Netherlands vs Russia Quarterfinal- Euro, 2008 [R]

[Neuwerld]

Good refs consult their ARs when they're in doubt. Bad refs just go ahead with the call and don't consult with their ARs no matter the situation.

I love the fact that he actually consulted his assistant. That's part of the reason they're there.

[JeremyEritrea]

I love the fact that he actually consulted his assistant. That's part of the reason they're there.

Exactly. Assistant referees are there, oh, I dunno, ASSIST the center ref. :D

[Alberto]

Good refs consult their ARs when they're in doubt. Bad refs just go ahead with the call and don't consult with their ARs no matter the situation.

Mike, as referees we are trained to look back to our AR's when the ball is on the touch line or the goal line to see if the ball stayed in play or went into touch. Michel did not do this or felt the contact by the Russian player was such that he had to show a caution. I truly hope he did not look at his yellow card and change his mind because he realized the player already was previously cautioned. To me the fact a player has a caution should not enter into the equation. If it is a caution we need to issue it. Now the saving grace in this whole affair is the fact that by pure luck he got the call right. The Russian player did not deserve the caution, but all of the confusion created by Michel's decision was not good. Generally, he's very good. Tonight he had an off night.

I would love to know what he and the AR spoke about. Was it that the ball went out or that the AR from such a long distance guessed that the contact was minimal and no caution was due. That is quite a reach 60 yards across the field of play. Particularly when the AR wasn't in position to see where the ball was when it was on the goal line.

[Alberto]

Motto for this quarterfinals should be "playing good football backfires". All the good teams are being kicked out!

I disagree, Russia played a beautiful game. They made the Dutch appear slow and lethargic. They were the better team for the entire match except for the last 10 minutes of regulation.

[fh 1]

I disagree, Russia played a beautiful game. They made the Dutch appear slow and lethargic. They were the better team for the entire match except for the last 10 minutes of regulation.
Yes, they played a fantastic game today, but did you see them vs Spain in first match just 10 days ago?
They looked like amateurs, even Russians remarked that their lucky qualification obviously was undeserved, what they're doing here as the worst team of all etc ...

[soccermoms2]

Agree, the man is a genius. He got unlucky with the dutch, lost a few tournaments on penalties in the later stages, but he took Korea to the semis in 02 of the World Cup, and took the Ozzies to the round of 16! Why couldnt the US of at least attempted to get him?

Why??? Because the bozos that run USSF are not soccer savvy, nor do they have any soccer background or experience on the international level to realize the greatness that comes with coaches like Hiddink.

Remember that recently Klinsmann was available and yet, nothing could be negotiated.

[fh 1]

I think that Russians began to play remarkable football just when Arshavin came into the team in the Sweden match.
The two matches before were not so famous.

[Alberto]

Even if it was out, a "rough foul" isn't cancelled by the ball being out.
So either he meant it to be a tactical foul, while the ball was out, or he meant it to be no foul at all, which he didn't signal to the players.
Of course, that's the way Urs Meier explained it in the german TV - he was not sure at all, what Michel tried to do there.


Just to touch on this one more time. If the referee judged that actions of the defender should be sanctioned with a caution, it would be for unsporting behavior. Since the ball was judged to be over the goal line you could not sanction the foul as a professional foul to stop an attack since the action occured during the stoppage and before the restart in play.

[Borussia]

I disagree, Russia played a beautiful game. They made the Dutch appear slow and lethargic. They were the better team for the entire match except for the last 10 minutes of regulation.

Agree.

I have to ask myself the same question as it was the case after their win against Sweden: Was this Russian team so strong or the Dutch so bad? :confused:

I'm very impressed with Guus Hiddink's team once again! Technically, tactically, physically and mentally simply brilliant! Kudos!
What has he done with his guys since the qualifiers against Israel & Andorra and the 1:4 defeat against Spain? :eek: It was absolutely stunning to see how they outplayed the best team of the group stage! I was especially surprised that they were physically absolutely superior to Holland during the whole extra time! You could get the impression that not the Dutch but the Russians had a whole week of resting before...

Well, Russia played superbly ... but let's be honest, the Dutch were also very poor tonight! Simply not understandable after their fantastic play from the group stage.

Congrats to Russia on a totally deserved win and the first semi-final appearance since 20 years! Arshavin & Pavlytschenko are a joy to watch!


PS: Do you think that Guus Hiddink will be allowed to enter Dutch soil again? :-)


I would love to know what he and the AR spoke about. Was it that the ball went out or that the AR from such a long distance guessed that the contact was minimal and no caution was due. That is quite a reach 60 yards across the field of play. Particularly when the AR wasn't in position to see where the ball was when it was on the goal line.

The former top referee Urs Meier from Switzerland said on German tv that the referee had to show the yellow-red card to the player even if the ball was out before.

[Borussia]

Yes, they played a fantastic game today, but did you see them vs Spain in first match just 10 days ago?
They looked like amateurs, even Russians remarked that their lucky qualification obviously was undeserved, what they're doing here as the worst team of all etc ...

This incredible improvement in performance is really surprising ... but after listening to Guus Hiddink (the best manager worldwide in my eyes) on German tv (he speaks a very good German), I don't wonder anymore.

I'm very happy that we don't have to play this young & hungry team in the semi-final...


I think that Russians began to play remarkable football just when Arshavin came into the team in the Sweden match.


