Tulsa officials visit with Hunt in Columbus-Notes & Quotes

[USRufnex]

Unfortunately, the Tulsa World will charge for access to the 2 articles I'm quoting from... both by Dave Sittler http://www.tulsaworld.com

In today's (Sun.) Tulsa World, Dave Sittler begins the column by stating:
If our city doesn't first build a soccer stadium, Major League Soccer won't come to Tulsa. Period. End of discussion.
That's the opinion of Lamar Hunt.

Quotes from Tulsa Mayor Bill LaFortune from 8/16 article:

"It was a powerful trip (to Columbus). I came away very excited because I believe it would be good for Tulsa and that Tulsa is the perfect city to take adavantage of this opportunity."

"There is a myriad of possibilities in terms of partnering with the private sector to get this done."

"We have focused on areas in and around the downtown area that would have access to our highways."

Quotes from Lamar Hunt in 8/18 Tulsa World column:

"We haven't talked to anybody about ownership. The way soccer needs to go is kind of an unusual situation. We nee to have the facility before we even try to get ownership... if we've learned one thing from the school of hard knocks, it's that large, non-soccer-specific stadiums are very, very difficult."

"There are a lot of cities interested. You can snap your fingers and there would be a list that would include Atlanta, Philadelphia and Seattle, but the greatest shortcoming of the league at this point is SSS."

"If I were a prospective owner in Tulsa, which I am not, I wouldn't try to get any (investors) interested without having a new stadium."

Hunt describes groups from other cities, particularly including smaller cities near Dallas and Ft. Worth: "...they are all sort of tire kickers. Your (Tulsa) group was much more formal. They had a serious look, and they represented what we took to be a genuine interest."

8/16 article confirmed the OKC/Edmond group's interest even if the Sittler can't seem to get the league's initials right-- "That group reportedly got involved after learning the MSL's (aaaarrgh!!!) expansion committee approached Tulsa last spring to gauge the city's interest."

Mayor LaFortune said city-owned land in the Brady District could be made available. "The mayor said the land option, coupled with private investors, could make plans or a $38 million stadium seating 22,000 to 25,000 a reality in time for the 2005 season."

More LaFortune: "I don't want to start with the premise that new tax dollars will be required. I want to start with the premise that through a combination of public and private creative financing that we can get the stadium built."

more quotes from LaFortune in 8/16 article: "There are people in the OKC area who are looking at this closely. We need to move quickly and decisively on this in the right direction."

"We don't want to get into a competitive bidding war with OKC but time is of the essence."


More Hunt: "Okla. City certainly would be considered. They have been progressive with their new arena and basebal stadium. But they aren't at the same level where Tulsa is from the interest standpoint."

"Personally, I think Tulsa can succeed if it has the right stadium. And from the standpoint of recognizing the need to build a SSS, Tulsa's at the forefront."

And a last word from Sittler: [i] Now there's a word you haven't heard attached to our city lately when Tulsa's compared to the progressive movers and shakers in OKC... will our city and it's residents say there (the forefront)? If we build a stadium first, we'll remain first.[/l]

LET THE RACE TO BUILD BEGIN!

[USRufnex]

From the Tulsa Roughnecks'1982 Media Guide:


With their first complete season behind them, Roughneck owners Michael Kimbrel, Carl Moore,Fred Williams and Rick Lowenherz are beginning to feel right at home in the fast paced world of professional soccer... when the four purchased the Roughnecks in October of 1980 they announced that their utual committment was to assure that Tulsa would retain its only major league sports franchise and their combined feelings on that remain unaltered. "There is no doubt that professional soccer will succeed in this country and when the day comes that the sport takes its destined place it is our singular goal that the Tulsa Roughnecks will be there."

A story from JMM's "ball boy" days...

[The Voice of Reason!]

for those of you whom are visual people such as myself.

http://www.southernphotography.com/tulsa.htm

http://www.southernphotography.com

yes I know this has nothing to do with soccer, but it entertained me

[chinaglia]

What's the weather like in Oklahoma during the summer months? I know it's hot but what about the potential for severe weather or even just rain? Would it be a good idea for a stadium to have a roof? Just some questions.

