Euro 2008- the seeding system

[Sand im Kopf]

Hehehe. Read up on Holland's Euro performance over the past 20 years mate. And compare it to Switzerland's.
Holland: 1x champions, 3x semi-final 1x quarter-final
Hosts: 1x final, 4x semi-final

Switzerland used to be a minnow, but is a reasonably strong second tier team right now.
I think Holland is stronger than Switzerland at home, even with van Basten, but suggesting otherwise is certainly not as ridiculous as you make it to be.

[BocaFan]

1- Sept-2001 Basel Switzerland 1-2 Yugoslavia

(Switzerland's last defeat at home)

[johan neeskens]

Holland: 1x champions, 3x semi-final 1x quarter-final
Hosts: 1x final, 4x semi-final

Switzerland used to be a minnow, but is a reasonably strong second tier team right now.
I think Holland is stronger than Switzerland at home, even with van Basten, but suggesting otherwise is certainly not as ridiculous as you make it to be.

What Boca is sugesting is that if a manager had to pick who to play against between Holland or Switzerland, it wouldn't make a difference. That in my view is a ridiculous statement.

It's the same old story. Before the start of a tournament no-one rates the Dutch, then after failing to win the tournament, the very same people who didn't rate us before label us as underachievers. Make up your mind FFS.

[96Squig]

I think the Dutch will make it to the quarter finals... nothing more, nothing less. Usually they are better than the Swiss, but this Swiss side is hard to estimate due to playing at home, so if the Swiss win I won't be surprised. Still the Dutch would be favourites.

[johan neeskens]

I think the Dutch will make it to the quarter finals... nothing more, nothing less. Usually they are better than the Swiss, but this Swiss side is hard to estimate due to playing at home, so if the Swiss win I won't be surprised. Still the Dutch would be favourites.

That's fair enough. At the most recent poll, less than 5% of the Dutch population thought Holland would win Euro 2008. Mostly because we think Van Basten is a complete and utter idiot of a manager. We do believe we have very good players though.

I personally think we'll get to the semis again. With ugly football.

[smithfan]

One should never underestimate the Dutch...That's clear. I would rather play the Swiss at home, than the Dutch directly at the beginning of the tournament.

[Edgar]

Update -> EURO 2008 (http://blog.sport365.ro/eduard_ranghiuc/2007/10/15/euro-2008-situatia-la-zi-9/).

[Borussia]

Yah, being first seed is a curse in this Euro.

3 massive teams in one group.


Would be a DÈJÀ VU for us Germans ... so nothing can shock us anymore! ;)
In 1996 and 2000 there were even 4 massive teams in one group...


1996: Germany/Italy/Czech Republic/Russia
2000: Germany/England/Portugal/Romania
2004: Germany/Holland/Czech Republic/Latvia


Wow, I can read Romanian.

Me too. :cool:;)


I think everyone is in agreement that the Euro groups are tougher than World Cup groups on average.


Definitely.


The Dutchman is right. That is why I wouldn't be very sad if we lose some points in our upcoming Euro qualification matches.

Let's lose the 3 last games now! :-) Do you think it would be an embarrassment to lose at home to Cyprus? :-)


Hehehe. Read up on Holland's Euro performance over the past 20 years mate. And compare it to Switzerland's.

I know what you mean. Nevertheless, I wouldn't be keen on playing Switzerland (who nearby has become a very decent team lately) in front of their own crowd...

[johan neeskens]

I read that German NT management is complaining about the system to UEFA now. It really isn't fair, I mean you're punished for doing well in qualifying, basically.

Meanwhile we've conveniently lost to Romania. See there was a logic behind that loss (JOKING)

[Borussia]

It's the same old story. Before the start of a tournament no-one rates the Dutch

Who told you that?


Meanwhile we've conveniently lost to Romania. See there was a logic behind that loss (JOKING)

The Bulgarians will kill you! :p:D

[johan neeskens]

Who told you that?




The Bulgarians will kill you! :p:D

Just look at this thread, apparently there's people who think Holland are of the same quality as Switzerland and Austria! Those same people will be the very first to accuse the Dutch of underperforming if we don't get past the semis, mark my words.

Bulgaria still has to play Romania, whereas we've only got to play against the minnows now. Holland will qualify fairly easily I reckon.

[Borussia]

Hey Mrs. Neeskens, I think you got it wrong regarding my comment about the Bulgarians...;)

And I don't think anybody doubts that Holland has a better quality than Switzerland. It's only about the fact that playing the Swiss on their home soil (look at their home record) is probably as tough as facing a team like Holland, Germany, Italy, France or England in a neutral venue!

[BocaFan]

Would be a DÈJÀ VU for us Germans ... so nothing can shock us anymore! ;)
In 1996 and 2000 there were even 4 massive teams in one group...

1996: Germany/Italy/Czech Republic/Russia
2000: Germany/England/Portugal/Romania
2004: Germany/Holland/Czech Republic/Latvia



I don't know if I would consider Romania massive. Or even the 2000 England team for that matter. Holland was definitely in the group of death for that tournament!

[BocaFan]

Just look at this thread, apparently there's people who think Holland are of the same quality as Switzerland and Austria!


You're totally misquoting me.

It's amazing how offended you get by someone suggesting Switzerland could be tough to beat at home. :rolleyes:

[Hrvat]

I don't see the reason why both the hosts and the defending champion would be privileged. Protecting hosts makes sense in sports like basketball (where the attendance depends a lot on how the host is doing) but in football it's all the same (the stadiums were full even though Belgium went out early in 2000). I believe this seeding system is unfair just like with the defending champion. Don't really know why they have to be in pot 1 automatically.

[smithfan]

well it's too late to change it anyway. Holland lost unfortunately, while we Germans drew with Ireland. I think it's clear the first pot will be Greece, Switzerland, Austria (:D), Germany

[BocaFan]

:confused: I don't know how you arrived at that conclusion. All it takes is for Germany to draw the Czechs on Wednesday and both Croatia and Holland will pass them in the coefficient rankings.

[Icarus_222]

I think everyone is in agreement that the Euro groups are tougher than World Cup groups on average. The debate around this forum has been mostly centered on which tournament is tougher to win.

The answer to your question is that it is easier to do well in the World Cup, but perhaps harder to win the Euro.

[smithfan]

:confused: I don't know how you arrived at that conclusion. All it takes is for Germany to draw the Czechs on Wednesday and both Croatia and Holland will pass them in the coefficient rankings.

hmm...really?

Well that of course would be good and should be possible since we're playing with a "b" squad on wednesday ;)

[BocaFan]

hmm...really?

Well that of course would be good and should be possible since we're playing with a "b" squad on wednesday ;)

Yeah, if you go to the link provided in the first post of this thread you'll see that Germany's coefficient will drop to 2.4 if they draw the Czechs (2.3 if they lose). That would be enough to see them fall at least 2 places.

If this happens, then the draw will probably produce more balanced groups. The pot with the big "1" on it will just serve as a pseudo #3 pot, while the real #1 pot will have a big "2" on the front of it. ;)