer]

mc owen:

As a sometime critic of moderator anal-retentiveness, as well as a ready source of conversation grist on the UberModden GeheimeStaatsForum, I really have to say that in this particular case Knave has quite properly called troll.


In re: the title of this thread, I would respectfully point out that the Columbus Crew had more starters on the team last night than DC did (Convey vs. Wingert and Marshall) and while Eskandarian DID in fact enter the game in the second half, if Edson Buddle (Columbus Crew) had not been sent home injured Esky would likely not have EVER gotten on the field since Johnson would then have become the first forward off the bench.

Moreover, had Kyle Martino also not been injured in camp, the Crew would most likely have had FOUR starters (Buddle, Wingert, Marshall and Martino) to DC's one (Convey), and the overall numbers would have been five and five.

As for the game, well, they just got smoked. It happens. (Particularly when your best defensive options include a current college sophomore) I don't think it's indicative of their talent and in any case while I'm certainly sorry for the players, who obviously were looking forward to a trip to the Olympics (heck, who wouldn't) personally, I'd rather they were here playing for their teams this summer instead of lounging by the Mediterranean.

Thanks for your kind attentiveness. Have a nice day.

Yours in soccer,

Fred

[Roush]

What nobody seems to comment on is the sad lack of defense in this match. The U.S. defense has been porous at best so far, and playing against real opposition, we got severely punished. You cannot give up 5-10 yards against Mexico in the defensive third and NOT expect them to score at will.

I saw the game, or at least the first half, before I got sick of watching it and left.

Another problem I saw was a forced final touch. Mexico was closing down properly on defense, and it always seemed that the last touch before a turnover was the most "forced" option available. It might have worked against Panama, but it won't work against Mexico.

[Mason16]

Embarrasing result, no excuses. Although I have yet to see the game, I think Mooch should come under some scrutiny. Why Pause instead of Beckerman? Ej instead of Alecko? Would a 5 man midfield have slowed Mexico down more and given us a better shot last night? Why did the team look as though they lacked motivation (per eyewitness reports). In any event, the benefit of having the DCU contingent not miss games due to the Olympics is valid in my book. That would have hampered the team, particularly with Convey slated to be our offensive engine. Go luck to Mexico and Costa Rica.

Re: Convey. THe "King of Kings" hyperbole is unnecessary. Without making excuses, most followers of his game will clearly admit that he has been, on average, an average DCU player. What I and many others see is a maturing Convey that could very well be special this year and have a breakout season by FINALLY getting the opportunity to run the offense. This, more than any other factor to date, gets me excited about the upcoming season. He is clearly an enormous talent and has shown enough in flashes and with the U20/U23 teams to confirm this. One bad game helps keep our expectations of him in perspective, but it does not change the unbiased opinion that he might be a more than effective replacement for Etch at a-mid and might help lead this team back to winning.

[dsheon]

I saw the game last night and I'm not bothered by McOwen's comments. There may have been two five minute periods where the Mexican's let us string together a few passes.

Convey was unable to control the midfield. The flow improved a bit when Beckerman was brought in.

There was an incredible lack of creativity, a reminder of France 98, where it seemed like we were the Toledo Generals to Mexico's Harlem Globetrotters.

That was the worst performance in US uniforms that I've seen in several years, and Convey is near the top of the list for being responsible. His few touches were predictable and uninspired. He sometimes seemed to be running at 80% pace against a team running at 110%.

Average players sometimes have great games against average teams. Great players sometimes have great games against very good teams. Unfortunately I've never seen Convey have a great game against a good team.

Until I see otherwise, Convey is at best an average player.

Oh and everything said about Convey's play last night can be said about Donovan as well.