Manchester United Goalscorers and Assisters 08/09 [R]

[billyireland]

Pfff....You have no idea. Nothing like International Futebol. My grandma cries when we lose, cries....The country takes off work for the WC and Euro.
Canada takes work off for football tournaments?

[Sapphire]

Wasnt Rooney's goal a Berbatov's assist ?
And Berbatovs one Nani's ?
I'd definitely give the Berbatov goal assist to Nani (although it did take a deflection off a defender).

[dannytoone]

I'd definitely give the Berbatov goal assist to Nani (although it did take a deflection off a defender).
I looked at the goal over and over again, and I didn't see any deflections, just a bounce. Who did it hit?

[Dark Savante]

Wasnt Rooney's goal a Berbatov's assist ?
And Berbatovs one Nani's ?

Both no's.

Rooney did most all the work for his goal on his own, including beating a man to make room for the shot and took several touches along the way.

Nani's deflection was put into Berbatov's path by the defender.

[GrodZilla]

Both no's.

Rooney did most all the work for his goal on his own, including beating a man to make room for the shot and took several touches along the way.

Nani's deflection was put into Berbatov's path by the defender.

Hard... as always ;)

[benni...]

Damn Ds, forgot about the tough standards.

[SyedZada]

Both no's.

Rooney did most all the work for his goal on his own, including beating a man to make room for the shot and took several touches along the way.

Nani's deflection was put into Berbatov's path by the defender.
Pretty high standard , but does that mean most of the long 40 yards passes dont count as a assist as a striker does have to do quite alot rather then just putting it in like Rooney goal against Bolton of a Carrick long pass.

2ndly if a deflected goal counts so should a deflected assist , specially if you consider for eg a shot on target which is poorly taken and turns out to be a pass for the goal something like that counts as a assists ,meaning unintentional assists if unintentional goals counts so should the assists.

[Dark Savante]

http://www.bigsoccer.com/forum/showthread.php?t=603538

The first few posts in that thread should clear this up for ya in one fell swoop.

[Vermont Red]

Just to show where my head is at, shortly after Rooney's goal I guessed that there would be some on here that would want to credit Berbatov with an assist. (It goes without saying that I felt that Berbatov didn't deserve an assist and assumed that DS would view things the same way.)

[johno]

I guess its just a couple different ways to view assists. I do feel that maybe we should note this kind of assist. Though, it is worth something. Perhaps half an assist if the goalscorer has to beat just 1 man or has some (but nothing more than 5 or 6 strides) dribbling to do before he shoots.

I understand where DS is coming from - that type of assist recording makes the assist almost worth as much as the goal. The problem I have with that is that we credit Nani with a goal when all he did was make a run and stick a boot out at the end of a counter.

I think it would be interesting if someone would like to, to have a different assist chart. 2 points for the assist that makes the goal and 1 point for the pass that leads to the goal if you see what I'm saying.

[Vermont Red]

Hey Johno, I have an idea. What about a thread in which we describe each goal in a short one or two sentence fashion? While this would have statistics it would provide some insight into how each goal came about. What say you?

[urbnzy]

Question is will you count assists like in NBA (like now) or NHL (someone gets an assist and it doesn't matter if the goalscorer got himself into a position to score. But of course there would be only one player with an assist, not two.

[Dark Savante]

Just to clear something up that was already put to bed in the last thread:

As stated in the opener, direct assists are what are credited.

Anything that is played forward inside the oppo half that is clearly speculative and not certifiably intentional with regard to an immediate one or two touch finish (unless a deep play in from deep straight down the middle of the pitch) falls outside of a direct assist.

We don't want bogus, inflated statistics that are contrived and, ultimately, false.

The secondary assist and such opens up a whole can of worms that aren't suitable for a thread that's meant to be as definitive as I feel I can make it. But if people want to make a thread for that stuff they can go right ahead, as long as they maintain the upkeep of it for the season, I'm sure it would be of some use to people looking for that kind of info.

[johno]

DS, do you see the value of the distinction I was making? Look at the assist for Nani's goal. Was that pass soo much better than the pass Berbatov played to hit Rooney? I'd say that Rooney's ball accross to Nani was pretty much straight forward and that while Rooney deserves credit for his assist, I would find it strange that Berbatov got no credit what so ever at say season's end and he has 5 direct assists, but also quite a few passes that led to a goal. Again, I'm not that bothered by it because I'm watching the games and I'll judge a player's worth by their overall contribution, I just thought that as long as we're going to go in depth on the stats, that might be a way to quantify things differently.

[SyedZada]

For the record I wasnt trying to be controversial , just asking you can say.

[Vermont Red]

This same topic has been discussed previously. It's DS's thread, DS's rules. (That he happens to be correct is beside the point.)

[J'can]

This same topic has been discussed previously. It's DS's thread, DS's rules. (That he happens to be correct is beside the point.)

Or start your own thread but you still have to use DS' rules........... :D

[Vermont Red]

Or start your own thread but you still have to use DS' rules........... :D

It's his world, we're all just defecating in it.

[JC7rox]

Manchester United Goalscorers and Assisters 08/09


Goals


League


Rooney - 3 - Bolton Wonderers(H); Blackburn Rovers(A); West Bromwich Albion(H)

Ronaldo - 2 - Bolton Wonderers[pk](H); West Bromwich Albion(H)

Berbatov - 1 - West Bromwich Albion(H)

Brown - 1 - Blackburn Rovers(A)

Fletcher - 1 - Newcastle United(H)

Nani - 1 - West Bromwich Albion(H)

OG - 1 - Portsmouth(A)

Park - 1 - Chelsea(A)

Tevez - 1 - Liverpool(A)


Fa Cup


League Cup

Giggs - 1 - Middlesbrough(H)

Nani - 1 - Middlesbrough(H)

Ronaldo - 1 - Middlesbrough(H)


Super Cup

Vidic - 1 - Zenit Saint Petersburg


World Club Championship


Champions League

Berbatov - 2 - Aalborg(A)

Rooney - 1 - Aalborg(A)



Total

Rooney - 4

Berbatov - 3

Ronaldo - 3

Nani - 2

Brown - 1

Fletcher - 1

Giggs - 1

OG - 1

Park - 1

Tevez - 1

Vidic - 1


Direct Assists (last direct pass before conversion)



League


Rooney - 3 - Blackburn Rovers(A); West Bromwich Albionx2(H)

Ronaldo - 2 - Bolton Wonderers(H); Blackburn Rovers(A)

Berbatov - 1 - Liverpool(A)

Giggs - 1 - Newcastle United(H)


Fa Cup


League Cup


Giggs - 1 - Middlesbrough(H)


Super Cup

Tevez - 1 - Zenit Saint Petersburg


World Club Championship


Champions League

Giggs - 1 - Aalborg(A)

Ronaldo - 1 - Aalborg(A)


Total


Giggs - 3

Ronaldo - 3

Rooney - 3

Berbatov - 1

Tevez - 1

Edit after West Bromwich Albion(H) 18 October.

I think I'll defecate the updated chart here for those of you who don't want to visit page one.

[Dark Savante]

Between our two top scorers there hasn't been a single finish outside of the right foot.