[benine]

ARTICLE EDITED BY MODERATOR. DO NOT POST COMPLETE ARTICLES ON THIS SITE, IT IS A COPYRIGHT VIOLATION AND A VIOLATION OF THIS SITE'S TERMS OF SERVICE.

[benine]

and booya, Rufnex, Brady district over Southieland.

[VioletCrown]

Originally posted by benine
"I don't want to start with the premise that new-tax dollars would be required," LaFortune said. "I want to start with the premise that through a combination of public and private creative financing that we can get the stadium built."

Kinda surprised with the way things are right now that anyone is using the term 'creative financing.'

[benine]

Originally posted by VioletCrown


Kinda surprised with the way things are right now that anyone is using the term 'creative financing.'

"Creative financing" in Tulsa budget planning means "least tax dollars possible and a minimal bond amount at that. LaFortune is probably lining up a private investor/investors to build the stadium and rent-to-own it back to the city. And call me Muhamed, because I saw this coming: LaFortune leads the push and theres no I/Os even mentioned. Classic Tulsa poli-economic situation.

[USRufnex]

Originally posted by benine
and booya, Rufnex, Brady district over Southieland.

and it's the holier-than-thou pompous attitude from Tulsa's pseudo-intellectual "my-sh!t-don't-stink" crowd like yourself that keep a number of fair-minded Tulsans from "Southieland" from lending their support to proposed downtown projects...

If the land's in the Brady district and the stadium is mostly funded by private sources, then a MAPS-type bond issue has a very good chance at passage as long as it includes other general projects for the city.

You realize that what you just did violates copyright which is why moderators require posting a link...

[USRufnex]

Originally posted by chinaglia
What's the weather like in Oklahoma during the summer months? I know it's hot but what about the potential for severe weather or even just rain? Would it be a good idea for a stadium to have a roof? Just some questions.

... about as hot as Dallas...

avg.July rainfall (taken from my Funk & Wagnalls Hammond World Atlas--Tulsa's not mentioned)...

Okla. City: 2.4 inches
Dallas: 1.9 "
Houston: 4.3 "
New York: 3.7 "
Boston: 2.9 "
Chicago: 3.4 "

avg. July temps:
Okla. City: 83
Dallas: 85
Houston: 83
New York: 77
Boston: 74
Chicago: 76

-- would mind a roof for some shade...

[USRufnex]

typo: wouldn't mind a roof for shade... severe weather is really pretty isolated in the summer... about the same frequency as the occasional "nor'east-ah" as my friends in Boston would say...

[benine]

Originally posted by USRufnex


and it's the holier-than-thou pompous attitude from Tulsa's pseudo-intellectual "my-sh!t-don't-stink" crowd like yourself that keep a number of fair-minded Tulsans from "Southieland" from lending their support to proposed downtown projects...

If the land's in the Brady district and the stadium is mostly funded by private sources, then a MAPS-type bond issue has a very good chance at passage as long as it includes other general projects for the city.

You realize that what you just did violates copyright which is why moderators require posting a link...


Ah, how funny to try and say we're the ones with the stereotype problems when you also said that "11th street is good for nothing but getting a hooker" and calling north tulsa "little compton"...glass houses, ace. At least our sh!t has culture rather than materialism, faceless housing, and enviroment shredding over dependency on the auto.

Re: the stadium, LaFortune is smart in his picking of words and strategy. He'll have this thing 80% private funded or privately bonded before he even thinks of going to a public plan like MAPS; that type of system may not work in Tulsa and he may opt for a "if you build it" philosophy of urban revitalization, offering tax corridors, property vouchers, etc...

and if BS hears anything from the World about my link (doubt it, since the only people on staff that know what soccer is are all in distribution, who are the anti-producation mofos of the world), then they can send any copywrite complaints direct to me...i'll take it back to some 1930s type dirt if they want...what the IRS could know about that company, man alive...oh, but our mods are too ********** anyway.

[kebzach]

Originally posted by benine

and if BS hears anything from the World about my link (doubt it, since the only people on staff that know what soccer is are all in distribution, who are the anti-producation mofos of the world), then they can send any copywrite complaints direct to me...i'll take it back to some 1930s type dirt if they want...what the IRS could know about that company, man alive...oh, but our mods are too ********** anyway.

yeah, silly us and silly copyright rules.

you don't like it, don't post here. you're in someone's house here (Huss's). follow his rules.

