The forgotten 11 (and some subs)

[EstebanLugo]

Colombia has some serious talent abroad that Pinto hasn't even looked at yet or has called but given very little playing time. And yet others who paid the price for our awful Copa America but should be at least considered for a second chance. Let's take a look:

FORGOTTEN ONES XI (3-5-2)

-Farid Camilo MONDRAGON (KOLN):

The veteran keeper hasn't been called under Pinto altough an injury kept him out once for a friendly. Unlikely to return given Julio's current shape.

-Cristian ZAPATA (UDINESE):
Ok, he's been in, but many of us tought that he should merit a spot ahead of Walter Moreno given his continuous playing in the Serie A. However the eliminatoria games gave Pinto reason after Moreno and Aquivaldo formed a monumental partnership.

-Ivan Ramiro CORDOBA (INTER):
I won't even get into this because i'm sure it has been debated ad nauseum here and elsewere. But we all know he will never return under Pinto. And, quite frankly, he shouldn't.

-Mario YEPES (PSG):
See: above. With the difference that I still believe he has quality.

-Freddy GUARIN (ST. ETIENNE):
See: Cristian Zapata. He hasn't given a descent amount of time so I really don't know why Pinto forgot about him so quickly.

-Elkin Dario SOTO (MAINZ):
Tough luck with injuries and his tug-of-war with Once Caldas make him a presumably vetoed player. I just tough Pinto was going to have the balls to stand to the dirigentes and call him anyway. That was too much to ask.

-Juan Carlos TOJA (DALLAS):
Don't raise your eyebrows at me. He's a hit at MLS and since the media is crying out loud for Juan P. Angel then i don't see why Toja doesn't deserve a chance.

-Abel AGUILAR (XEREZ):
Shone under Rueda and many tough he would become a regular because he did not disappoing when he got called to the full NT. I say he's been discriminated against just like Toja because he plays at a Segunda division.

-Gio HERNANDEZ (NECAXA):
Pinto keeps telling us that he'll be there but so far he hasn't. And he hasn't stop being monumental at Colo Colo and will still be monumental at Necaxa. Pinto says he hasn't been fit lately but I think that's a lame excuse. Well, that's just how coaches are. (See: Ronaldinho at Barça)

-Juan Pablo PINO (MONACO):
Pino has been getting more and more minutes at Monaco and maybe he hasn't exploded yet but I think he's focused and in this case I see this call-up as a big incentive. He should really be there for the friendlies.

-Martin ARZUAGA (CENTRAL):
Altough El Torito hasn't been as succesful with Central as he was at Tiro, I think that the fact he remains a starter in Argentina is worth considering. Also, he has never disappointed for the NT, altough his costeño status makes him somewhat unsuitable for the games in Bogotá because of altura.

SUBS.

-Julian VIAFARA (PARANAENSE):
He has consolidated as a starter and maybe is a cheaper air ticket than bringing R.Zapata from Romania to sit on a bench.

-Julian DE LA CUESTA (CADIZ):
See: Elkin Soto and Abel Aguilar.

-Alvaro DOMINGUEZ (SION):
Severely punished after his gaffe at Copa America and rightly so. Every time i remember how he kicked that PK like such a ****** i feel like vomiting. But even him deserves a second chance for his past at Cali and the fact that he remains a starter in Switzerland. But i stil bench him :D.

-Luis YAÑEZ (LILLE):
I know, I know. Weird that I'm asking for a former santafereño but I just want that Pinto doesn't forget him. I know he's been injured all season but I hope Pinto gives him a look when he recovers.

-Juan ANGEL (NEW YORK):
i don't really want him back. But he's had a pretty decent year in MLS and that must count for something. That and his experience.

Dig in.

[crzdcolombian]

Colombia has some serious talent abroad that Pinto hasn't even looked at yet or has called but given very little playing time. And yet others who paid the price for our awful Copa America but should be at least considered for a second chance. Let's take a look:

FORGOTTEN ONES XI (3-5-2)

-Farid Camilo MONDRAGON (KOLN): 2nd div, old as dirt would prefer just using ospina or one of the millos keepers, hell bring in libis

The veteran keeper hasn't been called under Pinto altough an injury kept him out once for a friendly. Unlikely to return given Julio's current shape.

-Cristian ZAPATA (UDINESE):(dont see why he shouldnt start
Ok, he's been in, but many of us tought that he should merit a spot ahead of Walter Moreno given his continuous playing in the Serie A. However the eliminatoria games gave Pinto reason after Moreno and Aquivaldo formed a monumental partnership.

