Russia v Spain - Lightening

[campbed]

Pouring rain. ESPN showed shot of the sky over the stadium opening twice in the first half. Lightening in the sky both times. So.....

Nothing here http://www.uefa.com/newsfiles/19079.pdf in the tournament rules that anyone other than the referee has control when a match is suspended.

Why is the game not suspended until no more lightening for some period of time?

All that the 2007/2008 FIFA LOTG and it's Additional Instructions and Guidelines for Referees mentions is under Law 5 that the referee in not liable for decisions to play or not play due to weather (page 25).

[Ref Flunkie]

Pouring rain. ESPN showed shot of the sky over the stadium opening twice in the first half. Lightening in the sky both times. So.....

Nothing here http://www.uefa.com/newsfiles/19079.pdf in the tournament rules that anyone other than the referee has control when a match is suspended.

Why is the game not suspended until no more lightening for some period of time?

All that the 2007/2008 FIFA LOTG and it's Additional Instructions and Guidelines for Referees mentions is under Law 5 that the referee in not liable for decisions to play or not play due to weather (page 25).

My guess is because they are in a stadium they feel the chance of a lightning strike is negligible. Not sure I would feel this way if I was in the middle, but I'm sure the referee was told to keep the game going by organizers and FIFA

[nonya]

At that level, you can throw the FIFA book out the window. If EUFA or the powers that be say play the game, (and the players want to play) you play. You can always find another referee. Also, at that level, the referee would not be liable if he was told to play the match. I am sure if EUFA wanted to stop the match, that fourth official would be telling him so.

[Tarheel Ref]

I know I have and I'd be curious to know how many others here have been put in similar situations....of course on not nearly so large a stage....by local event organizers or ADs....

The scenario I dread....and have had to work through on occasion:

Getting instruction from tournament officials or ADs to START and then just crossing fingers and waiting for the first legitimate opportunity to suspend the match and clear the field....

Anybody else run into this situation???

[DerbyRam54]

I know I have and I'd be curious to know how many others here have been put in similar situations....of course on not nearly so large a stage....by local event organizers or ADs....

The scenario I dread....and have had to work through on occasion:

Getting instruction from tournament officials or ADs to START and then just crossing fingers and waiting for the first legitimate opportunity to suspend the match and clear the field....

Anybody else run into this situation???

Yes, I have. I was refereeing at a tournament close to Bradley Airport in CT. I had two excellent young ARs with me. We heard what we thought might have been thunder but might also have been a plane at the airport, but a couple of minutes later had our doubts removed by a loud clap of thunder. Hear it, clear it, so we suspended play and advised the teams to take shelter in their cars as there were no alternatives. We explained the thirty minutes procedure to them.
A few minutes later some twerp on a golf cart shows up and demands to know why we aren't playing. On hearing our explanation, he told us to either resume the match or he'd find another crew. We said we would be happy to start in 24 minutes, but if he wanted to find somebody else, he could go right ahead, but we weren't doing it.
By the time he got back, the time had elapsed, no more thunder had been heard and we resumed.
Later in the day a really good storm rolled in. I was appalled to see play continuing under dark skies with frequent lightning. The match I was observing at the field where my next match was scheduled (and clearly wasn't going to start) involved a team from Vermont. The parents were besides themselves as a child had been killed in a lightning strike not that long before this tournament.
I need hardly add that I have not done that tournament since.
The other thing that comes to mind was that the shelters were open-sided structures similar to the one that was hit by lightning at a state park near where I live, resulting in one death and four injuries. Unless there is a good, solid building, you're better off in your car.

[refontherun]

I know I have and I'd be curious to know how many others here have been put in similar situations....of course on not nearly so large a stage....by local event organizers or ADs....

The scenario I dread....and have had to work through on occasion:

Getting instruction from tournament officials or ADs to START and then just crossing fingers and waiting for the first legitimate opportunity to suspend the match and clear the field....

Anybody else run into this situation???

I have seen tournament situations more than once when a game was nearing the half with a thunderstorm moving in. The referee was told start the second half as soon as possible despite the threat of lightning, because the Rules of the Competition stated any game suspended after the start of the second period was considered a to be official and the results would stand at that point.

[taocpa]

I had a tournament game years ago where I was the middle. We were in an open field, U-19 girls game. Dark skies off in the distance and I had two AR's with some experience. I was told to start the game by tournament organizers. Usually, I keep close tabs on weather events, but as backup, I asked one to keep an eye on the storm clouds and warn me loudly when the clouds got too close for any comfort whatsoever.

The game was intense and so I kept looking at my AR for an indication of any type of impending threat. With none coming, I kept the game moving. Something told me something was wrong when I looked up and saw the dark clouds pretty much on top of us. Lightening is now flashing less than two miles in the distance, I told one of the girls immediately to kick the ball out of bounds. I blew my whistle and yelled for everyone to get immediately to safety. As soon as I got to my car the skies opened up with torrential rain and very nasty lightening. We finished the match after a 45-minute delay once the storm cleared.

I aksed my AR what happened. He said he didn't think we were in danger. I told him lightening strikes five miles or less as the crow flies are too close in an open field. We were in danger and he should have warned me sooner. I told him we were lucky no one was injured or killed.

I've never repeated that mistake to trust anyone but myself again.

