United had 'baffling' tactics :: Plenderleith interview :: Haydon, W. Times

[Knave]

I wanted to single out one exemplary Q&A but I couldn't do it. There were too many good ones: the indictment of Etcheverry, the assertion that the United States will never win the World Cup, the downplaying of Kovalenko's season ... and that's just to start. It's a good interview though with lots of discussion fodder.

And I trust imp65 is ready for the customary BigSoccer.com post-interview interview. (So what that we've never done that before. That doesn't mean it's not customary. Or does it?) We expect nothing less than essay length clarifications and elaborations for your more controversial points. ;)

Plenderleith Interview: United had 'baffling' tactics (http://washingtontimes.com/sports/20031226-114700-9978r.htm) - Washington Times, John Haydon

[Femfa]

Q: What do you think of the playoff format?
A: Eventually I'd like to see a single league and relegation to the A-League. I don't think it's realistic at the moment because of the franchise system. The playoffs inevitably [have their] faults and detractors, but this year's playoffs were actually very entertaining. All the final three San Jose games were great, and in that sense the system has spoken for itself quite well.


I'll pick on this one - isn't this a classic contradiction in terms?

"Get rid of the playoffs. The playoffs were really great this year!"

I'll give him that his DCU observations are fairly astute - though I'm also not in the position to be the most precise critic of that - but it does come off as galling arrogance to declare that the U.S. will NEVER win a W.C.

Scotland, for that matter, might win it sometime. It just seems in any context where something is possible - one is better off with the politic option of "unlikely - I doubt it - probably not - don't think so - outlook doubtful" etc, than the divine foreshadowing of your own petard "it ain't ever goin' to happen, baby".

Plus, I can't believe an interview on DCU didn't herald the coming of the "One". I'd have pegged Ian as one of the Magi (along with Goff) to come bearing gifts to the Christ child.

[Jose L. Couso]

Interesting but BAFFLING interview.

Q: The U.S. men's team is ranked 11th in the world. Is that a fair ranking?
A: I don't think the FIFA world rankings have meaning to anyone who is a soccer fan. The fact that the U.S. team reached the World Cup quarterfinals was an exaggeration of its ability. But the U.S. is definitely in the top 20 to 30 teams.

Q: When will the U.S. team win the World Cup?
A: It won't.

Q: Not in 20 years?
A: The U.S. team has as much chance as Scotland, which means it won't.

:rolleyes: :rolleyes:

WHATEVER!

[Serie Zed]

Amazingly, I just found a quote from ten years ago from the same IMP:

Q: "Does the fact that the US beat Columbia and advanced to the second round of the World Cup bode well for the future of the game in the United States?"

A: "The fact that the U.S. team reached the knockout stages of the World Cup was an exaggeration of its ability -- they'll never reach the quarterfinals."

Q: "Not in 20 years?"

A: "The U.S. team has as much chance as Scotland, which means it won't."

((But he still nailed the bits about the quality of MLS, Marco being four years past it, Dema's season being overrated, and the insanity of Hudson threatening to do something about MAE and never pulling the trigger.))

[roadkit]

I think the fact that Plenderleith gets his articles published on DC United's homepage and he's a supposed expert exaggerates his abilities.

For example: He says we play a more "latin style game" but our targeting the latin audience is seriously lacking.

Uh-huh. Whatever. To paraphrase Kovalenko: "Tell Plenederleith to have a nice weekend...he's an idiot."

[Deuteriumoxide]

Man, if you guys could smell the fart this article induced... there would be no more articles posted on bigsoccer....

[Red&Black]

i don't think the world cup comment is that outrageous. Only 7 countries have ever won the damn thing anyway (and there have only been 11 different nations in the final over the years). look at some of the quarterfinalists in 86 (the first year they had a format with quarterfinals)--belgium, mexico and spain. only spain is likely to anything close to a favorite in 06.

[Serie Zed]

It's a simple formula...

Soccer-playing Population*x + GDP*y + Quality of Relevant Infrastructure*z = Chance to win WC

No guarantees we win, but we'll be competitive.

[bigredfutbol]

I really want to know his reasons why he doesn't think the US will never win the WC.

[futbolrey]

Didn't the fact that the USA team A lose to Brazil C team meaning anything (Gold Cup)? Maybe that explains why why team USA won't win the world cup in at least 20 yrs.

[bigredfutbol]

He doesn't give a time frame. He says "Never"--which includes any future line-up of Freddy Adus we may manage to produce.

[Cweedchop]

Originally posted by Red&Black
i don't think the world cup comment is that outrageous. Only 7 countries have ever won the damn thing anyway (and there have only been 11 different nations in the final over the years). look at some of the quarterfinalists in 86 (the first year they had a format with quarterfinals)--belgium, mexico and spain. only spain is likely to anything close to a favorite in 06.

I don't have a problem with Ian stating that the US won't win a World Cup.. As stated above, only 7 countries have won the damn thing.. What I have a problem with is Ian's use of the word 'never'.. As we all know, "never" is a very dangerous word to throw around..

Just based on the strides this country has made in the past 10 years alone should give even the most Eurocentric of skeptics room to pause..

Our senior National Team is among the top 15 in the world, despite Plenderleith's stating that we are somewhere between the 20's and 30's.. I don't know how much more we as a soccer nation need to improve on all levels of play (Youth and Senior National levels) to convince even the starchest futbol minds out there that the United States is a threat to world soccer..

