Scoring goals 101

[ballso]

I would like to hear from anybody on their ideals of how to score goals when the ball is on the offensive half of the field. Example: corner kicks, set plays, what to do when the ball is past midfield. Maybe we rate a top ten list and send it to FC and John Murphy. Looks like they could use some help.

[scheck]

I would consider it insulting more than helpful if I were in their position.

[ballso]

I've have just been reading about all the negative stuff (with all due respect) about Fernando and John and every reason to fire them but no real solutions/answers to the lack of offense the Rapids are showing every game. If any of you readers have a clue on how to score a goal other than just 'give me a real striker', or 'fire the coaches', or 'I'm fed up with the lack of offense', feel free to share.

[RapidStorm]

It would be funny if the thread creator was a sock-puppet for Clavijo or Murphy.

My money's on Dino though :D

[jdonnici]

I've have just been reading about all the negative stuff (with all due respect) about Fernando and John and every reason to fire them but no real solutions/answers to the lack of offense the Rapids are showing every game. If any of you readers have a clue on how to score a goal other than just 'give me a real striker', or 'fire the coaches', or 'I'm fed up with the lack of offense', feel free to share.

Dear Nico,

My suggestion would be that when you find the ball at your feet and you're near the other team's goal, you should shoot the ball. Now, I don't hold an A level coaching license, but I do know that the ball has to get from your feet into the net somehow. And as I tell the youth teams I've coached, dribbling the ball is NOT the quickest way to move the ball up the field.

Of course, I'm assuming here that your compensation plan, along with the comp plans for Colin and Conor, is not based on:


Number of goals scored via dribbling through the frame on your own;
Number of touches made before carelessly turning over the ball (i.e., a Kirovski clause).

Let me know if you have any questions.

jdonnici

[Centennial]

Maybe if they just shot the ball on frame, that would be a start.

[chilistrider]

I heard today's practice consisted mostly of soccer tennis. Is that a start? :cool:

[Deep Wilcox]

One idea I had was some of our players could run into dangerous attacking positions even when they DONT HAVE THE BALL!!!! Just a crazy idea I had.

I am right now watching the Revs and Ralston just swung a cross in from the right. Attacking players made a near post run, a run toward the middle of the six (Twellman who missed the header) and a far post run. Additionally two midfielders made timed runs and trailed the play looking for rebounds. (Ralston got the ball back and hit the post).

Or we could just knock 50 yd balls up to a single forward (who is likely offside) and hope that he beats 4 guys on the dribble. You know, because we don't have the personell, I guess, to make runs off the ball or something.:rolleyes:

[Centennial]

One idea I had was some of our players could run into dangerous attacking positions even when they DONT HAVE THE BALL!!!! Just a crazy idea I had.


That would mean the attacking players would have to anticipate the pass rather than running into a more defensive stance when they are in the 18.

What a concept.

[Arsenal Marshy]

They really need to just get the ball down and pass it. No messing around with 20 or so touches, pass and move stuff is the only effective way. I play for a side over here and the difference since we started concentrating on moving into space and taking 1 or 2 touches is unreal. No-one can touch you when you're playing that quick. But please oh please when it gets to the 18 yard box (or penalty area or whatever we're supposed to cal it now) you need to start taking some shots! Arsenals downfall last season was not getting enough shots off!

[FutbolCrazy]

The simplest solution is to fire Clavijo now. He was a defender, for Crapids sake.

[prk166]

I've have just been reading about all the negative stuff (with all due respect) about Fernando and John and every reason to fire them but no real solutions/answers to the lack of offense the Rapids are showing every game. If any of you readers have a clue on how to score a goal other than just 'give me a real striker', or 'fire the coaches', or 'I'm fed up with the lack of offense', feel free to share.

Other than just...???? Are you saying that if we are not better coaches that we can't complain? Are only those who are as good or better than Picasso allowed to express their dislike / like for his work? If I'm a stock holder in a company and unhappy about it's stock's lack of upward movement am I only allowed to express my desire for change if I have a detailed plan for how the company can close stores, stream line operations, outsource tasks, what internal processes to beef up, what new products to sell and such? Maybe you didn't realize it but, at least to me, you seem to implying that without detailed knowledge of the players skills, a a-level license, experience playing as a pro, and other things required to answer this question that we can't complain. I don't have a degree in art history but it doesn't stop me from enjoying art or, on occasion, calling it crap. And I don't have a fancy pro background with decades of training in soccer but I still enjoy some it's finer points. Unfortunately all too often the soccer I go to see has been crap.

[askum33]

I have an easy one for this team straight out of the gates.