[campbed]

I aksed my AR what happened. He said he didn't think we were in danger. I told him lightening strikes five miles or less as the crow flies are too close in an open field. We were in danger and he should have warned me sooner. I told him we were lucky no one was injured or killed.

I've never repeated that mistake to trust anyone but myself again.

I give my AR's (senior and new) a very simple instruction:

"If you see lightening at all, or hear thunder at all, raise your flag to get my attention, and when we make eye contact point to the sky." Has yet to fail me even with youth ARs.

[DerbyRam54]

Something told me something was wrong when I looked up and saw the dark clouds pretty much on top of us.

The key to safety is to try to avoid situations like that. If you wait until the storm is that close, you are very much at risk.

I abandoned a youth match a couple of weeks ago because the sky was getting very dark, the wind was picking up and we heard several claps of thunder. Sight lines at the field were very limited because it's surrounded by trees. It looked to me as though we had a limited amount of time to make sure we were safe, so I ended the match.

As it turned out, we could probably have completed the match before the storm finally arrived. But why take the risk? I'd rather be lambasted for being too cautious than pilloried for being the idiot who got some kids fried. The first I can live with, the second...

[DadOf6]

I have laminated news articles about lightning strikes and falling goals and I carry them in my bag along with the USSF policies.

If I get any grief I pull them out and say that if they want to ignore a proven safety risk they may do so but not on my watch. I will not proceed until the policy is met.

[gosellit]

Last spring, working a tournament in Memphis. I, my AR 2 and parents saw a lighting strike. I immediately stopped the match and told the coaches that I saw lightning. Both coaches had no problem and started gathering their gear and headed to the parking lot. Funny thing was, I was the only field in a group of 8 fields that stopped the match. As I was headed to the ref tent I passed the parents heading to the parking lot. A couple of them went out of their way to thank me for stopping the match. I told the field marshall that the other fields should stop as well. No response. When I got the ref tent, the assignor agreed and called for all the games to be stopped. Within a minute or two, the bottom fell out.

After an hour, all the games were deemed to be final(all were in the second half).

Do not be afraid to take a stand if you feel it is dangerous.

[Wreave]

I am always happy to stop a match for lightning, and it has only bitten me once.

It was the last match of the day (2:30 I think). There was a light rain and the clouds were ominous, and I was keeping a sharp eye out for lightning. Finally, I saw a flash. Quickly, I cleared my field. Our policy was that if any field is cleared for lightning, they all are. I notified the field next to me, and someone else ran over to the only other field that was active. Everyone went to cars to wait it out - 30 minutes is the rule.

We never saw any other lightning, and I'm now not even sure I had seen it - could have been a camera flash. Five minutes after we cleared the fields, the rain stopped. Five minutes after that, the skies cleared. We finally got the games back underway in, well, let's just say that it's possible our watches were all running fast on that 30-minute delay. We finished the games under sunny skies...

[GlennAA11]

I thought the lightning they showed was the lightning from the night before during the storm that knocked out transmissions.

It seems like the liability with regard to the spectators and the players is so great that they would have to suspend the match if that sort of lightning was hitting right outside the stadium.

[campbed]

I thought the lightning they showed was the lightning from the night before during the storm that knocked out transmissions.

It seems like the liability with regard to the spectators and the players is so great that they would have to suspend the match if that sort of lightning was hitting right outside the stadium.

The cause of the TV outage as a storm at the Vienna transfer station, not the stadium. The shot seemed to be looking inside the stadium over the stands to the skyline.

I guess we could try and find someone who was there. I notice that they did not evacuate the fanzone either.

[Tarheel Ref]

Do not be afraid to take a stand if you feel it is dangerous.

Absolutely....

[taocpa]

I should clarify my original post a bit. I didn't want to be long winded.

I never would have put the players in danger ever and I know all of you would not. The tournament organizers, as I said, thought we should start. I agreed as the storm seemed way off and I heard no thunder and saw no lightning and no one else did.

I kept my focus on the game but when the ball went out of play, I took a look at the weather. The storm appeared as if it was moving away from us and no one seemed that concerned. The AR gave no indication anything was wrong.

The field marshal came by and I asked for their opinion. He said that he heard no thunder and saw no lightning. I said okay and kept the game going. I kept looking at the AR every chance I could. Nothing. We were 30 minutes into the match.

A little over 5 minutes after I spoke to the field marshal, I had a sense the weather was about to be a problem. No one else seemed concerned but me, when I saw the looming storm closing in just about two miles away.

After the match, I quizzed the AR about what happened as I mentioned. I also spoke with the tournament organizers and coaches. They were as surprised as I was that the storm came in as it did. The tournament officials were in contact with weather forecasters and told the storm wasn't coming our way.

This was years ago before the systems now in place that tell us where a storm is going to be and at what time. I still should have known better back then. I learned a valuable lesson that day and I am much wiser now.

On to another point....

I, too, thought those pictures they showed were the lightning strikes that knocked out the television transmission.

I can't imagine UEFA, FIFA or any match organizer putting players and spectators in danger like that for a match. As was pointed out, imagine the lawsuit if spectators were killed as a result of a lightning strike at an event of this magnitude. Forget UEFA paying claims to the other broadcasters for the lost television time, the PR nightmare and claims to pay the families from this would be much worse.