By no means is the US ready to take up a global power position in international football at this time, but we are producing teams, players and now coaches who can most certainly stand out on a world stage.. Of course, one bad slip-up in Germany in 2006 and all this comes crashing down to most European experts..

You can take the man out of England, but you can't take the England out of the man..

For what it's worth, I think Ian is a fantastic soccer writer and is head and shoulders above his counterparts in the press box at RFK in soccer knowledge.. I just think he might need to readdress his thoughts on the budding soccer nation that is the United States..

[Cweedchop]

Originally posted by futbolrey
Didn't the fact that the USA team A lose to Brazil C team meaning anything (Gold Cup)? Maybe that explains why why team USA won't win the world cup in at least 20 yrs.

So that's it then?

So we should just basically give up fielding teams at all levels because we lost a close game to a team that is much more steeped in tradition than we can possibly be?

Winning or losing one game in a continental championship does not make or break a soccer countries future..

[Jose L. Couso]

Originally posted by Red&Black
i don't think the world cup comment is that outrageous. Only 7 countries have ever won the damn thing anyway (and there have only been 11 different nations in the final over the years). look at some of the quarterfinalists in 86 (the first year they had a format with quarterfinals)--belgium, mexico and spain. only spain is likely to anything close to a favorite in 06.

It's outrageous because he used the word "never".

[Jose L. Couso]

Originally posted by Cweedchop
For what it's worth, I think Ian is a fantastic soccer writer and is head and shoulders above his counterparts in the press box at RFK in soccer knowledge.. I just think he might need to readdress his thoughts on the budding soccer nation that is the United States..

I am beginning to think that he is as relevant as Brian Glanville and Paul Gardner...

[Jose L. Couso]

Getting back to the USA and winning the World Cup.

The fact is that the USA produces some of the best athletes in practically all sports. When some of those great athletes start choosing soccer as a career (when athletes playing soccer in the USA start getting paid MEGA-bucks) the USA will be that much closer to winning a World Cup.

[fatbastard]

A: "The U.S. team has as much chance as Scotland, which means it won't."
Would be just as valid to use England as an example, they'll never win another one either. We have just as good of a chance, anyway.
20 years ago, a good majority of folks could have said we'd never even make it to a World Cup and not sounded too insane :)
I'd rather be a fan of a country with no chance so that every win is that much more enjoyable than a country where you just expected to win so a loss, even in the finals, would be a horrible thing. Or not :)

[Knave]

Ah, lay off it. There used to be a thread on this exact question on the World Cup board. We all decided that you can't say the US or any other country for that matter will never win the World Cup because it's an absolute that's totally unverifiable since we can't know the future. So it's not, in the end, an outrageous thing to say but a silly if not stupid thing to say. I can't say the US will never win the World Cup anymore than I can say that Fiji will never win the World Cup. I can speak in terms of probabilities and time frames but without perfect knowledge of the future I just can't say never. But whatever, it's just not that interesting and it's not about DC United ...

I for one would like to know why he doesn't think Kovalenko's year was as good as everyone supposes. I tend to think his accomplishments are exaggerated too but I wonder about the imp's reasons for saying the same thing.

[DigitalTron]

Thanks yet again to Haydon for another excellent article. This interview hits all the crucial questions with someone who has credibility in the international media and an understanding of MLS. While I disagree with some of Plenderleith's opinions, I'm happy to see his opinions.

I particularly liked the idea that someone with his breadth of international knowledge equates some good MLS teams to the lower end of the English Premiership. I also think that may be the case.

His pointed criticism of Hudson's tactics are absolutely correct. When your offense must always face 10 defenders, you'll rarely score. But, if your offense consists mainly of square and back passes, with players never encouraged to combine in quick passing or never rewarded for making a good run, then the offense will always suck.

Regardless of who is the next coach, they need to attack the goal. Structureless chaos doesn't work. In Miami Hudson had Preki and a lot of experienced players, who all understood how and when to make runs, and as Preki showed every year since 2000, he can make any team look good.

I disagree with many of Plenderleith's opinions, but he makes many decent points as well. Hopefully, the next coach understands these issues and doesn't make the same mistakes that Hudson and Rongen have made. While each coach had some very good things (Rongen's offense and youth development, Hudson's defense and veteran motivation), there's a lot to learn from their mistakes. Plenderleith highlights some of these issues.

Thanks again to Haydon for the interview.

-Digital

[JoeW]

1. Geez, I don't take IMP as saying "the US is the dregs, no matter what they do, they'll never ever win a WC." Instead, given the tone of the questions, it seemed to me like one could have regarded the question as "well, when can we expect the US to walk away with the WC?". And unless things change in a big way, we can NOT expect the US to win the WC in our lifetimes. Now, that isn't the same thing as saying we can't win the WC. But for the US to be "EXPECTED" to win the WC, we'd need to see...
--MLS be a dominant league where our best players stay home and we can afford to import some of the world's best (like a Zidane in his prime, a Ronaldo and a Ronaldinho).
--the number of teams and the media coverage would have to expand tremendously.
--We'd have to generate some great results in 2006 and 2012 (like finals or semis in both) for people to EXPECT us to win the WC. IMP wasn't trashing the USA, only saying that a country like Scotland which is passionate about soccer, has 2 strong teams, a number of good players--isn't expected to win the WC and likely won't do so. The number of WC contenders is extremely small.

2. It's rare to have both a good writer and someone knowledgable about soccer. To add to that a definite opinion--someone not afraid to take stands and put it out there--well, that's a pleasure to read (even if I don't always agree with what he says).