Dudek ... LFC for life

[JRedknapp11]

As much as like the Polish keeper... I think there are better suitors out there. Keep him here for his contract and then see what the transfer market has. I'd really like to see Kirkland get his chances as well or even poor old Peggy.
http://www.planetfootball.com/article.asp?id=103841&clid=&cpid=&Title=Dudek+wants+to+stay+for+life

[655321]

I'm not doubting the abilities of Arphexad or Kirkland...but I think Dudek is the obvious first choice. He's a fantastic keeper that has been nothing but greatness for Liverpool. What reason could you possibly have for starting Peggy over Jersey??

[JRedknapp11]

Don't get me wrong...Dudek is fantastic. He has more then proved his worth for us and his skills have been world class well before his Anfield arrival.

However, I don't think we should jump the gun and sign him for any longer then 2003/04. Kirkland should be used a little more then last year...hopefully as a cup goalie for the FA or League Cup. Peggy is just Peggy and as much as I respect the lad for sitting on his hands for this long, I think we should at the very least loan him out. Reserve matches aren't going to cut it, at least one of those guys needs to be playing in a real atmosphere for awhile... ya know keep them warm and ready.

Dudek is our man and I have no problems for now with him. I just think that we should keep Dudek for his contract that he has signed and then when it's up see who is available to possibly over take Dudek. Right now Dudek is #1 and has no competition in sight, at least with Gerard waiting awhile to sign an extension Dudek has some sort of motivation sitting above him.

Again quality keeper but we just need to keep all of our options open.... who knows maybe Grobbler will make yet another comeback.

[655321]

Yea, Peggy should definitely be loaned out. I can't see a chance in hell that he'll play in any competition this year, bar a flu virus going around. He obviously has skills, but I just can't think about him without thinking about that near goal against Stoke City in the FA Cup in the treble season when he almost whiffed a clearance.

[Matt Clark]

Arphexad was loaned out to Stockport last season, but now that both Jorgen Nielsen and Sander Westerveld are no longer about, we need three keepers. The problem with loaning out your third choice is that you would have to add a recall clause to his loan deal - but a club (like, for instance, Stockport) is not going to take a player on Premiership wages on loan if they run the risk of losing him at the drop of a hat - bearing in mind that any such deal would be with the aim of playing him as first choice, regularly. Last season Dudek and Kirkland both got injured and he was in, so we can’t run the risk of a non-recall loan deal.

Clubs have three keepers. Two spend most of their time on the bench. Twas ever thus. Although now, of course, we have that young Italian lad as well, so maybe he will be the one to go out on loan.

As to not signing Dudek on again, that makes no sense. If we just let his contract run down, what’s to stop him from leaving at any point? These days, a renewed contract is little more than a re-affirmation of the present one. It doesn’t mean they actually extend their time at the club per se (although that may well be how it turns out). As things stand, we have one of the best keepers in the world signed up - protecting that asset is just good sense. We need to do that with all our top players - GH has the stated policy of making every player with 2 years or less on their contracts either sign on again or ship out. A prudent measure, these days.

[LiverpoolFanatic]

Dudek has 12 clean sheets in his last 15 matches. I'd say that's reason enough to sign him long term.

[Lanky134]

I was at the two matches Kirkland played last year (Galatasaray and Everton) and, while Kirkland made a few good saves (mostly during the Galatasaray match) I don't think he's ready to challenge Jerzy yet. He was very hesitant about distribution, which is a very underrated aspect of goalkeeping. About four or five times he stepped up to punt or throw the ball, only to stop and think about what he was about to do. I also usually worry about big keepers (6'3 and over) because they're usually vulnerable on low shots to the near post. Think of how many times Sander got beat there.

Dave

[JRedknapp11]

I know we can knock Sander for those easy one's but for my money I would rather have him in net then Dudek.

[Matt Clark]

Blimey ...

This must feel like I am victimising you (three posts, three disagreeing posts in return ... sorry! :) ) but how on earth can you say that? Jerzy Dudek is one of the very top keepers in the world. The very top. Sander Westerveld was only marginally better than James, when all is said and done - he just didn't have the baggage that five years playing behind Babb and Co lumbered Jamo with. Sandra made a similar number of howlers on average, he was as immobile as James when confronted with shots he's not sure about saving and his positioning was worse than Friedel's, which is saying quite something.

