View Full Version : Redbulls vs United - Altidore Not Fouled?
intechpc
22 Jul 2007, 08:42 PM
Did anyone see the NY Redbulls vs DC United match today. In the 16th minute Josie Altidore is tripped inside the DC United PA but no foul or penalty is given. Just curious what your thoughts are as to why a PK was not forthcoming here. To me this looks like a horribly easy call to make and failing to do so is putting your game management at risk early on. Your thoughts?
Here are the replays (the live action shot was in a reduced screen so I've not included it here):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PBD1g3DHYFs
Funkfoot
22 Jul 2007, 08:44 PM
I thought he didn't get the call because he embellished. How about the non-PK call when Fred got his shirt halfway torn off?
Devil500
22 Jul 2007, 08:44 PM
PK he put his foot in..
John_Harkes_6
22 Jul 2007, 08:45 PM
Because it was Abbe - why the hell was a PK not called when Fred has his jersey torn off him in the box going for the Gomez free kick?
Rufusabc
22 Jul 2007, 09:55 PM
Wow...and I didnt even think he embellished it...point to the spot and let's move on....I would love to look at it live too, but the CR appears to be looking at it straight away, and not any any angle.
Rog
Tarheel Ref
22 Jul 2007, 11:07 PM
PK no problem no embellishment from my view
intechpc
22 Jul 2007, 11:25 PM
Well I do agree about the foul on Freddie I didn't bring that one up because there was considerably more traffic and I will give the referee the benefit of the doubt that maybe he just didn't see it happen. The foul on Altidore is a 1 on 1 at the top of the PA with a wide open view from the ref to the play. I don't know how it gets missed.
To me this is indicative of a referee that's afraid to give a PK, one of my biggest pet peeves. To me, failing to give a PK when one is deserved leads to all sorts of game management issues. You lose credibility with the team that was fouled, you've also set a precedent for the level of fouls that can be committed in the PA. God help you if later the same type of foul occurs at the other end and you give the PK. I'm curious how much the timing of this foul had to do with the non-call (i.e. did he not want to give a PK so early in the match).
Sagy
22 Jul 2007, 11:50 PM
http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q49/BigSoccer/NY-DC.jpg
It is a clear trip.
It is in the box.
The view is unobstructed.
==> Clear PK.
It might even be a late challenge.
==> Possible YC for the defender.
If the CR thinks that the attacker embellished after the trip, give him a YC after calling the PK.
Let's just say that somehow the CR and the AR didn't see the trip. How does one explains not giving the attacker a YC for diving?
KMJvet
23 Jul 2007, 12:33 AM
He is the weakest ref in MLS IMO and has been for awhile. Too slow and never near the action unless it comes to him.
jacoismyhero
23 Jul 2007, 01:09 AM
That's a hard-whistle PK and definitely a booking. At any point in the game that's a caution. In this instance especially, cautioning him early sends a clear message to everyone on the field.
law5guy
23 Jul 2007, 10:22 AM
PK for me.
MLS.com didn't include that, or when Fred's jersey was torn in their highlight video. lol
JayDelight729
23 Jul 2007, 10:28 AM
PK's are rarely called during free kicks. Too much traffic in the box. I also think there is an unwritten rule to allow more things on those types of plays.
But the Altidore incident was a 1 on 1 isolated opportunity. I was right behind that goal in the first row and couldn't believe it wasn't called. The defender was beaten and Altidore would have had a clear shot at goal if not taken down.
PK.
Funkfoot
23 Jul 2007, 12:02 PM
I thought it should be a penalty, too. But I agree with the announcers that, because he fell so spectacularly, the attacking player convinced the ref that it was a dive.
Well, really, who knows what Abbey was thinking?
MassachusettsRef
23 Jul 2007, 12:08 PM
To me this is indicative of a referee that's afraid to give a PK, one of my biggest pet peeves.I'd be careful here. It's one thing to say that, upon replay, you think a fellow referee got a decision wrong. Top referees admit all the time that they may have missed something and nobody is perfect.
It's another thing to impugn a National Referee and accuse him of being "afraid to give a PK."
KMJvet
23 Jul 2007, 12:47 PM
It's another thing to impugn a National Referee and accuse him of being "afraid to give a PK."
I don't personally think AO's problem has ever been fear as much as
1) slowness and being out of position far too often
2) erring really far over generally on the side of letting lots of things go, not just PK's, as his way of not imposing on the game.
intechpc
23 Jul 2007, 01:22 PM
I'd be careful here. It's one thing to say that, upon replay, you think a fellow referee got a decision wrong. Top referees admit all the time that they may have missed something and nobody is perfect.
It's another thing to impugn a National Referee and accuse him of being "afraid to give a PK."
Your point is well taken. Maybe a better way to state it would be reluctant to give a PK. Perhaps he did just miss it or perhaps he thought it was minimal contact not warranting a foul. But all too often I've seen referees at all levels who are reluctant to give PK's, especially early in the game, and it leads to a loss of game control. I mean honestly I have to ask myself here, did this non-call lead in some way to the uncalled foul later on Freddie (as well as a number of cautions and even a send-off later in the match)?
In the end, I'm not criticizing the individual referee so much as the path of logic that I believe he used that I've seen echoed in many referees. Obviously Mr. Okulaja has been at this much longer than I have, but I'm trying to reconcile this in my own mind.
lmorin
24 Jul 2007, 08:48 AM
My take was that the ref decided the trip, for that is what it was, was trifling because Altidore had lost the ball. His dribble was way too long, then he was tripped. Not hard or dangerous. Personally, I would have called the trip.
FIFARay007
24 Jul 2007, 09:14 AM
I was at the game, and that youtube clip confirmed what they dared not replay on the screens. I sit at midfield and even I thought it was obvious.
I've never liked that ref, not many have. Funniest thing I remember was him calling a game a few years back and one of the Metro defenders cleared the ball out of the box, but instead the ball hit Abbe right in the head, went down like a sack of potatoes. The crowd cheered. :D
GlennAA11
24 Jul 2007, 11:18 AM
I have to say when I first saw it my instinct was that Altidore played the ball way too far away from himself and then fell over Vanney in order to try and buy a PK. Altidore flops way too much for such a big guy so maybe he is getting a rep. Just like Jaime Moreno almost never gets a call because he has a reputation that goes back 10 years. But after seeing the replay it looks more like a PK to me.
I am always surprised when I see that AO has been assigned to another game in MLS as he always seems to be out of position and never seems to really have control of a game. But then again Tim Weyland and his white sneakers keep getting assigned too, so I suppose I shouldn't be surprised by anything anymore.
FIFARay007
24 Jul 2007, 11:26 AM
I have to say when I first saw it my instinct was that Altidore played the ball way too far away from himself and then fell over Vanney in order to try and buy a PK. Altidore flops way too much for such a big guy so maybe he is getting a rep. Just like Jaime Moreno almost never gets a call because he has a reputation that goes back 10 years. But after seeing the replay it looks more like a PK to me.
I am always surprised when I see that AO has been assigned to another game in MLS as he always seems to be out of position and never seems to really have control of a game. But then again Tim Weyland and his white sneakers keep getting assigned too, so I suppose I shouldn't be surprised by anything anymore.
Yea, especially like Lindsay Lohan getting arrested again for DUI and coke possession. :D