Comparing Forwards of the top 4 leagues in the world(Italy, England, Spain, Germany)

[soccerfan220]

I will compare the forwards in what are in my opinion the top 4 leagues in the world.
England:Shearer, Owen, Nilseterooy, Rebrov, Solskaer, Henry, Kanu, Bergkamp, Defoe, Heskey, Viduka, Diouf,Duff, Keane, Gudjonhnson, Hasslebaink, and Anelka.
Best: Henry
Spain: Denilson, Guti, Munitis, Tristan, Maakay, Luque, Raul, Morientes, Carew, Sanchez, Kluivert,
Saviola, Overmars, Morientes
Best: Raul
Germany: Armoruso, Ewerthon, Koller, Elber, Pizarro, Roque Santa Cruz, Neuville, Berbatov, Mpenza, Sand, Asamoah, Klose
Best: Elber
Italy: Shevshenko, Tomasson, Rivaldo, Inzaghi, Crespo, Claudio Lopez, Del Piero, Trezeguet, Salas, Totti, Batistuta, Montella, Di Vaio, Hakan Sukur, Adriano, Ronaldo, Vieri, Recoba
Best: Ronaldo
Overall-Best: Italian, English, Spanish, German
Feel free to add players and give your opinion.

[sparafucile2000]

You forgot Landon Donovan and Clint Mathis!!!!!

[Boro_lad]

no he didnt..he just never put them on :D

[soccerfan220]

OK, if I'm right, Donovan and Mathis both play in the MLS..... if i'm wrong correct me

[SportBoy321]

Originally posted by soccerfan220
I will compare the forwards in what are in my opinion the top 4 leagues in the world.
England:Shearer, Owen, Nilseterooy, Rebrov, Solskaer, Henry, Kanu, Bergkamp, Defoe, Heskey, Viduka, Diouf,Duff, Keane, Gudjonhnson, Hasslebaink, and Anelka.
Best: Henry
Spain: Denilson, Guti, Munitis, Tristan, Maakay, Luque, Raul, Morientes, Carew, Sanchez, Kluivert,
Saviola, Overmars, Morientes
Best: Raul
Germany: Armoruso, Ewerthon, Koller, Elber, Pizarro, Roque Santa Cruz, Neuville, Berbatov, Mpenza, Sand, Asamoah, Klose
Best: Elber
Italy: Shevshenko, Tomasson, Rivaldo, Inzaghi, Crespo, Claudio Lopez, Del Piero, Trezeguet, Salas, Totti, Batistuta, Montella, Di Vaio, Hakan Sukur, Adriano, Ronaldo, Vieri, Recoba
Best: Ronaldo
Overall-Best: Italian, English, Spanish, German
Feel free to add players and give your opinion.

Why did you only list the top 4 why not top 5 ?!?! You basically alienated all the French soccer fans by excluding them. 5 not 4 !!!!

[soccerfan220]

i said u can add things so u can do ur duty and add it but i'm to lazy.

[Shah]

Originally posted by SportBoy321


Why did you only list the top 4 why not top 5 ?!?! You basically alienated all the French soccer fans by excluding them. 5 not 4 !!!!

Truth be told our domestic league is not up to par with the EPL, Serie A, or La Liga. We are fairly close to the level of the Bundesliga however. But hey, he picks Henry as the top EPL striker, so he is giving us French fans a little bit of love.

[kaiser franz]

french liga is fairly close to the bundesliga?
so tell me: how many french teams made it to the finals of the uefa cup or champions league in the last ten years? France has some very good players, no doubt. But the french liga in no way can be compared to the bundesliga.

[Shah]

Originally posted by kaiser franz
french liga is fairly close to the bundesliga?
so tell me: how many french teams made it to the finals of the uefa cup or champions league in the last ten years? France has some very good players, no doubt. But the french liga in no way can be compared to the bundesliga.

Talk about dumb logic... first I wil answe the question

France has had two teams reach the UEFA Cup finals in the last ten years, Bordeaux in 96 and Marseille in 99. Dortmund had been twice runner up in this time period. Bayen won the cup in 96, while Schalke won it in 97. Not a huge difference.

Champions League we had Marseille win it 1993, and they reached the final in 91 (11 years, but same difference) in this same time span. German teams have won it twice, Munich did it two years ago, and Dortmund won it in 97. Bayern and Bayer Leverkusen have been each been runners up.

Now.. Bayern are far superior to most of the Bundesliga.. and as are Bayer Leverkusen. Your going off of European trophies proves one thing: Germans have an edge in european competition. It does not prove the strength of a league.

Turkish teams have won more UEFA cup's than French clubs. Does this mean the French league is worse than the Turkish league?

Look at the quality of imports in both the French and German leagues and see they are similar. You have Giovane Elber and Marcio Amoroso, we have Sonny Anderson and Ronaldinho Gaucho. You have Claudio Pizzaro, we have players like Martin Cardetti and Mario Yepes. So we each We bring in far more African talent and have some good south american imports. Virtually the whole Senegalese squad that took the World Cup by surprise was french based. You have Victor Agali, we have the likes of Henri Camara. Germany is able to keep more its home based stars and that is a plus, but that has not always been the case. True our French stars in the league tend to be younger, the likes of Cisse, Gouvou, Luylindula, Frau, Mexes and others. That does give your league and advantage.

Instead of counting trophies in Europe... tell me why the French Championnat is NOT fairly close to the Bundesliga. I concede the Bundesliga is better... but we are not belgium or portugal and your dismissve and arrogant response to my comparing our two leagues is frankly insulting to the standard of French domestic football.