That surely was a huge mental and quality boost for them! I simply love this guy (did you see how easily he outplayed the shaky Dutch defence?)... :)

[Zaknaf3in]

Just to touch on this one more time. If the referee judged that actions of the defender should be sanctioned with a caution, it would be for unsporting behavior. Since the ball was judged to be over the goal line you could not sanction the foul as a professional foul to stop an attack since the action occured during the stoppage and before the restart in play.

Well, honestly, I'm as far from being well-informed concerning the actual refereeing rules as the NASA from settling on mars. I just tried to translate what I heard of the seemed-to-be-reliable ex-referee Urs Meier on German TV. There WILL be translation as well as understanding issues from my side. Sorry about that! I think his conclusion was very similar to yours - he didn't know how exactly Michel got to his decision.

[NickyViola]

So who thought the Russians had any kind of chance against the Dutch before this game started? I certainly did not.

;)

Link_1 (http://www.bigsoccer.com/forum/showpost.php?p=14942604&postcount=385)
Link_2 (http://www.bigsoccer.com/forum/showpost.php?p=14942670&postcount=391)

[fh 1]

That surely was a huge mental and quality boost for them! I simply love this guy (did you see how easily he outplayed the shaky Dutch defence?)... :)
Of course, Arshavin is best player so far. But You know, this same Arshavin played for theRussian team in Zagreb a year ago and the Russians crossed the mid line twice in whole game.

These are the same players, but a total different team. The best proof that sports is not only about body and fitness but also about mental strength.
Although, I think that Hiddink makes some hard fitness program, all his teams so far (S.Korea, Australia, Holland, Russia now) were at most average when he took them (except Holland) and then became classy, especially in fitness, running and such. This may be his secret and he must be an incredible motivator and stimulator, similar to Klinsmann in this respect.

[Borussia]

These are the same players, but a total different team. The best proof that sports is not only about body and fitness but also about mental strength.
Although, I think that Hiddink makes some hard fitness program, all his teams so far (S.Korea, Australia, Holland, Russia now) were at most average when he took them (except Holland) and then became classy, especially in fitness, running and such. This may be his secret and he must be an incredible motivator and stimulator, similar to Klinsmann in this respect.

He mentioned (in a 5-minute interview after tonight's game) on German tv that they worked very hard during the last 3 weeks before the tournament had started and changed some things after the defeat against Spain.

Guus Hiddink knows how to prepare a team perfectly for a big tournament! I wanted him as Rudi Völler's successor in 2004, but we decided to engage Klinsmann (what wasn't a bad choice either:-).

Bonne nuit.


Btw: We shouldn't forget that Russia had to replace a great striker with injury (Zenit top scorer in the UEFA Cup) just a few days before the Euro had started.

[AFCA]

Well, we just failed in the face of pressure, in an epic way.

Meanwhile, King Guus showed his worth and the Russians were unleased. I enjoyed them, and I can't think of anyone I'd rather go out to than Guus.

This Dutch team had what it takes, but one thing... As the QF came closer, a few players let a few words slip that pointed out a self-assuredness that crossed a certain line. Today it was punished by a team that was superfocused and had a battle plan that screwed up ours.

The constant movement forced people like Kuijt out of position. The only chance we had was to put the pressure on them. As it showed, the few moments when we did, Russia looked vulnerable. But the passion and fire that saw us through earlier were missing today. We chased Russia, instead of forcing the game on to them.

That cost us dearly.

But wow, did Russia look dynamic today. Best of luck to them.

Somehow, this defeat isn't as bitter as many before this one. It just is.

[midnightman]

What impressed me the most is that the Russian wingmens, they went pass Dutch defenders like... EVERY TIME

[AFCA]

Yeah, their playmaker also chose the wings constantly, one time the right, one time the left... Netherlands came into this came unprepared. We should've known that Guus would take us to the gates of hell... He's a smart ********er.

Oh well, it could have gone our way still, but Russia deserved the win. I'm with Russia and Turkey now, and if Russia can keep this up, they could actually make it. Great stamina, great dynamical play, poor finishing though (except in 2nd half extra time)

I'm proud of our boys, but we could have done better. I can't help but think that Russia was vastly underestimated. Not in the least place because I hardly rated them. Ouch :D

Holland fail once more.

[urubelga]

Congrats Russia!

It was a pleasure to see this game, particularly Russia style of play and Arshavin talent.

Good luck in the semis.

[David-G]

I already thought Dutch supporters were a bit cynical about their team so I can't imagine what this tournament will do to them now.

Hiddink's sides prove that fitness and stamina are more important in football (especially internationally) than skill. I mean they played their best in the last 10 minutes of extra time which is absolutely amazing. Congrats to Russia. Here's to a Turkey-Russia final! :eek:

[billgrant88]

I already thought Dutch supporters were a bit cynical about their team so I can't imagine what this tournament will do to them now.

Hiddink's sides prove that fitness and stamina are more important in football (especially internationally) than skill. I mean they played their best in the last 10 minutes of extra time which is absolutely amazing. Congrats to Russia. Here's to a Turkey-Russia final! :eek:Fitness is important, but let's be absolutely clear about this - Russia were the much better footballing side so had both fitness and skill with them.

Also to people remembering the Spain game, Russia weren't all that bad then either. They struggled defensively obviously but to say they played like amateurs is ridiculous. They went forward well and their passing was as crisp as ever even without their playmaker. They just (I say just...) didn't deal with the Spanish movement in the final third of the pitch.

Unfortunately unless Russia learn to mark then they will stumble once again against Spain. If they're still struggling to pick up players at set pieces then how are they going to deal with picking up the runs of Villa and Torres for 90 minutes?