Die Knappen! Schalke 04 08/09 thread [R]

[hackespitze123]

It is Sportbild, but they do raise some valid points:

http://www.sportbild.de//de/sportbild/generated/article/fussball/2009/03/04/11882200000.html

I'd sack them both. Müller, because he is inept. And Rutten, because he doesn't fit into a club like Schalke, too quiet and thoughtful. And let's face it, tactically, he has not exactly set the world alight either, stubbornly sticking to the 4-3-3 system despite not having the players for it, as discussed earlier in this thread already.

Yes, Schalke do need stability, but it has to be the right people.

[Rainer24]

Well, nothing is going to served by sacking the coach mid-season. I don't thin Europe is happening either way, so no point in it if you ask me. I'd can Müller, bring in someone who is actually willing to work with a coach rather than force overrated babies down his throat, and then see what happens.

[hackespitze123]

But it was Rutten who wanted Farfan and Engelaar, for example, and Müller fulfilled those wishes, paying good money (Schalke were the second highest net spenders in the league last summer). Just blaming Müller is a bit too simple, especially if you consider the fact that Slomka was considerably more successful with a squad that was as bad as the current one, if not even weaker, as discussed earlier (http://www.bigsoccer.com/forum/showthread.php?p=16529133#post16529133).

[Equilibrium]

But it was Rutten who wanted Farfan and Engelaar, for example, and Müller fulfilled those wishes, paying good money (Schalke were the second highest net spenders in the league last summer). Just blaming Müller is a bit too simple, especially if you consider the fact that Slomka was considerably more successful with a squad that was as bad as the current one, if not even weaker, as discussed earlier (http://www.bigsoccer.com/forum/showthread.php?p=16529133#post16529133).
Exactly, I'm not one to fire mid-season, but I would send both of them home and get people that can get the job done.

[Rainer24]

But it was Rutten who wanted Farfan and Engelaar, for example, and Müller fulfilled those wishes, paying good money (Schalke were the second highest net spenders in the league last summer). Just blaming Müller is a bit too simple, especially if you consider the fact that Slomka was considerably more successful with a squad that was as bad as the current one, if not even weaker, as discussed earlier (http://www.bigsoccer.com/forum/showthread.php?p=16529133#post16529133).


Yes, and it take time to build a team. If you fire the coach, you are just going to have to start over again. I'm not arguing that Rutten is better than Slomka, as I don't think that is true, but firing Rutten doesn't un-fire Slomka. You have to draw the line somewhere and see what waiting gets you. They have had NINE coaches since since they canned Stevens. That is ridiculous. Fine, give Müller more time too, but firing the coach all the time is certainly not getting them anywhere.

[hackespitze123]

Müller more time? No, really, no. Like I said, stability is fine, but what use is stability if you have the wrong guys at the helm? You can be a very stable mid-table club, but that simply can't be the ambition of such a big and rich club like Schalke.

Let us agree on disagreeing then.

[Rainer24]

Müller more time? No, really, no. Like I said, stability is fine, but what use is stability if you have the wrong guys at the helm? You can be a very stable mid-table club, but that simply can't be the ambition of such a big and rich club like Schalke.

Let us agree on disagreeing then.



Fine, I misunderstood. For some reason, I thought you were advocating for keeping Müller. As I originally posted, I think he is the one that really needs the heave-ho.

My point is that Schalke may have been a bit too ambitious. They have all the money, have spent some, but have never got it done, and if you want to look at what they have done on a consistent basis, it's firing the coach.

[hackespitze123]

Müller: "I will never resign."

http://www.sport1.de/de/fussball/fussball_bundesliga/artikel_76220.html


For the sake of Schalke 04, you better hope that someone else will relieve him of that decision.

[Equilibrium]

He doesn't have to resign, he just has to be fired.

[checkmate]

Is this Muller that Andreas Muller? 1997 Champions League winner with Dortmund?

[Cris 09]

Is this Muller that Andreas Muller? 1997 Champions League winner with Dortmund?

No...that is Andreas Möller or Moeller.
http://cache.gettyimages.com/xc/1632153.jpg?v=1&c=ViewImages&k=2&d=17A4AD9FDB9CF19390335F8FA9CA92A693255400F436D3F89930FDCFC4C15FBB

Damn...I miss those kits!!!

[hackespitze123]

Brilliant team goal against Köln yesterday, one of the most beautiful of the season, has to be said.

