FSV Mainz [R]

[footyfan1]

Its not about buying tickets to games of that club. I wouldnt buy tickets to see Dortmund, Bremen or Bayern aswell... or ANY other team. But I would definitely prefer MY TEAM playing against these kinds clubs. Because lets face it: Seeing your team play infront of half-empty 5000 seaters isnt exactly fun...

Wait. You are assuming that if those teams are playing good football, they still won't get any fans?

Not many locals probably, but I don't care if my team is playing a suckass Koln team in front of 50,000 fans or a good Hoffenheim team in front of 10,000.

I'm going to the match that's more entertaining to me.

I've told you once before, I don't go to matches to see the fans.





So if I open a Hoffenheim Thread you would call them a traditional team too in this thread?

No, we both know that was a wrong to say.




And yet it is still the record. Which is why I told it to todd who said that Mainz holds that record. Its not like someone giving a rats ass or not changes an existing record... :rolleyes:

And yet still no one gives a rat's ass about them, do they?

[todd11]

Its not about buying tickets to games of that club. I wouldnt buy tickets to see Dortmund, Bremen or Bayern aswell... or ANY other team. But I would definitely prefer MY TEAM playing against these kinds clubs. Because lets face it: Seeing your team play infront of half-empty 5000 seaters isnt exactly fun...



So if I open a Hoffenheim Thread you would call them a traditional team too in this thread?



And yet it is still the record. Which is why I told it to todd who said that Mainz holds that record. Its not like someone giving a rats ass or not changes an existing record... :rolleyes:

If you noticed...it was me...a Mainz fan... who said CURRENTLY (we'll see in 20 yrs ;) ) Mainz 05 is not what I'd call a traditional team. But, yo, *ssmunch dipsh!t Eintracht fan, you can suck my D*ng if you're comparing us even REMOTELY to Hoffenheim. Do we have a wealthy billionare who suddenly bought a team to try to promote on up the chain? No, we have careful, prudent management that has been involved in this club for a long time. (I know that must hurt a Frankfurt fan... you know management... without complete sellout...) With a careful plan to bring us along nicely...which is exactly what is happening. I'm sorry your Shite team (how much money you have...yet have only a few more points than us...and can't beat us??) over there with the tw*t bunch of anti-social away fans who like to do things like stop the fan-trains by pulling the emergency cord, or beat up a middle aged Mainz fan at the hauptbahnhof in Mainz (back a few years)... sorry your big club still S*CKS. I've had a few biers tonight, excuse the belligerent tone...all others I mean... other than bankfurt fans. yin's can go bugger each other with your tough guy homo poseurs.

Yeah, i've heard of fort. koeln... a certain mediocre (well, slightly more than mediocre, I guess) American player named Jovan Kirovski was loaned to them for a year from Dortmund backinaday. If you have some link or proof... that's cool...I've just heard from day one that I landed here that Mainz set the record for time in the 2.liga...if NOT that's actually good in my book. And it's my bad for actually checking it. mea culpa. But I'm guessing it really must frost your BIG CLUB *ss that such a HUGE CLUB like Frankfurt can't ever dominate a little nobody in the same region like Mainz 05... and that the rest of the country enjoys the way we play soccer whereas your regressive lame_*ss club plays ... despite your wealth... like well... a team that barely can survive relegation. I'd channel Segroves right now and tell you to go di... but... well... an Eintracht fan isn't really worth it.

[Doc_Aeppler]

Wait. You are assuming that if those teams are playing good football, they still won't get any fans?
Yes I am, take a look at Fürth for example...
I dont know whether Hoffenheim or paderborn may average 30000 and more in 20 years. Maybe they will. I dont care tough because right now they are just plain boring, and for the next 5 years they most probably will be too...

