Very Small Rocks II Pre-Season Thread

[Ingromius]

Hasselbaink is off the board. Eto'o stinks, don't sign him. And let's just be sure we're all straight, I was not trying to cheat or to bend the rules in any way; as previously mentioned the one who stood to lose the most was me: if someone else snatched up hasselbaink and eto'o didn't sign, I'd be completely fornicated. So far we have 2 no's and 1 yes, 2 if my vote counts. One way or another I'm not leaving this computer for a few days as I have no plans of missing out on this player.

[Hal]

A. Managers can drop players and add "provisionally" players rumored to join or even allegedly signed and waiting for work permit, etc. They would have to make additional trades as required to comply with the salary cap and team limit rules.

B. Managers can only trade for players in the free agency pool that are in the database. First come, first served when new signees are entered into the database.

C. ???

Discussion:

On A.

1. Big risk if managers release talent into the free agency pool which can be scooped up by other managers and if the deal falls through the farsighted manager loses.
2. Seems to favor those with access to European soccer media.
3. Would require extra transfers once the season starts and before the transfer window closes on Aug 31.
4. How far in advance of the January transfer window can managers start making mid-term provisional trades?
5. Would require manager grabbing a scrub player and putting him on the bench. He he gets auto subbed, managers would have to lose any points made by the scrub.

On B.

We all can find out when fantasy.premierleague.com makes its daily update to the database.

Real valuations will be used and can make trades to acquire the player financially that minimizes (between 8/16 and 8/31) the points lost due to transfers.

Levels the playing field as by the time a player is in the database, he will have gone well past the rumor stage and each manager, with minimum attention, should be aware of the pending transfer into the premiership.

I don't know what C is, but Aviators board of directors votes for B.

Another consideration - I appreciate that ingromius went to the trouble to find out 'Eto's expected valuation. Will that be required of everyone before doing something similar? Here's a situation, say I toss in Phillips and make a provisional claim on Vieri and I estimate him to be a 10 M player which is what I would have. All fine so far, but what if he comes in at 11 or 11.5? Then I actually had a 101 or a 101.5 salary cap during the period between my claim and finalizing the deal. An extra 1.5 can make a difference in a playing sub or even a starter.

I just like to let fantasy.premierleague.com make the valuation and add the player to the database before claiming him.

[kopiteinkc]

I also vote B

But would like a friendly amendment that allows Ingromius to trade for Eto'o if and when he comes available without interference from other managers.

[Ingromius]

I vote A (obviously). As Hal says, it's a managerial style issue whether one chooses to risk dumping a player in the hopes of someone maybe entering the Premiership. It's a big risk to take, of course. I would move that any acquisition of this nature MUST be supported by releasing all players necessary to make the player affordable. Regarding the European media issue -- while I do spend most of the year in England, I did all of my research and tracking of Eto'o right here in Connecticut; I think you'd just have to be resourceful is all. I worry about what becomes defined as provisional, though -- although if any manager wants to handicap himself 13 mil and claim Ronaldo just in case he comes over, I guess I'd have no problem with such a suicidal move.

The problem I have with B is that it really makes the whole process a lottery. I could monitor the fantasy site all day, only to have a player added to the system during the 5 minutes I'm away and consequently lose out on the player. That strikes me as more unfair than any option we could come up with if we tinker with A.

[johno]

I agree, oh and to Ingrom, I did not think you were being slick or anything, afterall I dont think we discussed it and if we did i did not grasp it fully... so there!

while my vote is for B, i dont mind seeing A since i could use some players like Hasselbaink being released... lol

[Ingromius]

I could live with option B but only if we establish some way to even the playing field in terms of jumping on newly added players.

I'd gladly accept Kopite's offer of an exception, since in the poker game that is our league I feel I've laid my cards on the table only to get involved in a debate on the rules. But once the cards are on the table everybody's seen 'em, so I can't just pick them back up. Umm... please excuse the labored, English teacher analogy...

[johno]

Originally posted by kopiteinkc
I also vote B

But would like a friendly amendment that allows Ingromius to trade for Eto'o if and when he comes available without interference from other managers.

