Platini Top Ten All-Time?

[kingkong1]

xxx

[kingkong1]

and i remember you that pele 12 months before in a friendly game with a brutal foul has broken the shinebone of german player giesemann in a friendly game in brasil and has hindered a possible chance for giesemann playing worldcup 1966....For you to see that Pelé's 'friendlies' were not always as 'friendly' (never were...) as many people try to put it! ;) ...

If The Negão did what he did be sure that in all that some 'guilt' Gieseman should have...

Remember the elbow in the throat Sosa got in the Brz x Uruguay 1970 WC semifinal? (everybody saw, even the referee, but he had no guts to send him off, first of all because it was Pelé, second, because Sosa had - with his conivence - spent the whole game 'spanking' him)...

Yeah, The King could be mean! :D ...

_____________________________________________________________________________________
PS: Of one thing you can be sure: if you 'own' a copy of that Brazil X Portugal, you'd better off also own an extra pair of glasses...You 'saw' a completely different game from what the rest of the world saw...

[kingkong1]

Kingkong1 will not be satisfied unless there are at least 80% Brazilians on every ranking.

And those who disagree with him are just jealous of Brazil or Eurocentric. :)Sorry, but a ranking is a ranking.

And not an equitative Christian distribution of cabbage soup among the most 'needed' ones :eek: ...

If there was a super-team from a distant galaxy defying Earth, and victory meant the planet's survival, be sure that even Babaorum, Ianman and Teso dos Bichos would leave those academic & patriotic questions aside & hurry to fill their World's 11 with Brazilians...

And preferrably playing the final at Maracanã Stadium with the support of Flamengo fans :cool: ...

PS: Besides, Blauser, now you are being injust.

I don't just blatantly 'say' that people are 'jealous'.

I say WHY too, and invariably try to back my opinions not only with arguments, but also with data and archives.

It's you now that are affirming things out of thin air.

Kingkong1 will not be satisfied unless there are at least 80% Brazilians on every ranking.
Well, that's not too far from the percentage of Brazilians among foreigners in European clubs: and obviously that choice is not mine, but simply yours...

Thanks for the preference!...

[babaorum]

Sorry, but a ranking is a ranking.

And not an equitative Christian distribution of cabbage soup among the most 'needed' ones :eek: ...

If there was a super-team from a distant galaxy defying Earth, and victory meant the planet's survival, be sure that even Babaorum, Ianman and Teso dos Bichos would leave those academic & patriotic questions aside & hurry to fill their World's 11 with Brazilians...

And preferrably playing the final at Maracanã Stadium with the support of Flamengo fans :cool: ...



The only Brazilians I would pick without the shadow of a doubt in such a team are Pele and Garrincha. The rest is open to discussion. For yor information : I wouldn't pick Platini either :p.

[dor02]

him, Baresi, Domingos, as a matter of fact, are all great players and a matter of personal preferenceYou have to draw the line between your personal favourite players and the players who really are the greatest. I have no problem with you saying that Domingos Da Guia and Jack Charlton are your personal favourite centre backs but to consider them as the greatest CBs ever is an extremely bold statement to make.

[kingkong1]

:confused:

Relax dude

I didn't even mention you. I was not responding to anything you posted. I never mentioned Didi. Your post was not immediatly above mine or anything. Why do you just assume I'm responding to you - I was answering the question as to whether Platini was top 10. I was actually posting in reference to those who compared him to Ronaldinho etc, saying he lacked foot skills - so what that's not his game.

All I'm saying is that while all the other players mentioned were excellent with the ball, Platini may be the best "off the ball" player I've ever seen.Sorry, you entered in the middle of the discussion without a quote, so I thought it was a reply to mine. Disconsider it. Cheers.

[Martininho]

And preferrably playing the final at Maracanã Stadium with the support of Flamengo fans :cool: ...

...Where they would pray fervently that the aliens hadn't made a recruiting stop in Uruguay. ;)

[kingkong1]

...Where they would pray fervently that the aliens hadn't made a recruiting stop in Uruguay.http://forums.soccerfansnetwork.com/images/smilies/lol.gif

[kingkong1]

xxx

[kingkong1]

You have to draw the line between your personal favourite players and the players who really are the greatestSorry!...