Not many locals probably, but I don't care if my team is playing a suckass Koln team in front of 50,000 fans or a good Hoffenheim team in front of 10,000.
I'm going to the match that's more entertaining to me.
I've told you once before, I don't go to matches to see the fans.
I know that you have a different view on football in generell than I have.
Thats cool, you can go to games for whatever reasons you want.
This discussion was about how attractive 2nd liga will be next year, for the clubs that play in it, and for their Fans. And how all the "traditional" clubs add so much to that 2nd Liga.
If you want to deny that or see it differently, ok go ahead.
Fact is tough, that the 2nd Bundesliga is as attractive as never before. 10 years ago you had a bunch of smalltownclubs and two or three run down former big clubs playing infront of an average attendance of less then 10000.
To find some TV-coverage was almost impossible...
Now you have tons of interesting clubs that have huge potential, an average attendance that may well reach 20000 next season and plenty of tv-coverage...
The actual quality of the game played has probably not grown that much tough. Its still 2nd Division...
If you dont care about all of that... fine, but many Fans enjoy games between two former big clubs with a big fanbase and a full stadium a lot more than games between two smalltown clubs infront of 2465 people, even if the game played is just as bad or good...

And yet still no one gives a rat's ass about them, do they?
and why should they? and did anybody ever say so? i honestly dont see whats you problem...

[Doc_Aeppler]

If you noticed...it was me...a Mainz fan... who said CURRENTLY (we'll see in 20 yrs ;) ) Mainz 05 is not what I'd call a traditional team. But, yo, *ssmunch dipsh!t Eintracht fan, you can suck my D*ng if you're comparing us even REMOTELY to Hoffenheim. Do we have a wealthy billionare who suddenly bought a team to try to promote on up the chain? No, we have careful, prudent management that has been involved in this club for a long time. (I know that must hurt a Frankfurt fan... you know management... without complete sellout...) With a careful plan to bring us along nicely...which is exactly what is happening. I'm sorry your Shite team (how much money you have...yet have only a few more points than us...and can't beat us??) over there with the tw*t bunch of anti-social away fans who like to do things like stop the fan-trains by pulling the emergency cord, or beat up a middle aged Mainz fan at the hauptbahnhof in Mainz (back a few years)... sorry your big club still S*CKS. I've had a few biers tonight, excuse the belligerent tone...all others I mean... other than bankfurt fans. yin's can go bugger each other with your tough guy homo poseurs.

Yeah, i've heard of fort. koeln... a certain mediocre (well, slightly more than mediocre, I guess) American player named Jovan Kirovski was loaned to them for a year from Dortmund backinaday. If you have some link or proof... that's cool...I've just heard from day one that I landed here that Mainz set the record for time in the 2.liga...if NOT that's actually good in my book. And it's my bad for actually checking it. mea culpa. But I'm guessing it really must frost your BIG CLUB *ss that such a HUGE CLUB like Frankfurt can't ever dominate a little nobody in the same region like Mainz 05... and that the rest of the country enjoys the way we play soccer whereas your regressive lame_*ss club plays ... despite your wealth... like well... a team that barely can survive relegation. I'd channel Segroves right now and tell you to go di... but... well... an Eintracht fan isn't really worth it.

ROFL
Thanks for that good laugh :D

What happened to always being happy and fair? How does a Mainzfan know so many bad words? Is all of that after all just a lie? And Mainz isnt actually that perfect little happy village that they always make them seem on TV?
I AM SHOCKED!

Do you actually believe all this shit or are you just that drunk?
sorry, its just way too funny...

As for the link,try this one: http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fortuna_K%C3%B6ln
Does that not fit into your perfect little Mainz world? Oh, Im sorry...

[Hobo]

If you noticed...it was me...a Mainz fan... who said CURRENTLY (we'll see in 20 yrs ;) ) Mainz 05 is not what I'd call a traditional team. But, yo, *ssmunch dipsh!t Eintracht fan, you can suck my D*ng if you're comparing us even REMOTELY to Hoffenheim. Do we have a wealthy billionare who suddenly bought a team to try to promote on up the chain? No, we have careful, prudent management that has been involved in this club for a long time.

You need to get your fact straight on Hoffenheim. First of all, it is not possible to BUY a team in Germany, as Alex has pointed out time and again. Secondly, Hopp did not suddenly get involved. He played for the team as a child and has been involved in its management since 1989. More info can be found here http://soccernet.espn.go.com/columns/story?id=391555&root=europe&cc=5901 Hopefully, you will see that Hoffenheim's success is the result of "careful, prudent" management that has been involved with the club for a long time."
And here is an article in German from the FAZ from 2001 http://www.tsg-hoffenheim.de/1historie2.php

Here is the team's progress through the leagues since Hopp took over. From the team website http://www.tsg-hoffenheim.de/1historie.php, and I don't know why they stop after 2003/04. But they also spent 04-07 in the RL.