Have a man run far post.
Clarke did a decent job with this last game (and the game before), but those that have normally played left have not been at the "backdoor" position to cover a cross that might go long, or *gasp* be there to stretch the defence.
If there was a man that would be stationed at the far post, then we could have a more effective game to the top of the box in the middle where chances could be created. You know, one touch vollies, screen passes to top of the box shots - just more over all confusion for their keeper that could generate more chaos leading to goals for us.
The other alternative is that the left side defender has to be confident enough to come forward in an attacking situation and provide numbers by covering that far post. Admittingly, I do not think Prediux(sp?) is athletic enough or confident enough (right now) to play this way.

And please stop with the FC was a defender so he can't think offensively. This kind of a statement is simply shallow rhetoric. There have been pleanty of coaches that were defensive/goalies that had offensive minded teams.

And please don't read this as a defense of FC, cuz' I really want him gone too.

[askum33]

Other than just...???? Are you saying that if we are not better coaches that we can't complain? Are only those who are as good or better than Picasso allowed to express their dislike / like for his work? If I'm a stock holder in a company and unhappy about it's stock's lack of upward movement am I only allowed to express my desire for change if I have a detailed plan for how the company can close stores, stream line operations, outsource tasks, what internal processes to beef up, what new products to sell and such? Maybe you didn't realize it but, at least to me, you seem to implying that without detailed knowledge of the players skills, a a-level license, experience playing as a pro, and other things required to answer this question that we can't complain. I don't have a degree in art history but it doesn't stop me from enjoying art or, on occasion, calling it crap. And I don't have a fancy pro background with decades of training in soccer but I still enjoy some it's finer points. Unfortunately all too often the soccer I go to see has been crap.


PRK, although I agree with the sentiment of your post, this is an interesting discussion to have.

It also validates something for lurkers and discuss-ers alike.
Simply stated, it validates the idea that if people are going to complain then they should pose an alternative to the situation.
We all know that all of this discussion is going to fall by the wayside and never be heard, but this is a kind of mental exercise that can help us understand what kind of coach one could be.

Look, Clavijo is going to do what he wants anyway. But here, we can have a hypothetical conversation pointing out the finer details of how this team could tactically improve.

To play devil's advocate for just a second, I see plenty of people calling for FC's head or saying that the team is crap without discussing the "Xs" and "Os" as to what should or could be done. The constant bombardment of "score more!" or "take more shots" gets a little tired. So let's step it up a notch and pretend this is a verbal Pro Evolution Soccer game, FIFA, or other football manager game and have some fun with it.

Hell, here there are no right or wrong answers, just answers that could be contemplated and discussed to pass the time.

That's my approach to this thread.

[Centennial]

The simplest solution is to fire Clavijo now. He was a defender, for Crapids sake.

That explains why he has his Goal keeper coach running offensive drills.:eek:

[chilistrider]

What if the thread title were "Scoring 101 goals"? How many seasons would that take? :o

[Ingmar4Rapids]

I've have just been reading about all the negative stuff (with all due respect) about Fernando and John and every reason to fire them but no real solutions/answers to the lack of offense the Rapids are showing every game. If any of you readers have a clue on how to score a goal other than just 'give me a real striker', or 'fire the coaches', or 'I'm fed up with the lack of offense', feel free to share.

What's the line from A League of their own, something like "if it were easy, anyone could do it." That is why I pay money to see it. When soccer is well played with a quick flow offense, it is the most beautiful sport in the world. The reason that I work for an insurance company is that I am not Arsene Venger or Samuel Eto'o. Scoring is not my job. Beautiful attractive soccer is not my job. I am a paying customer. I can tell you that we lack strikers who turn and shoot in the run of play. I can complain about accuracy because they hardly get a good shot off. They all seem to want five touches like they are playing against kids who have never defended a pro before. I have seen enough soccer to know this never works. In La Liga, defenders have taken to waiting for Ronaldinho to mess with the ball a little before calmly poking it away. I can tell you that the only reliable service that they get is from Cooke, but those crosses aren't really going to any players with a consistent record of heading them in. I can tell you that we lack midfielders who make decisive passes up field on the fly. Every thing is side pass, back pass, probing short pass until Cooke makes a run lobs one in. That could be because we don't have the guys with tactical ability in the midfield or that the strikers do not know how to show for the ball with good runs or that the coach wants an overly deliberate, conservative yet boring and ineffective play in the midfield. I really don't know what is the real combination is. It takes a good coach with the right players to fix it. That much I can tell you. I am sorry, whoever's mom you are. My mom probably wanted me to be rich but alas the last Wal Mart heiress was taken. Not everyone has the skill or ability to be a successful coach. I hope your son gets a good new job.