I concede Bayern, and probably either Leverkusen or Dortmund are better than the Championnat.. but once you shave off the three most high profile clubs... you have a very similar standard of football.

Germany is not Italy, England or Spain and I would never compare France to those league.

[SportBoy321]

Shah you are so right. Maybe if the rules were the same for germany and france then france could keep their players on a comparable level to what germany does.

[kpaulson]

So instead of objective results in competition, you'd rather speculate?

Fine, but that's not much of a way to prove a point. You might call Sonny Anderson a comparable import to Elber, but after seeing Sonny struggle at Barca, I'm really not so sure.

But in any event, the depth of a league has always been difficult to measure. After all, we never have a UEFA Relegation Cup to judge whether Metz or St. Pauli is worse. Nor, sadly, do we have a UEFA Mid-table Cup (although the Inter-Toto might almost fill that calling-- and French teams have done ok, though notably with little success against the Big Four...)

So given, that we really don't have much in the way of comparing the bottom teams, comparing the top teams doesn't seem too bad. And, as much as it pains me to admit it, any league that has managed to put 3 different teams in the Champions League final in the recent past has at least some depth.

[soccerfan220]

Right, Kpaulson. A simple example of how the german league is better than the french, look at it htis way. The german star players( Ballack, Shneider, Deisler, Metzelder, Klose, Kahn, Linke) all stay in Germany, but the french national team stars, or most of them, go to better leagues for better competition( Robert, Zidane, Djorkaef, Petit, Thuram, Barthez, Henry, Trezeguet, Lizarazu) In fact, some players, like Lizarazu, go from the french league to the german, becasue they know they'll get better there.

[jd2084]

Originally posted by SportBoy321


Why did you only list the top 4 why not top 5 ?!?! You basically alienated all the French soccer fans by excluding them. 5 not 4 !!!!

FRANCE SUCKS!!!!

KOREA TEAM FIGHTING!!!

[bocatuna]

KOREA TEAM FIGHTING!!!


Sound's like a case of poor team spirit!

[thacharger]

Henry is NOT the best striker in England.

[soccerfan220]

ok he was top scorer last year. Who do you suggest is?

[jd2084]

Joe Max Moore - Best EPL Striker!!!

[Shah]

Originally posted by kpaulson
So instead of objective results in competition, you'd rather speculate?

Fine, but that's not much of a way to prove a point. You might call Sonny Anderson a comparable import to Elber, but after seeing Sonny struggle at Barca, I'm really not so sure.

But in any event, the depth of a league has always been difficult to measure. After all, we never have a UEFA Relegation Cup to judge whether Metz or St. Pauli is worse. Nor, sadly, do we have a UEFA Mid-table Cup (although the Inter-Toto might almost fill that calling-- and French teams have done ok, though notably with little success against the Big Four...)

So given, that we really don't have much in the way of comparing the bottom teams, comparing the top teams doesn't seem too bad. And, as much as it pains me to admit it, any league that has managed to put 3 different teams in the Champions League final in the recent past has at least some depth.

That is not what I said.. but that is not the sole barometer, and that leads to some skewed logic (like the idea that Turkey has better football than France). Lyon did eat Leverkusen last year btw.. and there is no way Elber would make it at Barca. Both Anderson and Elber are good strikers, but share a common history of being ignored by the Selecao. How bout comparing the likes of Pedro Pauletta with the best Bundesliga strikers or Ronaldinho.

France also did have the most teams in Europe last year because of teams we qualified through the Intertoto. We can ask Parma and Newcastle United just how bad French football was (because Lille and Troyes knocked them out of europe). In the past years we have had atleast one of the three Intertoto spots, and have beaten teams from the big 3 and from germany.

Germany definetly has depth among 3 clubs.. and is still better than the Championnat. But the gap is not as large as Kaiser Franz stated.

And remember tax laws, the bosman and other factors have dragged French football down since the early nineties. There was a time back then when the likes of PSG was whipping Real Madrid in the CL. French football is in transition and a club like Lyon is needed to brings us back up to a more elite level in European competition. With Marseille and PSG in turmoil in recent years, and Bordeaux also somewhat off the boil and our great team from the seventies, Saint Etienne a division too low.. we have seen smaller clubs like Auxerre and Lens rise up (although Lens have massive fan support which helps them while as auxerre does not). It will take a rising up of bigger clubs to elevate the french domestic game again.

[SportBoy321]

yeah since Lens play in a big stadium and have huge fan support I don't consider them to be a small club. They are one of the big boys in France.

[kpaulson]

Originally posted by Shah


That is not what I said.. but that is not the sole barometer, and that leads to some skewed logic (like the idea that Turkey has better football than France).
Fair enough-- it's not the sole barometer. But if you're not using results, what are you using?
And for what it's worth, Galatasaray probably has been better than any French team out there at times, as much as it pains me to admit it. But of course, the Turkish league is a joke.

France also did have the most teams in Europe last year because of teams we qualified through the Intertoto. We can ask Parma and Newcastle United just how bad French football was (because Lille and Troyes knocked them out of europe). Again, fair enough, but French victories over the Big Four are few and all the more memorable for that reason.


And remember tax laws, the bosman and other factors have dragged French football down since the early nineties. There was a time back then when the likes of PSG was whipping Real Madrid in the CL. French football is in transition and a club like Lyon is needed to brings us back up to a more elite level in European competition. Sure, but this is true for many countries. Eastern European teams also used to be competitive and the Dutch league was among the best. But the economics have changed over the past ten years and it's no longer the case. No one really knows how this latest wave of economic uncertainty will affect the clubs, but I think the clubs with the most European success will genearally do better than others-- and that happens to be the level on which French teams have not been as competitive.