Historie 1. Mannschaft http://www.tsg-hoffenheim.de/assets/sTab_ro.gif Saison Liga 1990 / 1991 A-Liga 1991 / 1992 Bezirksliga 1992 / 1993 Landesliga 1993 / 1994 Landesliga 1994 / 1995 Landesliga 1995 / 1996 Landesliga 1996 / 1997 Verbandsliga 1997 / 1998 Verbandsliga 1998 / 1999 Verbandsliga 1999 / 2000 Verbandsliga 2000 / 2001 Oberliga 2001 / 2002 Regionalliga 2002 / 2003 Regionalliga 2003 / 2004 Regionalliga
So:

1 year A-Liga whatever that is
1 Year Bezirksliga
4 Years Landesliga
4 Years Verbandsliga
1 Year Oberliga
6 Years Regionalliga

Looks pretty prudent to me, more concerned about steady growth than instant success. As a Mainz fan, you should be tipping your hat to team such as Hoffenheim.

[todd11]

You need to get your fact straight on Hoffenheim. First of all, it is not possible to BUY a team in Germany, as Alex has pointed out time and again. Secondly, Hopp did not suddenly get involved. He played for the team as a child and has been involved in its management since 1989. More info can be found here http://soccernet.espn.go.com/columns/story?id=391555&root=europe&cc=5901 Hopefully, you will see that Hoffenheim's success is the result of "careful, prudent" management that has been involved with the club for a long time."
And here is an article in German from the FAZ from 2001 http://www.tsg-hoffenheim.de/1historie2.php

Here is the team's progress through the leagues since Hopp took over. From the team website http://www.tsg-hoffenheim.de/1historie.php, and I don't know why they stop after 2003/04. But they also spent 04-07 in the RL.


Historie 1. Mannschaft http://www.tsg-hoffenheim.de/assets/sTab_ro.gif Saison Liga 1990 / 1991 A-Liga 1991 / 1992 Bezirksliga 1992 / 1993 Landesliga 1993 / 1994 Landesliga 1994 / 1995 Landesliga 1995 / 1996 Landesliga 1996 / 1997 Verbandsliga 1997 / 1998 Verbandsliga 1998 / 1999 Verbandsliga 1999 / 2000 Verbandsliga 2000 / 2001 Oberliga 2001 / 2002 Regionalliga 2002 / 2003 Regionalliga 2003 / 2004 Regionalliga
So:

1 year A-Liga whatever that is
1 Year Bezirksliga
4 Years Landesliga
4 Years Verbandsliga
1 Year Oberliga
6 Years Regionalliga

Looks pretty prudent to me, more concerned about steady growth than instant success. As a Mainz fan, you should be tipping your hat to team such as Hoffenheim.

Well I was drunk. :) I also should not have said wealthy owner. That is something that raises my dander as well, when people say that about German clubs. But fact remains once you put that much money in a team, especially one playing in the lower regions, moving from being simply involved in management to the person making the defacto decisions--- well it is really semantics almost. The question I think that most people have is will they suddenly outspend a lot of clubs now that they'll be in the 2.liga? Clubs that have longer histories in the upper divisions. Say they get promoted in one or two years time... it will be faster growth than say Mainz by quite a bit. But your point is well made and taken.

As is Doc's about the 2.liga in general. I'm just really bitter all of a sudden. Perhaps I'm moving through the stages of grief... I really should be watching an endspiel in Muenchen this weekend! Our team did it's part on Sat., but having our fate determined by things out of our control is, well much more painful. But the way the team played in the first round, it deserves to go down, I suppose. The shame is that the team as it is now, since the break, would probably do pretty well next year.

But despite the alchohol... I do really think that the tough guy poseur frankfurt fans are actually repressed homosexuals. just kidding.... sorta....

[footyfan1]

Yes I am, take a look at Fürth for example...
I dont know whether Hoffenheim or paderborn may average 30000 and more in 20 years. Maybe they will. I dont care tough because right now they are just plain boring, and for the next 5 years they most probably will be too...

