Euro 2008- the seeding system

[johan neeskens]

You are totally overrating what a top seed means to the players and managers. There probably won't be a single player on the pitch in Germany on Wednesday night who will even know what Holland did earlier that evening. :cool:

You obviously haven't a clue about what the issues are that are currently being discussed in European football.

[BocaFan]

You obviously haven't a clue about what the issues are that are currently being discussed in European football.

:rolleyes:

Oh dear!

I'm not saying there isn't on-going discussion regarding the problems of the current seeding system. But to suggest Germany is selecting their starting lineuup and game strategy based on what Holland does earlier in the evening is a sad argument to make.

There's a reason that the Holland and Germany matches aren't kicking-off at the same time. It's because the matches have nothing to do with each other.

[wombacik]

Let's ask for opinion from someone from the second involved country - Germany. I don't expect anyone to confirm those speculations, however I hope the could share general feeling on that issue presented by media and supporters.

[Phase4Nightmare]

:rolleyes:

Oh dear!

I'm not saying there isn't on-going discussion regarding the problems of the current seeding system. But to suggest Germany is selecting their starting lineuup and game strategy based on what Holland does earlier in the evening is a sad argument to make.

There's a reason that the Holland and Germany matches aren't kicking-off at the same time. It's because the matches have nothing to do with each other.

We'll probably never know. Van Basten has stated that he will go for a win against Belarus.

But IF holland slips up, i'm sure Germany will have second thoughts about going all-out against the Welsh. If they are smart they will consider a draw, especially because there's nothing at stake and a favourable draw for the euro's is not something to underestimate.

[Borussia]

no you're wrong. if 2 nations have the same points, only the latest qualifier tournament counts. So, if Holland loses and Germany wins, Germany would be in pot 1 regardless of the actual results since they would be better in the Euro qualification.

Please don't tell that to Marco van Basten! ;)


We'll probably never know. Van Basten has stated that he will go for a win against Belarus.


That's a very good idea! :)


Btw: Did you notice how Romania & Croatia successfully managed to avoid pot A last Saturday? :-) So I wouldn't even have a slight hope of a Croatian victory at Wembley if I was Russian...

[BocaFan]

Croatia hadn't even qualified until Russia lost to Israel. So I highly doubt the Croats through that match away on purpose just to avoid pot "A".

[Lusankya]

But Croatia need a win vs England to stay in pot 1. (WC-Qual.)

[Borussia]

Croatia hadn't even qualified until Russia lost to Israel. So I highly doubt the Croats through that match away on purpose just to avoid pot "A".

You might be right ... but isn't it a little bit suspicious that they conceded both goals in a period when everyone knew the final result from Tel Aviv (the Croatia game started 1 our later)?

Ok, I admit that this speculation is a moot point though...

[catenaccio_L'pool]

no you're wrong. if 2 nations have the same points, only the latest qualifier tournament counts. So, if Holland loses and Germany wins, Germany would be in pot 1 regardless of the actual results since they would be better in the Euro qualification.
If I were Germany, I'd rather be in pot 2...that way you can draw Greece, Switzerland or Austria rather than Croatia, Holland or Czech R - easier draw IMO

[Phase4Nightmare]

All i know is that i can't back Belarus for more than 4/1 with any bookie. Far too short-priced if you ask me. So even the bookies have suspicions...

[BocaFan]

All i know is that i can't back Belarus for more than 4/1 with any bookie. Far too short-priced if you ask me. So even the bookies have suspicions...

That's because Holland already qualified.

Obviously teams who already qualified aren't gonna be as heavy a favorite as they normally would be, especially when they aren't at home. Croatia are 8/1 to beat England. Guess why....

Come on guys, this isn't rocket science!

[johan neeskens]

Let's ask for opinion from someone from the second involved country - Germany. I don't expect anyone to confirm those speculations, however I hope the could share general feeling on that issue presented by media and supporters.

The German FA has officially asked questions of UEFA about this. I can provide a link if you want.

[johan neeskens]

But Croatia need a win vs England to stay in pot 1. (WC-Qual.)

This admittedly changes things somewhat as the FIFA ranking alone will determine who the seeds are for WC qualifying. Doesn't affect Holland as they're steadily in the top eight European nations, but does affect England and Croatia.

[BocaFan]

The German FA has officially asked questions of UEFA about this. I can provide a link if you want.

Provide it to someone who cares.

You're talking about something completely different here (ie are the national FAs complaining about the seeding formula). We are talking about whether Germany will eye the Holland score and adjust their strategy should Holland lose.

Try to keep up. :cool:

[Ebbelwoi]

Loew said he wants to win regardless if Holland wins or loses. But the players don't always do what Loew wants (he also wanted to win against the Czech at home ;)).

It would be really interesting to see what happens if Holland lost. I think they would still go for a win but maybe try a little bit less harder. Against teams like the Czech that means you're doomed but against a team like Wales it should still be a win. After all, players still have to fight for their position in the team and you don't want to disappoint a 48k audience either. ;)

[nido33]

Croatia hadn't even qualified until Russia lost to Israel. So I highly doubt the Croats through that match away on purpose just to avoid pot "A".
croatia knew they qualified at halftime when the israel russia game was over. macedonians scored in 71' and 79' minute i think.

[Sagy]

Wow, can you imagine:

Netherlands
Italy
Portugal
France

Three of the WC semifinalists plus Holland. I don't think the Euros have ever had a a group as tough as this.

And there's a 99% chance we won't see a group that tough this time either.

Actually, if the pots are as listed by wombacik then Netherlands has a 50% chance of getting Italy or Germany, 50% of getting Portugal or England and 50% chance of getting France or Spain. Overall 1 in 8 chance "a group that tough this time". Considering how some of the other teams are playing the chances of "a group that tough this time" (minus the "name") is higher (probably closer to 1 in 4).

[johan neeskens]

Loew said he wants to win regardless if Holland wins or loses. But the players don't always do what Loew wants (he also wanted to win against the Czech at home ;)).

It would be really interesting to see what happens if Holland lost. I think they would still go for a win but maybe try a little bit less harder. Against teams like the Czech that means you're doomed but against a team like Wales it should still be a win. After all, players still have to fight for their position in the team and you don't want to disappoint a 48k audience either. ;)

Looks like Sneijder's not playing tonight, Van Nistelrooy and Seedorf had already gone home, and Robben and Van Persie are of course injured. It's pretty clear that this isn't a normal qualifier; nowhere near Holland's best starting XI. Van Basten has repeatedly said however that he wants to be a no. 1 seed because the no. 1 seeds play all of their group games in one and the same stadium, which means they don't have to travel from one stadium to the next and one training camp to the next.

The players seem divided on the issue. Kuyt loves the idea of being in a very strong group, for example, whereas Sneijder prefers to start against weaker opposition. So we'll see what happens tonight.

[johan neeskens]

Provide it to someone who cares.

You're talking about something completely different here (ie are the national FAs complaining about the seeding formula). We are talking about whether Germany will eye the Holland score and adjust their strategy should Holland lose.

Try to keep up. :cool:

It's funny how you seem to think that it's in Germany's hands somehow. Which is hardly surprising seeing that you've already shown yourself to be a Holland-hater (I'm sure the Holland haters on this board have formed a social club, ask Nicephoras if you're allowed to join)

[johan neeskens]

http://www.bild.t-online.de/BTO/sport/2007/11/21/hollaender-schummelei/lostopf-euro,geo=3015040.html

German 'newspaper' (ahem) Bild claims that the disgraceful Dutch will intentionally lose tonight's game to screw over Germany. Bless!