I didn't know it was you who determine the players who really are the greatest! :cool: ...

But if I have to draw that line the way you wish, you are simply not entitling me to the simplest personal opinion...

And you still stated you 'have no personal problems' with that!...I have no problem with you saying that Domingos Da Guia and Jack Charlton are your personal favourite centre backs but to consider them as the greatest CBs ever is an extremely bold statement to makeWhat a fallacy, dor02!...

I NEVER put Jack Charlton even among my best 11: in my initial post - if you read it correctly - he and Bobby Moore warm up the 2nd team bench for Domingos da Guia and Beckenbauer, the same way Baresi could be in his place in that bench too: I am the one who absolutely has no problems with that.As I stated somewhere in this Forum, my 1st and 2nd best teams of all times would be (distributed in a 4-2-4, to make justice to both defense and attack):

First:

Yashin; Carlos Alberto, Beckenbauer, Domingos Da Guia, Nilton Santos; Didi, Di Stéfano; Garrincha, Pelé, Puskas, Cruyjff.

Second:

Banks; Djalma Santos, Bobby Moore, Jack Charlton, Marinho Chagas; Zizinho, Bobby Charlton; Stanley Matthews, Leônidas da Silva, Eusébio, Maradona.However (I hadn't even thought of that - AND NOW, TRIBUNE, I FEEL ABSOLUTELY JUSTIFIED IN MY CHOICE - having Bobby Moore and Jack Charlton in that second team is way more logical than having, lets say, Baresi & Bobby Moore in it, since they formed an undoubtedly brilliant central defense in the 1966 World Cup!...

Baresi and Bobby Moore would simply knock each other heads when Garrincha, Best or Zico invaded that box!...

And there you go, hiding behind your Jack Chrltn 'smoke curtain'! :rolleyes: ...

That's 'ludicrous', man...

[621380]

For you to see that Pelé's 'friendlies' were not always as 'friendly' (never were...) as many people try to put it! ;) ...

If The Negão did what he did be sure that in all that some 'guilt' Gieseman should have...

Remember the elbow in the throat Sosa got in the Brz x Uruguay 1970 WC semifinal? (everybody saw, even the referee, but he had no guts to send him off, first of all because it was Pelé, second, because Sosa had - with his conivence - spent the whole game 'spanking' him)...

Yeah, The King could be mean! :D ...

_____________________________________________________________________________________
PS: Of one thing you can be sure: if you 'own' a copy of that Brazil X Portugal, you'd better off also own an extra pair of glasses...You 'saw' a completely different game from what the rest of the world saw...

maybe in this game for pele it wasnt a friendly game at all...he was definitiv in one action the agressor with a brutal foul, breaking the shinebone of a opponent...i cant remember someome spanked him in this game..do you have resources for your suggestion or is your love for pele endless????willy schulz was peles defender in all this years in games between brasil and germany..schulz a hard defender where has frustrated pele from time to time, but not called a butcher..gieseman was a substitut for höttges in this game..he has played from minute 46 up to minute 87...so please ......

everbody is responcable for his action.. a superstar pele too....so please no excuses....

[sardus_pater]

There weren't any Europeans showing dribbling moves/skills in those days.


Bruno Conti.

[sardus_pater]

The reason some are prone to underrate Platini is that they tend to judge only pure skill, dribbling and attacking moves.
This way they miss most of Platini greatness.

He was a leader, ie he really carried his teams to the best effort they could. (Ronaldinho is not a leader)

He was a terrific playmaker (Ronaldinho is not)

He knew how to defend and win balls (Ronaldinho cannot compare)

He was consistent (Ronaldinho is not)

He was a brilliant goalscorer (Ronaldinho is good but not like Platini was)

Don't ever make the mistake of judging players' skill by only one (skill/tricks with the ball) of the various attributes making a player great.

Platini > Zidane.