What's boring? Their fans or their game?

You seem to care about what's going on around the game more than the game itself.

And that's fine. But don't chide me because I have another view.



I know that you have a different view on football in generell than I have.
Thats cool, you can go to games for whatever reasons you want.
This discussion was about how attractive 2nd liga will be next year, for the clubs that play in it, and for their Fans. And how all the "traditional" clubs add so much to that 2nd Liga.
If you want to deny that or see it differently, ok go ahead.

I didn't deny anything. I gave my view on the discussion.


Fact is tough, that the 2nd Bundesliga is as attractive as never before. 10 years ago you had a bunch of smalltownclubs and two or three run down former big clubs playing infront of an average attendance of less then 10000.
To find some TV-coverage was almost impossible...
Now you have tons of interesting clubs that have huge potential, an average attendance that may well reach 20000 next season and plenty of tv-coverage...
The actual quality of the game played has probably not grown that much tough. Its still 2nd Division...
If you dont care about all of that... fine, but many Fans enjoy games between two former big clubs with a big fanbase and a full stadium a lot more than games between two smalltown clubs infront of 2465 people, even if the game played is just as bad or good...


(Hypothetical situation)

I'm seeing that you think that Borussia Moenchengladbach v. 1. FC Koln playing a bottom of the table matchup would be more interesting than a top of the table clash between Hoffenheim and Wehen.

I'm different. I'd take a bit of interest in the Gladbach-Koln match because I am a fan of the game, but if I had to choose one to go to, I'd go to the top of the table clash.

I care about the here and now. I'm not going to see two clubs play if they suck just because they are going to be 30,000 people there pretending it's the "good old days."

I think we need to agree to disagree here. I don't think you are "wrong" at all. We just have different views. "Tradition" just doesn't mean that much to me unless we are having a discussion about those days or how a club got to where it is.

It plays no role in how I choose to enjoy an afternoon at the stadium.

[Hobo]

Well I was drunk. :) I also should not have said wealthy owner. That is something that raises my dander as well, when people say that about German clubs. But fact remains once you put that much money in a team, especially one playing in the lower regions, moving from being simply involved in management to the person making the defacto decisions--- well it is really semantics almost. The question I think that most people have is will they suddenly outspend a lot of clubs now that they'll be in the 2.liga? Clubs that have longer histories in the upper divisions. Say they get promoted in one or two years time... it will be faster growth than say Mainz by quite a bit. But your point is well made and taken.

As is Doc's about the 2.liga in general. I'm just really bitter all of a sudden. Perhaps I'm moving through the stages of grief... I really should be watching an endspiel in Muenchen this weekend! Our team did it's part on Sat., but having our fate determined by things out of our control is, well much more painful. But the way the team played in the first round, it deserves to go down, I suppose. The shame is that the team as it is now, since the break, would probably do pretty well next year.

But despite the alchohol... I do really think that the tough guy poseur frankfurt fans are actually repressed homosexuals. just kidding.... sorta....

ah, ye ole devil drink. I understand completely. And I am on your side.

[todd11]

[QUOTE=Hobo;11551655]ah, ye ole devil drink. QUOTE]

Yep, the defense of both me and Mel Gibson... although I didn't post anything anti-semetic. :)

I'm just dreading watching this team in the 2.liga without Friedrich and Zidan. Essentially that will be watching the hinrunde (where we couldn't score) with the added 'pleasure' of not being able to stop anyone. Hopefully Kloppo can pull off some miracle like he did, plucking Da Silva from Wehen.

["Eisenfuß" Eilts]

So many good football teams. I know, I for one, have never bought a ticket to see anyone based on "tradition....."

Please. What does it mean?

Are all the old ghosts going to come out and play?

I think "Tradition" is a great thing to use for pride in your own club.

I can't see where "tradition" has anything to do with how "amazing" a league is going to be.


Well, i have a different opinion.

Quality on the pitch is not everything,
atmosphere on the stands is also important.

If you look e.g. at St. Pauli in RL Nord you know,
what i mean. In football aspects they are
not classes better than Wehen or Hoffenheim,
but they bring more fans to away matches than
Wehen and Hoffenheim have at home matches.
That creates a total different atmosphere (i don´t
say, that the village teams have no atmosphere,
it´s also nice to watch such match, but serious,
matches at stadiums like Millerntor are something special).