I dont agree with this idea really, i was shutting my mouth until Eto'o came through (hoping that maybe in the post draft lull, i would not have to race all 9 managers for him,) ... I was also trying to make trades so i could get another striker and not have to worry about signing Eto'o... and anything less than 10 for him is silly in my opinion... but that is prolly what he will go for because the estimations made by the website all seem weird to me...

[BuffloSoldier]

B.

[Clan]

Well, let me throw this shark into the swimming pool.

I have made it plain that i took Viduka knowing full well that he was moving and that Chelsea were going to bring in another striker.
I did it this way as we had said that after the draft was over we would wait a day then it was open season on anyone and everyone.

I took the hit on his worth in the draft so as i would only have to make 2 transfers to bring in the new player.

I have said this more than once.

If i wasn't fast enough to get said player that was one thing.But to have him promised out before he even gets here is quite another.

So i vote B

[Ingromius]

Originally posted by mtkillamanjohno
I was also trying to make trades so i could get another striker and not have to worry about signing Eto'o... and anything less than 10 for him is silly in my opinion... but that is prolly what he will go for because the estimations made by the website all seem weird to me...

I did the research to find out his probable value but I'm keeping my clam shut for now until I see how this all works out.

[Ingromius]

Originally posted by Ingromius
I've laid my cards on the table only to get involved in a debate on the rules. But once the cards are on the table everybody's seen 'em, so I can't just pick them back up. Umm... please excuse the labored, English teacher analogy...

If B is the vote I think I'm justified in asking for some satisfaction on this issue. The rule was NEVER even close to clear and I don't feel that I should pay such a price for moving in clear conscience.

[Clan]

There is a big write up in the guardian tonight that Chelsea are in for Viduka.

They also say that Eto'o will not play in Saturdays friendly for fear of injury with the pending move to Chelsea.

[Ingromius]

Jiminy Christmas. RIghts to Eto'o are relinquished, I just remembered who I end up keeping anyway if I miss him. I'm sure Jimmy Floyd's confidence is sky-high after seeing his new manager so desperate to unload him :) But to be sure, I'll be watching for his addition...

[Hal]

Some good process points have been raised in these discussions.

I'm sure we haven't thought of all the repercussions or of additional situations that might arise.

One good question, still unanswered, how do we (and do we want to) avoid a free for all with new transfers?

Dare I suggest some combination of the following?

A. Allow managers to select the additional transfers in, one at a time, in reverse order of Round 1 draft. Sort of like a Round 16 draft, and managers can pass.

B. Once a new player is added, managers have 24 hours to announce their interest. Then, among the interested managers, you go in reverse order of Round 1 draft with the exception that you drop to the end of the line if you have already taken a player from this process.

C. I assume it is still a free for all when scrambling for the table scrap cast-offs by the managers taking new transfers in.

I'm just thinking out loud. Some managers may prefer not to express interest in a new transfer so that they can be first in line for a hoped later transfer.

Further thinking on B, if a manager with a "better" draft position than you expresses interest in a player, then the other managers will not even bother expressing interest.

Another issue: Do we want to establish any compensation for when a player is transferred out of the premiership?

And if all this is too complicated, can we have the "Round 16" Draft Order for the mid season transfer window?

The light is beginning to clear the fog...

How about no one takes any new transfers in until after the transfer window closes on 8/31. Then we hold a supplemental draft, starting in reverse order from our Round 1 draft, until there is no more interest. There could easily be 10 or more new transfers in by then. We could even add the players released to acquire a new transfer player into this supplemental draft. So, if 1st pick Manager releases Good Player A to acquire a transfer player, then 2nd pick Manager might opt to take the released Good Player A rather than another transfer in player. This will ensure some distribution and avoid a free-for-all.

Then, for the mid-season window, again, we don't trade for any newbies until the window closes. We can either randomly select a new draft order or try to remember where we were when we quit grabbing the new transfers after 8/31. We could even have a pre-draft pick allowed to managers who had players transferred out of the premiership.