[gmonn]

The reason some are prone to underrate Platini is that they tend to judge only pure skill, dribbling and attacking moves.
This way they miss most of Platini greatness.

He was a leader, ie he really carried his teams to the best effort they could. (Ronaldinho is not a leader)

He was a terrific playmaker (Ronaldinho is not)

He knew how to defend and win balls (Ronaldinho cannot compare)

He was consistent (Ronaldinho is not)

He was a brilliant goalscorer (Ronaldinho is good but not like Platini was)

Don't ever make the mistake of judging players' skill by only one (skill/tricks with the ball) of the various attributes making a player great.

Platini > Zidane.

You make it sound like all Ronaldinho has done is score a few goals and do a few tricks. Not a terrific playmaker? Have you been watching him? He's a brilliant passer for creating goals for others, from distances of 5 ft to 60 yds.
Tremendous vision and quickness of thought. He's also scored goals that Platini could only dream of. Ronaldinho provides moments of the greatest sublimity that also win big games. And which great offensive player is consistent for his career these days? Certainly Ronaldinho has won everything.

[babaorum]

There weren't any Europeans showing dribbling moves/skills in those days.



"L'Ange Vert" Dominique Rocheteau.

[sardus_pater]

You make it sound like all Ronaldinho has done is score a few goals and do a few tricks. Not a terrific playmaker? Have you been watching him? He's a brilliant passer for creating goals for others, from distances of 5 ft to 60 yds.
Tremendous vision and quickness of thought. He's also scored goals that Platini could only dream of. Ronaldinho provides moments of the greatest sublimity that also win big games. And which great offensive player is consistent for his career these days? Certainly Ronaldinho has won everything.

You didn't happen to see lots of Platini games, did you? I know Ronaldinho can assist yet he is not a playmaker.

He is not the best assistman/passer around also.

bHiv3JngHoU

[impalemeplz]

i can only imagine how many more assists platini would of had hitting them accurate long passes to a striker like thierry henry. i would put platini over zidane just for that reason in an alltime french team.

as for ronaldinho. i like to think of him as a glorified winger. i think he is somewhere between a 10 and 11.

[jpick]

You didn't happen to see lots of Platini games, did you? I know Ronaldinho can assist yet he is not a playmaker.

He is not the best assistman/passer around also.



totti and riquelme are better playmakers/assistmen than ronaldinho, imho, and i am a big fan of 'dinho, though he has other skills that are better than them, but from a playmaker perspective he ain't a good as those two.


as for platini i have tried to watch lots of highlights and torrents of him, as being under 30 it is hard for me to get a feel for him, but i think you are right, his goal-scoring instincts and passing were phenomenal, that is apparent even to me just watching a few games, even if his dribbling skills weren't the best.

[sardus_pater]

totti and riquelme are better playmakers/assistmen than ronaldinho, imho, and i am a big fan of 'dinho, though he has other skills that are better than them, but from a playmaker perspective he ain't a good as those two.


Agree. It's not like I am trying to say Ronaldinho is not a world class player. He's a phenomenal player, he just isn't as great and influential to his teams performances as Platini was.

Of course since I am 40 I had the fortune (and misfortune since I'd like to be 10-15 years younger ;)) to live the Platini era.
And the maradona era, and zico's one and van basten etc. etc.
All of them seen live at the stadium more than once when they were at the top.

[babaorum]

i can only imagine how many more assists platini would of had hitting them accurate long passes to a striker like thierry henry. i would put platini over zidane just for that reason in an alltime french team.



Platini was pretty unlucky to play with rather mediocre strikers in front of him (Rocheteau was very good but he played more as a winger).

Look at this great pass to Bellone (WC86 1/4 final vs Brazil) :

http://fr.youtube.com/watch?v=nJvJZyonxUM

It was a pretty hard situation but I think that with his pace Henry may have scored then (You should also notice that the GK was not red-carded !).

As I said above in this thread Platini succeeded to make 20 goal-assists in 72 caps for France despite playing with no world-class strikers (Bellone...). He did that whereas he was also the main goalscorer and whereas there were other great passers in the team (Giresse, Rocheteau, Tigana).