Jones 1-0:

http://videos.sapo.pt/5rbtPTLJ3GoaUOZJi2ya

[hackespitze123]

Müller finally got sacked:

http://www.spiegel.de/sport/fussball/0,1518,612182,00.html

Good news for Schalke I think, no successor announced yet.

[F96]

I feel kinda bad for him.
He got "potentially" great (or good) players in Farfan, Engelaar, Kenia, Jones and Sanchez and a good coach.

The team as a whole should play much better than they are doing right now, don't really know if he is to blame.

[humin12]

Didn't he also get Rakitic?

["Eisenfuß" Eilts]

I feel kinda bad for him.
He got "potentially" great (or good) players in Farfan, Engelaar, Kenia, Jones and Sanchez and a good coach.

The team as a whole should play much better than they are doing right now, don't really know if he is to blame.

Some of the players don´t fit (as well as at us) in the system.
I am not even sure, if Rutten has currently a clear system.

He came with the idea to let Schalke play active offensive football.
But the squad is full of defensive midfielders, defenders and counter
strikers.

If you want to see offensive football, you must get the players for it.
And that´s a thing where Müller must be critisized for. The whole thing
doesn´t work - the squad doesn´t fit to the demanded (by the fans) kind of football.

Didn't he also get Rakitic?

Yes, Rakitic was also signed by Müller. He is a great talent, but
his favorite position is the playmaker one. The problem is, that
this position doesn´t exits in Schalkes system, so he had to play
most of the time as a outside forward/support striker.

---
Different newspapers connect Kevin Kuranyi with Lokomotive Moscow.
There the transfer window is still open, so the Schalke fans could get rid
of another hated person.

[Borussia]

Müller finally got sacked:

http://www.spiegel.de/sport/fussball/0,1518,612182,00.html

Good news for Schalke I think

Well, let's wait up. My impression is that the Schalke board is totally incompetent...

I'm curious how long Fred Rutten will stay.

[Homa]

Actually Schalke's counter suck huge since Lincoln left. Their sucktitude is one big reason why Schalke has such a bad season. They regularly score the first goal but seem never be able to finish off the opponent and so often times receive the equalizer in the last 10-15Mins.

The main criticism regarding Müller is the offensive midfield or rather the seemingly complete lack of one. At least in my opinion he did try several times to improve this (and the lack of wingers), but didn't succeed.
In the end the teams does not have outstanding offensive players and so often times struggles to create chances and to score (not helped by the forwards' fantastic ability to waste high class chances)

Schalke played bad football last year and pretty much nothing improved since Rutten took over. Englaar has a downright disgusting season so far and Rutten's trust in him combined with weird subs and extremly defensive starting midfields put Rutten on risk to get booted (at least in the fans' opinion). Its not necessarily all his fault, but Schalke is not a very patient club.

["Eisenfuß" Eilts]

Well, let's wait up. My impression is that the Schalke board is totally incompetent...

Currently they are looking for a new manager.
Let´s see how fast they find a masochistic bastard.

I'm curious how long Fred Rutten will stay.

Me, too. I think Rutten is a good coach, but he doesn´t fit to Schalkes
club mentality. I think only people from the region or guys with worker
mentality are respected there.

[BongartzUndRivera]

I think our CL Quaterfinal experience had gotten our management too ambitous thinking they could either get only better with a coach from outside, and have underrated Slomka's work.

We should've kept Slomka, but as a replacement over the Summer Rutten and the addition of Engelaar was good at first. Never thought that Bundesliga or Die Knappen could be too big for them.

The other thing that has bothered me in the recent years was that too many of our own grown & once bought in young talents were not kept even at the Slomka era (who was the youth coach before). It wasn't that we were bullied by tons of money or forced to sell to Bayern...

A clubs worst nightmare is to invest too much for CL and not making the 2nd round and flunk at the early stage of UEFA Cup in the second round plus getting their butts kicked at their own Cup (DFB Pokal) which we have all faced this season.

More could come by noty making the UEFA Cup slot........anyway with a 'better' expectation there was this season and therefore can't quiet figure out othere than typically sack the coach or management......I am sure Rutten could turn out to become a great coach in the future, but as for us, if he could not find a formation or system that would fit our players when 2/3 of the league match has played? I find it very tough for him to be back.

Anyway, I would like to thank all the non Schalker at this forum who has kept posting and keeping our forum alive and all other fellow Schalker post more often again.

Steht auf, wenn ihr Schalker seid!!!