Whitecaps Waterfront Stadium thread

[mlssoccer]

With talk of an MLS franchise in Vancouver, hopefully the Whitecaps Waterfront Stadium concept will be revived

Here's a thread with websites pledging support for the Whitecaps Waterfront Stadium (feel free to sticky this mods):

3 Biggies:
1) http://www.whitecapsfc.com/stadium/waterfront
2) http://www.stadiumnow.org or http://stadiumnow.newsvine.com
3) http://friendsofsoccer.com or http://friendsofsoccer.blogspot.com

Others:
4) http://vancouver.ca/commsvcs/currentplanning/whitecaps/index.htm
5) http://wordpress.com/tag/whitecaps-waterfront-stadium/

Feel free to add more sites as they come along.

[Whymark 79]

Just an FYI:

The Waterfront stadium issue doesn't need revival, because it's not officially dead. There's merely an impasse in negotiations, which are still on-going, only this time not in the public.

The MLS bid will add increased pressure to the Port Authority and Feds.

[Durian Durian]

I think the slow down 100% had to do with government plans in mind for BC Place. Waiting for it to not look cool anymore is what anyone who wants the Waterfront park to happen, and likely it will be in another location (wherever the urban planners think is good) in the end of it.

The biggest reason I'm mixed on the whole thing is, I fear Whitecaps games turning into Canucks games with tickets out of reach and a lame crowd. Knowing theres always those extra seats and loads of cheap seats, you'll always have a vibrant crowd as I consider the atmosphere at a BC Lions game (especially playoff games) 100% more exciting than any Canucks game full of deep pockets there on a networking occasion with an out of towner.

[atx777]

It's been a long time since anyone has touched this issue, so let's see if anyone can provide us with any information.

Is there any sense in Vancouver that the waterfront stadium deal will ever get done? Is so, how long would the (hopefully) Whitecaps play in BC Place?

[carnifex2005]

It's been a long time since anyone has touched this issue, so let's see if anyone can provide us with any information.

Is there any sense in Vancouver that the waterfront stadium deal will ever get done? Is so, how long would the (hopefully) Whitecaps play in BC Place?

The Whitecaps are playing in BC Place until at least 2016. They signed a 5 year lease as part of the conditions for the "SSS" configuration BC Place Corp built for them. The Whitecaps are still saying that is their goal to build the Waterfront stadium and the owner of the Caps still owns the land he wants to build the stadium on. It is just that the Port Authority (Federal Government) doesn't want to do a land swap to give Greg Kerfoot the land and negotiations are still ongoing.

[evangel]

The Whitecaps are playing in BC Place until at least 2016. They signed a 5 year lease as part of the conditions for the "SSS" configuration BC Place Corp built for them. The Whitecaps are still saying that is their goal to build the Waterfront stadium and the owner of the Caps still owns the land he wants to build the stadium on. It is just that the Port Authority (Federal Government) doesn't want to do a land swap to give Greg Kerfoot the land and negotiations are still ongoing.

No one has managed to find out if the Whitecaps have are able to buy out the rest of the contract if the Waterfront stadium is completed before the six years are up. I can imagine that Kerfoot would prefer to do such a thing if possible.

[JohnnyRanger]

No one has managed to find out if the Whitecaps have are able to buy out the rest of the contract if the Waterfront stadium is completed before the six years are up. I can imagine that Kerfoot would prefer to do such a thing if possible.
It's a moot point. the deal cannot be done in 1 year, then the land would have to be prepared, infrastructure (roads etc) periphery work done, and actually construct the stadium, which is to be built half on piles driven into the ocean...

It is irrelevant if/when Kerfoot and WFC could buy the lease out.