[askum33]

What if the thread title were "Scoring 101 goals"? How many seasons would that take? :o

Based on 2006 stats...

2.80555555555555555555555555555555555555555555555555556

Seasons. If we started our tally at the begining of this season. But remember we have a big 13 goals this season!

[Deep Wilcox]

PRK, although I agree with the sentiment of your post, this is an interesting discussion to have.

It also validates something for lurkers and discuss-ers alike.
Simply stated, it validates the idea that if people are going to complain then they should pose an alternative to the situation.
We all know that all of this discussion is going to fall by the wayside and never be heard, but this is a kind of mental exercise that can help us understand what kind of coach one could be.

Look, Clavijo is going to do what he wants anyway. But here, we can have a hypothetical conversation pointing out the finer details of how this team could tactically improve.

To play devil's advocate for just a second, I see plenty of people calling for FC's head or saying that the team is crap without discussing the "Xs" and "Os" as to what should or could be done. The constant bombardment of "score more!" or "take more shots" gets a little tired. So let's step it up a notch and pretend this is a verbal Pro Evolution Soccer game, FIFA, or other football manager game and have some fun with it.



I think Clavijo needs to go, partially under the theory that "you can't fire all the players" and partially under the theory the team is playing poorly and he is the maestro.....

I am happy to talk "x's and o's" as it applies to the Rapids. They have so many issues so I will just very lightly touch on a few, starting in the back.

Bouna is fine, a little unorthodox but a nice shot stopper.

The back four; let's say Gargan, Ugo, Erpen, Prideaux don't add to the attack. We generally have no width on the left side with Prideaux and Niko in front of Prideaux on the left. Trading Vanney was a catastrophe. FC practically wets himself whenver Gargan goes forward on the right and Cooke is just insulted by a teammate in "his" channel if Gargan tries to overlap.

A mf of let's say Pablo, Kyle, Niko, JK, Cooke (a 4-5-1 where maybe JK is a withdrawn forward). Pablo and Kyle are redundant, JK and Niko have no work rate or pace, and Cooke is a nice 'winger' who whips in a lot of nice crosses to nobody. If I were the opposing coach I would tell my left back to just force Cooke outside and let him cross it. The opposing team has superiority in numbres in the box and the GK gets to use his hands... It would be nice if Cooke could cut the ball inside on the run and then the push it behind the opposing left back to an overlapping outside back, but this doesn't seem to part of the plan.

Up top take your pick: Herc, Connor, Browne, Peterson. Anyone of them on an island, by his lonesome, surrounded by 3 defenders. Connor Casey simply cannot be as bad as he looks on this team, it has to be the circumstances he is in.

We also don't score on set pieces. Vanney had a rocket of a FK, but he is gone and he didn't get to take them when he was here... so, anyway... tried to keep it short. Hate to complain, but this is a mess.

[ballso]

Thanks for all who have shared so far. My point of this thread was to get more information from the minds of the passionate fans you all are. I have spent the last 2 weeks reading most past threads from the past 6 months and just want you to open the part of the brain that talks about the offense that you truly desire to see in a club and what that would entail on a play by play look. (Well stated by askum 33, this is just conversation).

As for prk166, vent all you want. That is what this is. Conversation. As we all know that, it is good for the soul. I didn't spend a $1,000 dollars on 4 season tickets to see what I am seeing game in and game out. But I tell you I will still support most of the players (that's another thread), but not so much for the coaching staff.

As for Ingmar4Rapids, yes, when soccer is played with a quick flow offense it is the most dynamic and beautiful sport in the world (excuse me, goosebumps). OK, better now. My point exactly (hence this thread).

A prime example was at 4th of July. The crowd couldn't even do the wave around the stadium. They have been lulled asleep (with dippin dot's, yum) (J/K) by the style of coaching/playing. Defensive possession soccer. The only time the whole 15,000 fans (that were still at the game) stood up all at one time and cheered was the three man breakaway later in the second half. The down right, in your face attack is how the game should be played. This may seem like a logical/unlogical way to coach/play soccer to some but for the GAME's sake and the FANS sake, it must be the way.
Those 4 season tickets I talked about earlier. Only 1 gets used every game, (my seat). I bought 4 with the hopes that friends/coworkers, and anybody for that matter would like to see the new stadium and/or a soccer match. People deny my free tickets to them every week on the sole basis that soccer is BORING!!! As a player/coach and fan that is sad to me.
Until the FO and/or the coaching staff realize this is the case, DSGP will forever have that stigma of (BORING!!!). It is up to the FO/coaches/players and fans to make that change. Thanks.