-Ivan Ramiro CORDOBA (INTER): time is done
I won't even get into this because i'm sure it has been debated ad nauseum here and elsewere. But we all know he will never return under Pinto. And, quite frankly, he shouldn't.

-Mario YEPES (PSG): time is done thanks for all u done for us Yepes
See: above. With the difference that I still believe he has quality.

-Freddy GUARIN (ST. ETIENNE):hopefully after the winter transfer season he will be in another team cause this kid has top 10 talent for us
See: Cristian Zapata. He hasn't given a descent amount of time so I really don't know why Pinto forgot about him so quickly.

-Elkin Dario SOTO (MAINZ): always injured he isnt forgotten he just been injured for the past 1 1-2
Tough luck with injuries and his tug-of-war with Once Caldas make him a presumably vetoed player. I just tough Pinto was going to have the balls to stand to the dirigentes and call him anyway. That was too much to ask.

-Juan Carlos TOJA (DALLAS):prob wouldnt start him but def should be in the bench
Don't raise your eyebrows at me. He's a hit at MLS and since the media is crying out loud for Juan P. Angel then i don't see why Toja doesn't deserve a chance.

-Abel AGUILAR (XEREZ): the captain needs to come back to colombia because in yellow is god
Shone under Rueda and many tough he would become a regular because he did not disappoing when he got called to the full NT. I say he's been discriminated against just like Toja because he plays at a Segunda division.

-Gio HERNANDEZ (NECAXA):r u fing serious how many shots this guy need
Pinto keeps telling us that he'll be there but so far he hasn't. And he hasn't stop being monumental at Colo Colo and will still be monumental at Necaxa. Pinto says he hasn't been fit lately but I think that's a lame excuse. Well, that's just how coaches are. (See: Ronaldinho at Barça)

-Juan Pablo PINO (MONACO): last 20 min player
Pino has been getting more and more minutes at Monaco and maybe he hasn't exploded yet but I think he's focused and in this case I see this call-up as a big incentive. He should really be there for the friendlies.

-Martin ARZUAGA (CENTRAL):only good 1-2 half season then sucked
Altough El Torito hasn't been as succesful with Central as he was at Tiro, I think that the fact he remains a starter in Argentina is worth considering. Also, he has never disappointed for the NT, altough his costeño status makes him somewhat unsuitable for the games in Bogotá because of altura.

SUBS.

-Julian VIAFARA (PARANAENSE):getting dropped from his brasilian team
He has consolidated as a starter and maybe is a cheaper air ticket than bringing R.Zapata from Romania to sit on a bench.

-Julian DE LA CUESTA (CADIZ): injured alot but quality leave him on the bench
See: Elkin Soto and Abel Aguilar.

-Alvaro DOMINGUEZ (SION):bring him back but um wouldnt start
Severely punished after his gaffe at Copa America and rightly so. Every time i remember how he kicked that PK like such a ****** i feel like vomiting. But even him deserves a second chance for his past at Cali and the fact that he remains a starter in Switzerland. But i stil bench him :D.

-Luis YAÑEZ (LILLE):he sucks, and isnt a scorer
I know, I know. Weird that I'm asking for a former santafereño but I just want that Pinto doesn't forget him. I know he's been injured all season but I hope Pinto gives him a look when he recovers.

-Juan ANGEL (NEW YORK): kind of old would bring him in just to tutor Falcao and the rest of the young bloods but to start him is iffy.... but def should be on the team
i don't really want him back. But he's had a pretty decent year in MLS and that must count for something. That and his experience.

Dig in.

for me keepr

gk
Ospina - bi champion and youngest keeper ever to win
sub Landurazi - Once Caldas great keeper and was our sub 20 2003 one
sub 3 Libis Arenas - Bring this kid in so he can get a transfer he is great

defense (cbs)
Josmier Mosquera - know pinto all ready said him but he needs to be here
Cristian Zapata - one top young players in serie a
subs- Mendoza

Lb-RB
Cassiera- reason why Dayro scored so much
the guys from America de cali and Equpidad dont know their names
Valencia from River - started 3 games well for river should be looked at, tho most likely a great canidate to start on the sub 20 in 2009

Mf
Edwin Valencia - fan fav in brasil
JC Escobar - prob tolimas best player , cant believe they let him go to fing russia
Toja- fan fav in Dallas and this kid gives it 300 percent every game
RObayo - did great for millos in sudamericana
Guarin - utube him
Oltavaro- seriously he is another 10 just waiting to emerge
Stallin MOttA - reason why equipdad went any where at all