[sportie1]

IMO -- it won't happen for a long time-- think 2016 at the earliest-- and will vancouver and kerfoot be willing to let the land just sit there?-- somehow i think the land will have to be developed before then, and a stadium on that site will not happen-- the team and the city want to see how the mls caps make out in BC Place stadium-- having an intimate, soccer-friendly stadium with a retractable roof and a seating capacity that can be altered from 20 000 to over 60 000 is hard to leave behind-- and it cost the caps ownership NOTHING!!! kerfoot, being a smart business guy, can stay at a modern facility and make money by taking/facilitating on BIG games, and redevelop his waterfront land for condos/social housing, and public access with lots of amenities-- i wonder what exactly is in the lease with the BC government about revenue-sharing with the caps-- i think there may be plenty of opportunities for the caps to make $$$$ at bc place without owning the facility-- think MLS all-star game, CONCACAF games, WWC 2015, international friendlies, etc-- if a stadium is ever built, then i think false creek flats makes a lot more sense than a waterfront site

[Blue and White Army]

Look at the location of this stadium in Wellington, New Zealand:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cake_tin

Now that is a kick in the bollocks to every soccer fan in Vancouver!

[Johnnie Monster]

Now that is a kick in the bollocks to every soccer fan in Vancouver!

That is indeed brutal!

[Johnnie Monster]

[QUOTE=sportie1;17703515]IMO -- it won't happen for a long time-- think 2016 at the earliest-- and will vancouver and kerfoot be willing to let the land just sit there?-- somehow i think the land will have to be developed before then, and a stadium on that site will not happen-- /QUOTE]

Don't forget what has transpired so far though.

Kerfoot has land, but he's been told he *can't* put a stadium on it.

His only option is to negotiate a swap with the Port Authority... which means he won't be building anything on it anytime soon. Land with condo towers on it is of no value to the Port.

Besides, Kerfoot's land IS developed. It's a fully operational railway storage yard, and he's presently collecting megabucks in rent cheques from the rail companies who are using it.

[sportie1]

if you think the bc government has spent $ 350 mill, mainly for the purposes of needed renos and for soccer-- in particular the mls-bound whitecaps-- and then have the caps walk away in a few years after entering mls-- THINK AGAIN!! THE WATERFRONT STADIUM-- IF IT IS EVER BUILT, WON'T HAPPEN UNTIL 2016 AT THE EARLIEST-- and by then kerfoot, IMO, will have developed the waterfront site with condos, etc-- much more $$$$$$$$ to be made doing that
why has kerfoot been sooooo patient for over 5 years with his proposed waterfront stadium?? he got a high-quality, totally renovated, intimate soccer facility with a retractable roof-- and his desire to have an mls franchise-- and it cost him NOTHING!!!! except the franchise fee-- NOW THAT'S A GOOD DEAL-- his patience has been rewarded ;) he may even have some potential for revenue-sharing in the lease agreement with the government, something i am sure will be kept private as long as possible

[Blue and White Army]

And here's what will be built in Auckland for the 2011 Rugby World Cup:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/5/5e/Stadiumnz1.jpg

Perhaps Vancouver needs to consider becoming a part of New Zealand.

[WhiteCapArmy]

And here's what will be built in Auckland for the 2011 Rugby World Cup:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/5/5e/Stadiumnz1.jpg

Perhaps Vancouver needs to consider becoming a part of New Zealand.
they do like their stadiums in the port eh. lol

[Johnnie Monster]

if you think the bc government has spent $ 350 mill, mainly for the purposes of needed renos and for soccer-- in particular the mls-bound whitecaps-- and then have the caps walk away in a few years after entering mls-- THINK AGAIN!! THE WATERFRONT STADIUM-- IF IT IS EVER BUILT, WON'T HAPPEN UNTIL 2016 AT THE EARLIEST--

Ok to correct you on a few points:

The renos are not being done with soccer being the primary focus. Soccer is a lucky afterthought.

The gov't is spending the money because it's a 25 year old facility that is in use 200+ calendar days per year. The Lions and Whitecaps only make up a small fraction of the days it is used. The building needs an update to attract new events and clientele.

Sure, the roof is being replaced, but not for sports. The current dome is an energy pig... it costs a fortune to keep the roof pressurized and another fortune to regulate the temperature inside the stadium. The new retractable roof will pay for itself in about 20 years.

One thing I do agree with you - there will be no movement on the waterfront issue until 2016. It takes years of bungling at city hall first, plus years of site preparation on top of that.