[benine]

http://www.southernphotography.com/images/tu-007.jpg

FYI: The area known as the Brady district, being looked at for the stadium, is to the right and behind the BOK building in this picture(tallest, one in the back/north of d.t.) and is right in/near downtown. Also, yes, the BOK building was designed by the same dood who did the WTC and is exactly half the size of the o.g. buildings and has the same fixtures, architecture and facade...my office window at city hall faced this building and became damned unnerving to look at for 9 hours a day.

This picture is looking North, towards "little compton"...doesnt it look so dangerous? ha...

[benine]

Originally posted by kebzach


yeah, silly us and silly copyright rules.

you don't like it, don't post here. you're in someone's house here (Huss's). follow his rules.

give me a "baaaah", little lamb.

also had to quip that it's very odd that people can buy their way out of copywrite infringment on this board (avatar images, ace)

[kebzach]

Originally posted by benine

give me a "baaaah", little lamb.

big words coming from you. did the babysitter help type all that?

Originally posted by benine

also had to quip that it's very odd that people can buy their way out of copywrite infringment on this board (avatar images, ace)

help@bigsoccer.com

ask for Jesse.

[benine]

Originally posted by Mike Segroves


Those images are edited beyond 50%, the copyright standard, your article was not.

wrong. intellectual property laws protects image rights on the www. best explained thusly:
Many people don't realize just how all-encompassing a copyright is. For example, there's a common misconception that any image appearing on a website may be downloaded and "saved" to disk. This is absolutely not the case. The very act of saving a copyrighted image to your local disk -- regardless of whether you ever do anything else with the image or not -- constitutes a copyright infringement -- minor, perhaps, and done all the time, but an infringement nonetheless. And infringements large and small are "actionable" (i.e., can be grounds for a lawsuit.) Furthermore, if any of the 50% is a watermark, better think about this: The Digital Millennium Copyright Act of 1998 makes it a criminal offense to remove watermarks meant to protect copyright. Many people don't realize that under US copyright law, it is specifically illegal to remove a watermark from a photo. Not only is the act of removal prohibited, the courts assume that the very attempt indicates a willful intent to violate somebody's copyright. And that's something the courts come down really hard on.


So, BS's copywrite rules are rather bs.

[benine]

Originally posted by Mike Segroves


That's funny. You'd think that since BigSoccer's copyright policy was approved by their attorneys, they'd know what they were talking about.

Are you a copyright attorney or do you just pretend to be one on the internet.


hahaha...once again, Mikey proves that he cant read. Fair Use doesnt apply to images, man, images are intellectual property which means that its up to BS to prove that no-one else owns any image displayed in a nonbuisness nature on this site. Do you have to have an attorney explain every inkling of the law for you to understand that? Huss's own posting of the "fair use" clause and its subsequent listing of how it applies to BS opens up an entire ethical debate on the exploitation of the members of BS and the legittamcy of the "privacy policy" supposedly inacted by this site, so I'd really doubt that any legit, full copyright attorney has ever been attached to BS.
Basically, if you're going to break one copyright law, why not break them all?

[chinaglia]

OK, right. Can you all explain to me how this little "legal debate" pertains to the possible MLS expansion team in Tulsa and/or Oklahoma City? Please, I'm asking you.

[USRufnex]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by benine



Ah, how funny to try and say we're the ones with the stereotype problems when you also said that "11th street is good for nothing but getting a hooker" and calling north tulsa "little compton"...glass houses, ace.


Listen, self-proclaimed Muhammad... I don't live in a glass house. Let me introduce you to the author of those posts: Mike Segroves. He lives in Norman. Ask him if he lives in one.


At least our sh!t has culture rather than materialism, faceless housing, and enviroment shredding over dependency on the auto.


Faceless housing? Ever been to OKC, sonny? Try Heritage Hills, Mesta Park... and the Paseo area have those art galleries you like to rave about.


Re: the stadium, LaFortune is smart in his picking of words and strategy. He'll have this thing 80% private funded or privately bonded before he even thinks of going to a public plan like MAPS; that type of system may not work in Tulsa and he may opt for a "if you build it" philosophy of urban revitalization, offering tax corridors, property vouchers, etc...


Enter "Brad & Raechel"-- REAL Tulsans with their arms stretched out for government $$$...