Strikers---- yea......
Pino- not really a striker but extremly explosive
Angel - old but can guide our young players like he did with Rey
Edixion - love him or hate him the kids got talent just needs match fitness and will be great again
Montero - CAli sucked and had no one to feed him balls, if was on Nacional he would have scored like 30 haha
Carlos Hilgado - being 2nd or 3rd top scorer in COlombia should have given him his shot

and NO EFER I dont want John Mosquera YET, Sudamericana is still to fresh on my mind

--------Ospina---------
America RB---Josmier---Zapata--Cassiera
Toja---Stallin--Edwin Valencia------Guarin
-------Montero--Hilgado---------------

ok Ospina needs playing time to be our #1 because all Julio has on him is time and experience but #s dont lie and Ospina is better

Defense think it is very solid and good attacking because Josmier is great in the air and the wingbacks great at crossing

MF its very offensive and attacking because I am not going to lie and say Toja is the most skillful or gifted player we havent used but he gives it 500 percent each game and runs each end of the field to attack and defend just like Guarin and lets not forget about guarins rocket. As Valencia is prob our most gifted DM right now after sanchez and hopefully after a few friendlies Pinto will drop Amaya. Motta or Oltavaro can be our AMCs and pino can be given like 20-30 mins a game

strikers this is where it hurts we dont have much.... I love to say Hilgado and Montero but they just had 1 good season and are still really green. but if edixion and Pino get more playing time then I would love to start either

[ryu79]

The two main players that I'd like to see built into the side on current form are Edwin Valencia and Cristian Zapata - outside of those roles, I think Pinto has done a nice job with call ups and players have responded. On your folks:

FORGOTTEN ONES XI (3-5-2)

-Farid Camilo MONDRAGON (KOLN): With Julio playing as well as he is, hard to see why you'd want to replace. Rufay is trusted by Pinto and doing terrific in Europe and a deserving sub.

-Cristian ZAPATA (UDINESE): Agreed Moreno has earned a spot in the XI. Over time Zapata will get minutes due to suspension and we'll see his quality.


-Ivan Ramiro CORDOBA (INTER): Don't like his attitude recently, and his timing of his international retirement was petulant and attention seeking. Very disappointing.


-Mario YEPES (PSG): One of my all time faves, but just didn't look right at the Copa and is only just re-gaining his form in France, over time maybe, but he's not on the form that an Aquivaldo, Cristian, or even Walter Moreno have showed of late and Amaranto would have an argument to play ahead of him as well...

-Freddy GUARIN (ST. ETIENNE): Bizarre loss of playing time in France and got a red card five minutes into his first appearance for Pinto. Completely understandable that he wouldn't be called up.

-Elkin Dario SOTO (MAINZ): He hasn't played this season and is suspended for four more according to the FIFA ruling - again makes perfect sense not to call him to this point.

-Juan Carlos TOJA (DALLAS): I could see the reason to call up, but he wouldn't start ahead of Sanchez, Amaya, Torres, Grisales, Ferreira, etc.

-Abel AGUILAR (XEREZ): He's become the goat of the fans of the second division team he plays for. Its not like he is excelling and being ignored. I love his game, but if he doesn't perform he shouldn't play.

-Gio HERNANDEZ (NECAXA): Colombia looks so much better when Giovanni doesn't play. Its uncanny. A prodigious talent who just has no heart or leadership, I want him far from the starting lineup.

-Juan Pablo PINO (MONACO): I'd like to see him called up just to get used to Pinto's discipline and get some international experience. Don't see him starting until he plays more consistently at Monaco but I like the way his coach there is bringing him along and trying to teach him to play for the team rather than the opposite...

-Martin ARZUAGA (CENTRAL): I'd call him as a backup, but he doesn't pose the same threat to defenses talent wise as Rentera, Falcao or even Dayro. A great finisher, but considering our lack of build up, I think the three above are a better fit for what we need.

SUBS.

-Julian VIAFARA (PARANAENSE): May be leaving Brasil, has had some NIGHTMARES in goal for Paranaense, hope he regains consistency.

-Julian DE LA CUESTA (CADIZ): Has anyone seen this guy play since he was 21?

-Alvaro DOMINGUEZ (SION): Doesn't have the mindset to play in Pinto's side. We play defense first and then score opportunistically - we can't have dudes that fall down at the slightest touch and wimp out on PK attempts wasting a spot on the field...

-Luis YAÑEZ (LILLE): He's been hurt, totally natural not to call him.

-Juan ANGEL (NEW YORK): Maybe just for his maturity and class, I'd love for him to be around Falcao and Wason and impart some experience. I am a huge JPA supporter, but he's not getting any faster, and its hard to form a rational argument to play Angel when we're winning games with two cracks upfront in Wason and Falcao (and they haven't even found their boots yet with the NT)

[minus]

Los unicos que deben de estar son esto cuatro:

C.Zapata - Debe de ser titular indiscutible ... Sorry Moreno...

E.Valencia - Este man con Sanchez seria una dupla muy buena o quitarle el puesto a Castrillon pq Valencia es un volante Mixto...

J.Toja - 100% Effort and lefty. I think he could challenge Castrillon for starting spot.

El Toro Arzuaga - Todo el mundo habla de Renteria y Falcao pero el Torito fuera mejor cabezador seria el delantero mas completeo. Este man tiene CALIDAD. He has dribble and vision (a lot of assist) for a striker. He has probably the most powerful shot out of the three. He can kick free kicks...

[pepinointer]

Los unicos que deben de estar son esto cuatro:

C.Zapata - Debe de ser titular indiscutible ... Sorry Moreno...

E.Valencia - Este man con Sanchez seria una dupla muy buena o quitarle el puesto a Castrillon pq Valencia es un volante Mixto...

J.Toja - 100% Effort and lefty. I think he could challenge Castrillon for starting spot.

El Toro Arzuaga - Todo el mundo habla de Renteria y Falcao pero el Torito fuera mejor cabezador seria el delantero mas completeo. Este man tiene CALIDAD. He has dribble and vision (a lot of assist) for a striker. He has probably the most powerful shot out of the three. He can kick free kicks...

de acuerdo con el torito es uno de losx mejores delanteros del pais

[el escorpion]

Los unicos que deben de estar son esto cuatro:

C.Zapata - Debe de ser titular indiscutible ... Sorry Moreno...

E.Valencia - Este man con Sanchez seria una dupla muy buena o quitarle el puesto a Castrillon pq Valencia es un volante Mixto...

J.Toja - 100% Effort and lefty. I think he could challenge Castrillon for starting spot.

El Toro Arzuaga - Todo el mundo habla de Renteria y Falcao pero el Torito fuera mejor cabezador seria el delantero mas completeo. Este man tiene CALIDAD. He has dribble and vision (a lot of assist) for a striker. He has probably the most powerful shot out of the three. He can kick free kicks...

arzuaga, si fuera mejor cabeceador, pero no lo es, asi que me quedo con falcao y wason, aunque si merece estar en la seleccion, es un jugador desequilibrante, no sera la gran cosa, pero es bueno y pino tambien lo merece

[minus]

m4SPzHdUmmA

[el escorpion]

m4SPzHdUmmA
mucho me temo que el toro hoy por hoy no esta en las condiciones en que el video las muestra, pero no es descabellado tenerlo en cuenta....

y una cosa, no mas con Toja y Angel !!!

Angel ya no esta para seleccion y cuando Toja juege en una liga competitiva puede ser opcion, pero si la liga mexicana es mala la MLS si que es cierto

[crzdcolombian]

intersting thread , any one want to change their choices :( sad that Pino hasnt made it yet

hope Zapata gets teh starting spot when on the trip to europe

[MrPaisa]

Motta all the way!

[ryu79]

Motta all the way!

Edwin Valencia would be my biggest "forgotten" player. Long deserving of a shot in our XI.

[EstebanLugo]

To have all these players out of the NT shows that getting sold out to Europe actually hurts your chances of wearing la amarilla. What a downer.

[MrPaisa]

To have all these players out of the NT shows that getting sold out to Europe actually hurts your chances of wearing la amarilla. What a downer.


edwin valencia is in brazil and yes he should be on the national team...

[MiLo4891]

who does valencia work for?

[ryu79]

who does valencia work for?

Atl Paranaense. He's a fan fave there playing as a 5.