[sportie1]

while its true that the bc place stadium needed to be upgraded, the tune of
$ 350 mill is a heck a lot of $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ for an upgrade to any stadium!!!
without the hope of professional soccer games in the mix and the potential for a lot of $$$ coming, including, but not exclusively the whitecaps, i think this would never have happened to the level that the renos will cost
soccer will be the icing on the cake to make the renos look like a smart investment... and bc place stadium will be an awesome place to watch soccer-- do we/will we ever settle for another modest whitecap stadium when we have the elite model of bc place stadium???
i would love to see the lease the caps have signed-- i think there be will lots of opportunities for them to make $$$$-- a modified version of revenue-sharing
IMO, the city and the bc and federal governments have another master plan for the waterfront site... and it does not include a stadium!! :eek:

[Black13]

Whatever the city, provincial, and federal government has planned for the waterfront doesn't matter. As of right now they don't own it, and the current owner wants to build a stadium. I think that has been made clear.

I think if we're all patient, and most importantly persistent, this will get built if we want. All this defeatist talk is a waste of time, all this 'I know what the government is thinking' talk is an even bigger waste of speculative time.

Another point Sportie1 brought up is that he believes Mr. Kerfoot is more likely to develop condo's on his land because it will make 'more money.' So you're trying to lead me to believe that a man who has spent the last 6 years (officially, who knows how many behind the scenes) spending time, and money (in large amounts), is all of a sudden going to get interested in making a few more dollars, over an idea he is passionately pursuing? The same man who sponsors one of the best residency programs in the world is suddenly going to turn his back on his team? I find that very hard to believe. I find it very hard to believe when their is no observable proof or pattern of thought in that direction.

And it drives me nuts when people use caps lock extensively in their posts. Prove your point with words, not capital letters.

[sportie1]

Whatever the city, provincial, and federal government has planned for the waterfront doesn't matter. As of right now they don't own it, and the current owner wants to build a stadium. I think that has been made clear.

And it drives me nuts when people use caps lock extensively in their posts. Prove your point with words, not capital letters.

well... i back it with 6 years with no progress on the waterfront stadium on land that the soccer owner has and is willing to pay for the whole multi-purpose stadium without ANY public $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$-- any other city in NA would have been wild about this idea-- all other mls teams have asked for and received public/government assistance-- i never heard anything from the caps/kerfoot about the lack of progress-- now we know why- he got a fully-funded first-class stadium with no cost-- and he still has the waterfront land to do with whatever he and the governments want-- its a hell of a deal

i also back it up with the fact that the bc government is investing $ 350 mill on renos to the stadium, part of the reason is to make it more soccer friendly for the caps and other soccer-related ventures-- this will be a first-class stadium!!! why the hell would people want an outdoor stadium on the waterfront with the winds and rain blowing when they can sit in a great stadium for soccer, the possibility of adjusting the seating from
20 000 to 63 000, and with a retractable roof???

if we ever get to see the lease between the bc government and the caps, we will see why the caps will make $$$$$$$$ at bc place

the waterfront stadium-- or for that matter any other cap stadium-- for at least the next 6-7 years is off the table-- all you go on is misplaced hope-- i have evidence, you do NOT-- love the cap-locks :D

[Krammerhead]

What name did you go by on the Voyageurs board again?

[sportie1]

[QUOTE=sportie1;17703515]IMO -- it won't happen for a long time-- think 2016 at the earliest-- and will vancouver and kerfoot be willing to let the land just sit there?-- somehow i think the land will have to be developed before then, and a stadium on that site will not happen-- /QUOTE]

Don't forget what has transpired so far though.

Kerfoot has land, but he's been told he *can't* put a stadium on it.

His only option is to negotiate a swap with the Port Authority... which means he won't be building anything on it anytime soon. Land with condo towers on it is of no value to the Port.

Besides, Kerfoot's land IS developed. It's a fully operational railway storage yard, and he's presently collecting megabucks in rent cheques from the rail companies who are using it.

NOTE THE LAST PARAGRAPH-- exactly-- why would kerfoot be in a hurry to spend his own money on a stadium with only 20 000-30 000 seats when he has a fully-funded soccer-friendly stadium with tax-payer $$$$$$$$$$$$ with seating capacity ranging from 20 000-63 000 and probably where he has a way to revenue-share depending on the soccer event-- he's got the best of both worlds!! :cool: