We're always 'missing something' aren't we?

[Invincible]

Why is it that we always seem to lack "something" in recent years? Our squad has been on the cusp of absolute greatness in certain seasons, only for that to be undermined because we lacked a certain type of player needed for that situation.

In the immediate years after the big T, our team had enough to dominate the premier league but couldn't replicate success in the Champions League.(sound familiar?) The closest we came after the big T was 2002 when we unluckily went out to Bayer Leverkusen(I remember their left fullback, Placente, heading the ball off the line and Keane hitting the post...all in the second leg of the semi final). That year we were doing really well in the CL destroying Deportivo on the way, and I truly believed it was our year but alas, it wasn't to be. I thought the same last season but a combination of untimely injuries to key players as well as pure fatigue saw us crumble in Milan...again.

Last season we lacked squad depth and maybe a true leader, what do we lack this season? Well we still lack a true leader but we've also lacked someone who could control the tempo. Keane was both at the same time and I don't think we'll ever have a player like him again so we'll have to look to two separate players, one to be a real leader and another to be the 'metronome'. Our 'metronome' in Scholes, but he hasn't been available in the long time and how long can he continue? When we lose him, we seem to lose all ability to control the tempo of a match. We create lots of chances, let the opposition have a few and hope that we take the majority of ours...I mean, it's madness. Luckily we're still on top of the table despite this and I think we'll REALLY see the champagne football once Scholes re-establishes himself in the team. But who besides him can control the tempo for us?

Candidates

Michael Carrick- He can do it, no doubt. I know that much from his Spurs days, but he's not THE man in midfield for us. With the figure of Scholes looming large over him he doesn't seem to have it in him to take the reigns in midfield. Not to mention Mr. Cocky himself, Anderson telling him what to do whenever he gets a chance.:)

Anderson- If we ever decide to play him in his natural role and once he matures a few years, he can play that role for us...our very own Riquelme. He just needs to put a leash on his aggressive instinct to constantly play the hollywood ball. Kind of like the way Ronaldo has learned to curb his instinct to dribble all the time(look at how that turned out) if Anderson became more considered in his passing and added goalscoring to his strength...I think we'll have one hell of a player, and maybe a Brazilian metronome.

Now what about a leader? Who can start screaming at players when they mess up, or tell them to calm down when things are getting hectic? I think we have a few candidates.

Candidates

Wayne Rooney- He'd be my first choice. Strong, determined, HATES to lose, VERY vocal(ask any referee), willing to run himself into the ground and take every corner, throw in, free kick, goal kick all while juggling chainsaws and making tackles at left back. Future captain material, end of.

Rio Ferdinand- Yes, who would've thunk? The wobbly gobbed tw@ for captain was probably the last thing on our minds when he was busy missing piss tests and delaying on contracts, but he could potentially do it now. He already holds the defense together, his very vocal, is always on top of the pile in celebrations(lol) and even goes on a marauding run forward or two. I can picture him bombing forward when we're in need of a goal in the future, driving everyone forward with him.

Nemanja Vidic..(!!?)- Yes, the Terminator himself can be captain. He's a blood and thunder, all or nothing, balls to the wall, take no prisoners type of player and he's definitely not quiet. Maybe when he takes command of the English language even more(he speaks English fine now btw) he could possibly be a candidate. He can certainly lead by example.

What are your thoughts?

[israbeckham]

I would "Luv It" if Rooney was captain even next season. But I cant see SAF taking the armband away from Neville and Giggsy just because of the respect. As soon as both of them retire, or play a significant lesser role at least I think we will see Rooney captain.

[Red Jeph]

Candidates

Michael Carrick- He can do it, no doubt. I know that much from his Spurs days, but he's not THE man in midfield for us. With the figure of Scholes looming large over him he doesn't seem to have it in him to take the reigns in midfield. Not to mention Mr. Cocky himself, Anderson telling him what to do whenever he gets a chance.:)

Anderson- If we ever decide to play him in his natural role and once he matures a few years, he can play that role for us...our very own Riquelme. He just needs to put a leash on his aggressive instinct to constantly play the hollywood ball. Kind of like the way Ronaldo has learned to curb his instinct to dribble all the time(look at how that turned out) if Anderson became more considered in his passing and added goalscoring to his strength...I think we'll have one hell of a player, and maybe a Brazilian metronome.

I think Anderson is the best bet for this role. What really needs to happen, as DS has mentioned many times, is that Anderson needs to play with Scholes. Hopefully Scholes can last at least through next year and the pair can get significant minutes together. Playing next to Scholes, seeing week in and week out what he does, how he controls the game, will be invaluable to Anderson. If he does progress in this respect, it will allow Carrick to take the backseat he is obviously more comfortable with.

Now what about a leader? Who can start screaming at players when they mess up, or tell them to calm down when things are getting hectic? I think we have a few candidates.

Candidates

Wayne Rooney- He'd be my first choice. Strong, determined, HATES to lose, VERY vocal(ask any referee), willing to run himself into the ground and take every corner, throw in, free kick, goal kick all while juggling chainsaws and making tackles at left back. Future captain material, end of.

Rio Ferdinand- Yes, who would've thunk? The wobbly gobbed tw@ for captain was probably the last thing on our minds when he was busy missing piss tests and delaying on contracts, but he could potentially do it now. He already holds the defense together, his very vocal, is always on top of the pile in celebrations(lol) and even goes on a marauding run forward or two. I can picture him bombing forward when we're in need of a goal in the future, driving everyone forward with him.

Nemanja Vidic..(!!?)- Yes, the Terminator himself can be captain. He's a blood and thunder, all or nothing, balls to the wall, take no prisoners type of player and he's definitely not quiet. Maybe when he takes command of the English language even more(he speaks English fine now btw) he could possibly be a candidate. He can certainly lead by example.

What are your thoughts?

I really think Ferdinand is the best option at this point. He is mature (well, most of the time) and I think it is clear that he has the respect of the other players. He is not afraid to confront anyone on the club if they are not doing what they should. He is also almost assured to be on the pitch virtually at all times.

Rooney is still a pit petulant at time. True, being given the captaincy could be just the thing that gets that out of him, but it would be a pretty sizable gamble. I think he will be more ready in a few years, about the time Rio is finishing up.

[leafdolfan]

I really think that the Scholes/ Carrick partnership could really work in Europe. It worked well last season, and they haven't got a lot of time to play together this season but when they do get time together in February they can start working together. Carrick can slow down and control the midfield against European teams. He really could make our midfield calm which would help our forwards also stay more calm. Scholes's passing and Carrick's control could make a combo that would help us dominate the midfield against top squads in europe. If we control the midfield and the tempo even if our 'front three' of Tevez, Rooney, and Ronaldo have a bad finishing day (like the reading match) we should be able to get something out of midfield dominance.

[SirManchester]

Part of the reason why we've been missing something is because this team has been through so many transitions after 98/99 that ferguson is just now starting to find his pieces and building a side that can compete domestically and in Europe. And I still don't think we're quite there yet. Anderson, Tevez, Ronaldo, Rooney are key figures but they're young and to play important roles in title winning teams, they must mature.

Ferguson has experimented with directly replacing his older title winning side Keane (Djemba Djemba) Beckham (Ronaldo), etc... and it didn't work. The game also changed and Ferguson is an astute scholar of the game. He watches the Milans and the Barcelonas and studies them. At the moment he's trying to find balance between some of our older players and young. Scholes' return to me will signify if we have any decent shot at titles this season. But he still leaves a huge hole when he's not playing and that should be our main concern. Ronaldo can only bail us out so often but Scholes is arguably our most important player and again, it's been more than evident. I'm not so sure how things will progress. I want Anderson to get a shot at playing next to Scholes. From what we've seen there's a lot of hope that he can replace him, but he really needs a mentor and there's none better than the Ginger Prince.

We don't have a proper leader, and while Ferdinand is out best candidate, he's by no means the ideal one. As good as he is, he will still haev mental lapses and as he showed yestderday, prone to doing stupid things like kicking. He should know better and he continuously proves that in the end he doesn't have what it takes to be captain. However, for the sake of the team, the youngsters, at the moment, I'd still give it to him because he instills confidence and because he's such a key player AND now that Giggs is not so much a 90 minute player anymore. Rooney has the hunger and heart but he hasn't shown that he can be a true leader yet, and the key word is "yet". He will have to mature, he will have to take on a much more important role in the team, and he will need to show that his team can rely on him. As his confidence is boosted and his temper settled, he can be the leader we need. Vidic would probably be the ideal candidate if he was more outspoken and if Ferdinand wasn't the boss of the backline.