[pipevasquez]

Para mi

Mondragon....este man siempre estubo por detras de Oscar y el mismo Calero. Pero era el unico que no se la pasaba pidiendo vacaciones en la Seleccion...tubo unas buenas temporadas en Turkia, y ahora es uno de las fguras en el Koln, recien subido a primera

Zapata...De lejos el mejor central que hay en Colombia, y con el mayor prospecto, creo que la mayoria lo conocen y no hay mucho que decir de el

Sanchez....Los partidos oficiales que a jugando Carlos con Colombia fueron de gran calidad, de este jugador, hoy por hoy es titular en la zona defensiva

Falcao....Ser figura en River, ser buscado en Europa, estar considerado entre los 2 mejores delanteros del continente, tener los huevos de este tipo, no los tiene cualquiera

Renteria....Para mi gusto es el tipo mas fino en la delantera que tenmos, tiene mas habilidad que Cualquiera, seria el complemento perfecto en la delantera

Soto....dicil encontrar uno que juee mejor que este en Colombia, hablar de el es una perdida de tiempo es simplemente el Mejor jugador De los ultimos años en su posicion, y quizas en el terreno de juego, Volvio de lesion y su castigo y rapido se hizo con la titular de el Mainz 05

[dapip]

Atl Paranaense. He's a fan fave there playing as a 5.

And Pinto keeps calling Ringo and even worst now he tried to use Anchico as a pure defensive midfielder.

I envision a tandem of Sanchez and Valencia becoming and unsurpasable barrier, freeing up Mcnelly and Totono/Motta to create havoc upfront.

[dapip]

Para mi

Sanchez....Los partidos oficiales que a jugando Carlos con Colombia fueron de gran calidad, de este jugador, hoy por hoy es titular en la zona defensiva

Falcao....Ser figura en River, ser buscado en Europa, estar considerado entre los 2 mejores delanteros del continente, tener los huevos de este tipo, no los tiene cualquiera

Renteria....Para mi gusto es el tipo mas fino en la delantera que tenmos, tiene mas habilidad que Cualquiera, seria el complemento perfecto en la delantera



Pero si los tres han sido titulares indiscutibles en la eliminatoria como pueden ser forgotten?:confused:

Mondragon es un gran arquero y le pone el alma cada vez que juega con Colombia. Tuvo su oportunidad en el 98 y fue el mejor de Colombia. Pero ahora lo que hay que buscar es relevo generacional, Julio tiene dias en que aterroriza lo mismo que Zapata (Rufay).

Zapata es cuestion de tiempo para que Pinto se convenza, pero si esta años luz adelante de otros que ha llamado a la seleccion (Jossimar, Amaranto). Lo dificil es meterse en la pelea y sacar a uno de los dos de la dupla Moreno-Mosquera.

Soto no creo que haya sido olvidado, solo que no estaba jugando. Ahora que volvio, debe ser llamado seguro para los compromisos de Junio.

[crzdcolombian]

And Pinto keeps calling Ringo and even worst now he tried to use Anchico as a pure defensive midfielder.

I envision a tandem of Sanchez and Valencia becoming and unsurpasable barrier, freeing up Mcnelly and Totono/Motta to create havoc upfront.

Amaya I hated and talked alot of crap about him but he has been one of our best players and thats why he has Pintos trust, I see him replaced in the future by Edwin Valencia but till then he is alot better option and has done better than Anchico, Vargas, John Viafara and the other losers Pinto has called up for that postion

I think walter moreno and Amaya have really taken their shot and shined tho I think their are better club players out there these guys are great on the NT, but their fall of form and that of NAcional is worrysome because that is the basis of our NT

[pipevasquez]

Pero si los tres han sido titulares indiscutibles en la eliminatoria como pueden ser forgotten?:confused:

Mondragon es un gran arquero y le pone el alma cada vez que juega con Colombia. Tuvo su oportunidad en el 98 y fue el mejor de Colombia. Pero ahora lo que hay que buscar es relevo generacional, Julio tiene dias en que aterroriza lo mismo que Zapata (Rufay).

Zapata es cuestion de tiempo para que Pinto se convenza, pero si esta años luz adelante de otros que ha llamado a la seleccion (Jossimar, Amaranto). Lo dificil es meterse en la pelea y sacar a uno de los dos de la dupla Moreno-Mosquera.

Soto no creo que haya sido olvidado, solo que no estaba jugando. Ahora que volvio, debe ser llamado seguro para los compromisos de Junio.

La verdad, estba pensando, en los que para mi serian titulares....en las eliminatorias sin importar si ya jugaron o no..por eso puse a esos

Ahora con el Arquero. yo prefiero tener uno de 37 años que a uno de 21 haciendo errores tontos caso e de Nacional, o caso internacional Carrizo...por algo dicen que entre mas veteranos mejor son los arqueros...Gusto persona obviamente