[1800-WorldCup]

Originally posted by Hal
I thought provisional selections ended with the draft? That new transfers into the league become elligible when fantasy.premierleague.com adds them to the data base?

So I don't understand the 'Eto thing, just like I haven't tried to make a trade for Vieri.

AGREE, and all provisionals that were drafted are to be thrown away TODAY.

ONLY players in the database can be in a manager's team.

[1800-WorldCup]

This means I vote B (on the first vote).... and extend it to mean NO more placeholders from the draft round.... the time is up, all players on the official teamsheets must be in the database and all managers must have the right players in the game itself.

AND....

I think all transfers, at ALL times, are to be a free-for all, with NO more mid-season drafts in reverse order or anything.

If a manager is interested in a player, or offloading a donkey, it's his job to keep his eyes peeled and get in first with the deal.

First come first served!

I've got better things to do than spend the whole season waiting for my turn to pick from another draft of draftees.

No way.

[1800-WorldCup]

Talk of Van Bommel, the mother of all crapshoots, has ceased and Glenn Hoddle is now reportedly close to closing another deal with Manchester United.

"Yes it's true we're after another classy player with Champions League experience, an international goalscorer to join our strike force. And yes, Manchester United may again be involved."

The 1800-UK.com manager smiled briefly, would anyone know what was really on his mind.

"Veron joining us here at 1800-UK.com has given the fans something to look forward to. He's the best in the world, you know...... But! We want to give them more."

"Aaaron Miles, BBC. But, but.... but what? Can you explain what you mean by but. I'll get the sack if I don't file a story."

"Yes, there are a lot of buts when it comes to Manchester United and the media. But that's all I can say for the moment."

The reporter who filed the Van Bommel story, to get others off the real transfer trail, took Mr Hoddle to one side and tried to get the REAL exclusive.

"But..... Mr Hoddle. Can I take that to mean..... (I'll whisper) Nicky Butt?"

"No comment. Provisional transfers are no more, you'll read about the REAL transfers in the official forum."

Glenn Hoddle ran his fingers through his hair, like he sometimes did before he took a free-kick -- some say to distract his opponent.

"Good day, I have to go and meet Eileen to make sure our new player has positive vibes."

[1800-WorldCup]

Are we entering these teams in "The Premier League", to see how our drafted teams do.... against the rest of the Big Soccer and 1800-WorldCup.com footie fans?

I see some of you have.

:)

[Hal]

FIFA's high priest, Seth Blatter, announced that FIFA will investigate possible player tamperings due to alleged drafting of "provisional" players by the Very Small Rocks II Division. Seth also said that public renouncement of any "Provisional" draft claims would be favorably considered when determining any penalties.

The courageous Aviators board of directors, for the good of the game, (and to avoid any 'penalties'), has renounced any claim on their "provisional" pick of Phillips in the 15th round of this season's draft.

Even though there have been many precedences for unusual drafts by many other professional sports leagues, Aviators caved and waived any "draft" rights to Phillips.

Aviators refused to say whether or not the club still retained interest in Phillips.

Phillips prov to Southhampton est 8.5 OUT
Figueroa Birmingham 7.0 IN

Aviators held a press conference at 6:44 AM (with only Chris Bergin in attendance) to introduce their new signings, Figueroa and Joe Cole, an obvious attempt to go for the unpolished young gems emerging onto the Argentina and England national teams:

Flitcroft Blackburn 5.5 OUT
Cole, J Chelsea 8.0 IN

As Chris was the only media or non Aviators person at the press conference, he was given a new Joe Cole jersey and a new Figueroa jersey autographed by the newly acquired internationals.


Michel, Aviators is also registered in The Premier League. I can delete it if you have too many teams. My competitve team in The Premier League division is Naval_Aviators who are not constrained by the stipulations of a drafted league.

[1800-WorldCup]

No, no.... Don't delete it, I've added the 1800-UK.com team there as well.

:)

It will be interesting to see how our 'drafted' teams compare in the overall BigSoccer/WorldCup League -- 'THE Premier League'.