[JamesA]

We don't have a proper leader, and while Ferdinand is out best candidate, he's by no means the ideal one. As good as he is, he will still haev mental lapses and as he showed yestderday, prone to doing stupid things like kicking. He should know better and he continuously proves that in the end he doesn't have what it takes to be captain.

Honest question SM. Can you really hold the kick from yesterday's game against him in the big "captain debate"?

I mean, god knows the amount of stupid shit Keano did as a captain. I love him to bits, but he was also guilty of such lapses as Rio yesterday.

BTW, I consider the mental lapses of his as a separate issue from his lashing out yesterday in this debate.

[SirManchester]

Honest question SM. Can you really hold the kick from yesterday's game against him in the big "captain debate"?

I mean, god knows the amount of stupid shit Keano did as a captain. I love him to bits, but he was also guilty of such lapses as Rio yesterday.

BTW, I consider the mental lapses of his as a separate issue from his lashing out yesterday in this debate.

Well I wouldn't exactly use the kick to soley justify this but moreso as a reflection of losses of concentration. Keane would do erratic things but he would ALWAYS have a leash on the game and his teammates, he was larger than life. Oftentimes when we rely on Rio he lets us down or there are moments where his lapses result in mistakes and a lot of what he does doesn't lead a good example for the youngsters and rest of the team, then again that's the traditionalist in me. As much as he's not the idea captain and leader, he's the best option at the moment and I wouldn't cry foul if the armband goes to him until Rooney matures or someone else steps up surprisingly.

[433tom]

The ideal traits for a Captain are:

1) Influence - Respected by teammates, players value his opinions and judgements. Has the ability to inspire teammates.
2) Teamwork - Viewed as a team player, selfish players are not usually effective Captains. Strikers get a bit of leeway here, but that is also why Strikers are not usually Captains.
3) Work Rate - leads by example, inspires by example.
4) Loyalty - loyal to the club and teamates. The players trust him.

While Teamwork, Work rate, and Loyalty are somewhat transparent for the fans. The big unknown (and the most important trait) in most cases is influence.

For instance, we know Rooney has 3 of the 4 traits in abundance. The unknown would be how high he rates in the influence area. Comparing Rooney and Rio, I would think Rooney gets the nod based on Work Rate and Loyalty, while they are probably about even in regards to Teamwork. As Rio gets the armband that tells me that either Rio has significantly more Influence than Rooney or that Fergie prefers to go with the more mature player as Captain.

[Alfiesdodgyknee]

He's a crackign player is Carrick. I like him alot and thought yesterday he had quite a good game .

He needs a solid run in the team and start really putting his mark on games. He definatley has the ability.

[J'can]

I think what is missing is an understanding of what SAF is thinking and holds dear in any particular season. This season in particular I would love to know what was going through his head in the transfer market and in team selection. For example, there was no signing of an out and out strker. I said at the start of the season when Roo and Saha were injured that we are not allotted a certain amount of injuires. The fact that we have injuries at the start of the season does not preclude us from having them in the middle of it. With Saha being out that is causing our team to be very unbalanced.

Well how can we be unbalanced and still lead the table? Well going back to the topic of the thread how can something be missing when we won the league last year and still lead the table this year? The fact is when something is missing you know it. You see it and you feel it. The fact that we have some sucess does not mean that our team doesnt have issues. THe reason we are leading and we won last year despite gaps in our team is because of a weak league as much as it is becasue of our play. Yes Ronaldo has been outstanding last year and this but if the league was stronger we may not be leading the league.

SAF has been successful enough to not warrant much criticism but i think some decisions that he made have caused us not to rise up to the level of dominating Europe. The league will always be ours for the taking cause we can play average over the course of hte season and still have a better than average shot at winning. Only Le Arse and possibly Chlski can compete with us. SO we are always right there leaguewise. But in Europe (which is the level we need to attain and where the something missing is most evident) we are not as dominant and the decison not to buy a striker will cost us.

Other decision I disagreed with is the sale of Beck and RVN. If they were a part of the squad this year I think we would win in Europe. And both those players have not been replaced. We have alternatives but in the true nature of these guys there are stil voids left.

So back to the question: the anwer i choose to give is this: we are missing an understanding of waht SAF is thinking and places a higher value on. Is he is cementing hte league position or is he looking to win in Europe. Somehow I think this year he is looking to win the league and see what happens in Europe.

[Alfiesdodgyknee]

Regarding the last post ,we didnt buy an out and out striker because we didnt have the money! We're currently renting tevez as it is.