When he arrived, his professional attitude and clean slate made him appear a better option than James and, on balance and for those reasons, he probably was. But Dudek is another mighty step forward in that progressive evolution of talent. He is ten times better than Sander Westerveld will EVER be.

[kopiteinkc]

Originally posted by JRedknapp11
I know we can knock Sander for those easy one's but for my money I would rather have him in net then Dudek.

Did you see the Bolton match last year? Sander? No thanks!

Dudek may have had a poor world cup but his play for the Reds has been exemplary. I admit he could do better on some crosses, a little too quick to punch. But he doesn't commit major mistakes like Sander did.

I think I would trust GH's judgement on this one.

[655321]

Yea, sorry Redders, but I gotta go with Matt and Kopite on this one. It's nice to go back and think about Sander being the number one during the treble season and the great job he did, but there's no denying that Jersey is a much better all-around keeper.

[scouseratheart]

Sander was a great shot-stopper, but if that was the only part of being a goalkeeper, then Fabien Barthez would be an all-time great...Westerweld was pretty shaky at times, especially when it came to coming off his line to deal with crosses (UEFA Final anybody?) the defense never looked quite comfortable in front of him...in the four or five years i have been following LFC, Dudek is far and away the best goalkeeper we have had...

[JRedknapp11]

I knew I would ruffle some feathers with that one.

I think from a total perspective you guys are right, Dudek is the better keeper.

I think that Sander has the better mobility. No one is better defending his goal in a dead ball situation then Sander, IMO. Dudek does better with the arrial challenges and since this is the EPL, the air to ground game is very important.


However.. even though we won 5 Cups with Sander, I think Dudek has had the better defense in front of him. To me it seems like the LFC team of 2001/02 was a different team all together then our current LFC roster. I know the squad hasn't changed all that much, but there is a different feel to us this year. More of a buisness attitude...which is a good thing, I think that will be our crutch to winning the EPL.

My buddy is a Pole and he's always giving me grief on how a Pole is carrying my LFC...so that's where my biased view comes in.

.... Also on a side note didn't we sign some French U-21 keeper not too long ago from Nantes or Lille ? I thought we were carrying four keepers. Jerzy, Peggy, Chris and Mr. frog ?

[655321]

Tell your boy it's a Pole and a Finn.

[Lanky134]

It would be two Finn's if GH would just play the other...

Dave

[Lanky134]

Sander is very mobile but too often he relied on his athleticism instead of being a better positional keeper (another problem I tend to have with big keepers). Notice how many balls seem to be hit directly at Dudek. It's because he's always in the right spot.

Sander was very much the right man at the right time. He came into a situation where he wasn't haunted by the Ghost of Defenses Past, and was a major part of the success of 2000-01. His performance in the penalty shootout against Birmingham was the start of that great run we had (who would've thought somebody would ever say that about a Dutchman?) and he came up big in plenty of other games. But too many soft goals meant that he had lost GH's confidence - and it wasn't just Bolton, either. Remember when he flapped it into his own net against Chelsea, not to mention the Don Hutchinson incident in the derby?

Still, I wish him the best at Sociedad and hope that he gets his spot back on the national team. He remains my girlfriend's favorite ever Red.

Dave

[Matt Clark]

That's the thing - his mobility WASN'T that great. How many goals did you see him concede where you found yourself thinking "Why didn't you at least try and get to it, Sander?". I lost count of the number of times, it was an almost permanent sight - whenever we copped a goal, Sander would be stood there, looking behind him in a nonplussed, "bugger me, it went in" kind of a way.

As I said previously, his positioning was the real problem, but it's not even as though he made all that much of an effort to recover. Sure, he was a decent shot-stopper on those occasions when the ball was hit more or less directly at him, but as has been observed by another poster, the thing with Dudek is that he makes it his business to ensure that as many shots as possible end up being directly at him. That's good goalkeeping.

Sander is deficient to Dudek - by a large margin - in every aspect of goalkeeping.

[LiverpoolFanatic]

Originally posted by Matt Clark
Sander is deficient to Dudek - by a large margin - in every aspect of goalkeeping.


True. It's a natural progression at LFC. Houllier has used the players available to him and then consistently purchased new, better players. The man knows football, and can really pick the gems most of the time.