And the Pauli support is also a reason for many
not real home team fans to watch the match vs. St.Pauli.

So, "tradition" makes a league definite more entertaiment.

[footyfan1]

Well, i have a different opinion.

Quality on the pitch is not everything,
atmosphere on the stands is also important.

If you look e.g. at St. Pauli in RL Nord you know,
what i mean. In football aspects they are
not classes better than Wehen or Hoffenheim,
but they bring more fans to away matches than
Wehen and Hoffenheim have at home matches.
That creates a total different atmosphere (i don´t
say, that the village teams have no atmosphere,
it´s also nice to watch such match, but serious,
matches at stadiums like Millerntor are something special).

And the Pauli support is also a reason for many
not real home team fans to watch the match vs. St.Pauli.

So, "tradition" makes a league definite more entertaiment.


In YOUR opinion! Not going through the argument again. It's all there.

[crzdcolombian]

hope u guys stay up because with Soto and Zidan up front the team seems really good. To bad Zidan only played half the season and Soto was out for a few months and came in during the 2nd half of the seaon because for a while u guys were in 10th place b4 Soto got knee operation. Good luck Saturday and hope u guys r still in 1st div next season cause if so Ill get a Soto shirt.. like ur design by lotto who also makes the Colombia NT shirt. Happy neither of us got the awful X-men Wolverine lookin shirt that Ukraine was forced to wear

[blazsovszkyc]

Good luck Saturday and hope u guys r still in 1st div next season cause if so Ill get a Soto shirt.. like ur design by lotto who also makes the Colombia NT shirt. Happy neither of us got the awful X-men Wolverine lookin shirt that Ukraine was forced to wear

One scenario to stay up would be:

FC Bayern – Mainz05 – 0-12
Wolfsburg – Bremen - 0-3 :rolleyes:

Of course can be the other way around Bremen to win 12-0 or something
So I think you won't get the Soto shirt

[footyfan1]

Looks like Mainz are going to fight to keep Zidan......


Mainz Manager Heidel: "We Will Fight To Keep Zidan" - In German At Kicker.de (http://www.kicker.de/fussball/bundesliga/startseite/artikel/365734/)

[todd11]

Looks like Mainz are going to fight to keep Zidan......


Mainz Manager Heidel: "We Will Fight To Keep Zidan" - In German At Kicker.de (http://www.kicker.de/fussball/bundesliga/startseite/artikel/365734/)


I saw that too! It kinda makes sense... he can still leave in Jan. if it looks like we have no hope of going up.

But, in any case, I'm trying not to get my hopes up, like I did last summer when it looked like Voronin was coming back. As a side note, a strike partnership of Amri and Niculae is just too dreadful to contemplate...

[footyfan1]

I saw that too! It kinda makes sense... he can still leave in Jan. if it looks like we have no hope of going up.

But, in any case, I'm trying not to get my hopes up, like I did last summer when it looked like Voronin was coming back. As a side note, a strike partnership of Amri and Niculae is just too dreadful to contemplate...


I don't think you have to contemplate that strike duo even if Zidan leaves...... :o

[Borussia]

One scenario to stay up would be:
FC Bayern – Mainz05 – 0-12
Wolfsburg – Bremen - 0-3 :rolleyes:


I think that result would make all Bayern fans happy :D ... and Mainz would make up BMG's Bundesliga record.

[soccer krazy]

Manuel Friedrich joins Bayer leverkusen
http://sports.yahoo.com/sow/news?slug=afp-fblgermainzleverkusen&prov=afp&type=lgns

[todd11]

Manuel Friedrich joins Bayer leverkusen
http://sports.yahoo.com/sow/news?slug=afp-fblgermainzleverkusen&prov=afp&type=lgns

Zidan has also agreed to terms with HSV. However, transfers fees still have to be finalized for both. Looks like the FSV will get around 7.5 mil euro in total for the two players. Still sux tho'---apparently whoever's jersey I buy gets sold! :o

[soccer krazy]

Zidan joins Hamburg
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/africa/6704735.stm